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Youngest Daughter in bits on phone - advice please

463 replies

Icecreamlover63 · 22/01/2022 14:54

My Youngest Daughter has just been on the phone and is extremely upset. I have seen this coming for some time but i cannot say anything about peoples relationships however i would appreciate some advice.
In 2019 my daughter was engaged and found out that her then fiancée had spent £3 on gambling in six months. He promised he would not do this again was so very repentant and she forgave hi.
In very early 2020 they got married. They moved into military housing about 8 miles away and appeared very happy.
Then they got transferred to Wiltshire and my daughter got a job at a local hospital and promptly made lots of friends and loved her new job. She joined a gym and lost some weight and was looking amazing.
Her husband's, Mother came over in October 2021 and was furious as she had just had a phone call completely out of the blue. It was the bank informing her that her sons account was overdrawn by £600. (when her son went to Afghanistan she had to have access to his accounts in case he died) and she had forgotten all about it.
The account was overdrawn because of 2 large bets of £500 each.
My daughter again lost her temper and he promised never to do it again.
Just before Christmas he took £500 out of their joint account to pay his friend as apparently he had bailiffs at the door. Then he took another £250 out a one of his friends could not see his children. My daughter said can you give those two friends the account number for our joint account so they can pay it back into the account it came out of. Guess what he said he wouldn't and said they money was going back into his sole account.
He has not spoken to my daughter most evenings and only watches football on sky. He refuses to go out at all in January and has ben very rude to her on lots of occasions.
Basically she has had enough of the gambling and the lies and just basically being ignored.

Fast forward to today!! She has just gone back to collect some of her bits and he started screaming at her and saying she was sneaky moving half of the money into her savings account before she had even spoken to him. She moved it this morning as she did not want him to be reckless and bet it away. He then started to blame her for having mental health problems and that when she was at home she was unhappy (not true) and that he had to speak to welfare in the Army to get married quarters early. They got their married quarters 3 weeks before they got married (which is the normal time line).
He has told her she always runs back to London when she is upset. Again not true she has been to us 4 times in 4 months and two of those times he was with her.

She is so upset and so distraught I honestly don't know what to do and she is driving back home now. I wish i could say she was right but I feel it would be wrong for me to say so. Please can you advise me what to do and also if you think she has made the right decision.
I do understand there is 2 sides to the story but my daughter has moved half way across the country and has not lied, she is devestated.

OP posts:
ChargingBuck · 26/01/2022 12:04

@Icecreamlover63

5 weeks and then homeward bound. I just feel if he contacts us for the moment we have to answer
have to ???

You don't.

See all the PP's posts after your previous update to this one.
You are enmeshed in the FOG.
Every time you engage with SiL, you are blinding yourself with FOG.
outofthefog.website/toolbox-1/2015/11/17/fog-fear-obligation-guilt

All you are doing when you respond is teaching him that he is able to control you. You owe him nothing. He is making DD's life a misery.
It's time to send a clear signal that you are not available to him as a resource in his campaign to get DD back.

Remember - this is not a young man who made a little mistake & is pining for his lost love.

This is the trained soldier who screamed in your DD's face, stole from her, lied to her, is badmouthing her around town, is trampling all over her "no contact" boundary & is looking to manipulate her parents.

He doesn't want her back because he's dying for love.
He wants her back as his emotional crutch & 'whipping boy'.
He wants her back because she is a useful prop is his presentation of himself as a regular married man - a tool to hide behind as his life unravels & his commanding officer etc start to wonder WTF is going on with one of their men.

He's been borrowing/stealing from comrades, remember. This shit is going to hit the fan sooner or later. You do not need to be party to it. You do not need to accept his calls or texts.

DD - if you are reading this too, & I hope you are - apologies for how harsh this all sounds. But YOU need to block your H now too.
It is no use telling him you want no contact.
He will pretend to agree, & ignore it.
You need to show him.

Also - what support is available to you as a military wife? Sorry for my ignorance, but if there is the equivalent of a 'Padre' for you, you should make an appointment.
It is beyond time that your H's workplace had a heads up about what has been going on, that you are currently living apart, & that your your request that H gives you space is being ignored.

As PP said - sunlight is the best disinfectant.
Keeping quiet out of embarrassment or misplaced loyalty is not helping you - it's not helping H either, who needs to come out of denial & start facing facts.

Icecreamlover63 · 26/01/2022 12:50

He has taken full responsibility he has told all our friends that it is all his fault! He has told them he is going to beat this addiction he has to change and then he intends to win her back.
I think once he realises that she is definitely not coming back he will sadly fall back to gambling. Every bone in my body hopes he doesn’t but he will be in a house on his own miles away from any friends and family it’s going to be so hard for him.

* [Edited by MNHQ to remove identifying info] * **

OP posts:
SamphiretheStickerist · 26/01/2022 12:55

Then he has told everyone that he has issues and she doesn't have to bother with that side of things. All she/you have to do is nod and say yes, things became untenable... that's it - untenable is a good word. Not all that usual, causes a small pause, and then peopple usually nod wisely and ask no more!

As for his situation, that is his to manage. He could have all sorts of support if he reached out properly. Not you - military, his family, GP etc.

SENSchoolDiaries · 26/01/2022 12:57

@Icecreamlover63

He has taken full responsibility he has told all our friends that it is all his fault! He has told them he is going to beat this addiction he has to change and then he intends to win her back. I think once he realises that she is definitely not coming back he will sadly fall back to gambling. Every bone in my body hopes he doesn’t but he will be in a house on his own miles away from any friends and family it’s going to be so hard for him.
You might want to remove the name OP?

Hope it all goes well and your daughter can start her new chapter cleanly

Thirtytimesround · 26/01/2022 12:57

This marriage can’t be saved and I don’t say that lightly.

Hugs to you and your daughter. Hope she manages to get a quick divorce and move on.

I wonder how much of her ex-husband’s anger comes from the fact that he’s scared about his work finding out. The army take
addiction / mental health issues pretty seriously since they like to know who they’re handing gunds to. Also he’s not going to be able to stay in married quarters indefinitely once he’s single - or get married allowances like marriage separation pay when he’s deployed. I wonder how much he’s focused on the money/house stuff and how much he actually cares about your daughter.

OwlNoises101 · 26/01/2022 13:03

You have put your daughter's name op.

WeAreTheHeroes · 26/01/2022 13:07

The OP has changed other details - she's said so - so no reason to think that's her daughter's actual name.

Thirtytimesround · 26/01/2022 13:21

PS OP: if your daughter has moved out of their married quarters then he is legally obliged to tell the Army today of his change in circumstances. Otherwise it becomes benefit fraud and they take that really really seriously, they even jailed one guy for lying about where he lived so he claim private school fees. Not your problem perhaps but thought I should mention.

billy1966 · 26/01/2022 13:52

He married her under false pretences IMO.

Her's was a completely dishonest marriage.

She owes him nothing.

She is to be hugely commended for rightly placing value on HER life and her future.

She is right to "choose ME".

If she returns to him she is choosing HIM over what is better for her.

Life with an addiction like gambling is always life on the edge for the partner.

GA is full of broken older women who are full of regrets for allowing their lives to be controlled and ruled by their partners addiction.

So many stories of raising children in absolute poverty because of it.

When I was told all about it some years ago it was a huge eye opener.

Not least how prevalent, pervasive and insidious it is.....whilst hidden in plain sight.

If she even considers returning to the marriage, just remind her she is returning to a life that will always be uncertain.

Certainly no environment for children to be raised in.

ESGdance · 26/01/2022 14:38

@Icecreamlover63

He has taken full responsibility he has told all our friends that it is all his fault! He has told them he is going to beat this addiction he has to change and then he intends to win my daughter back. I think once he realises that she is definitely not coming back he will sadly fall back to gambling. Every bone in my body hopes he doesn’t but he will be in a house on his own miles away from any friends and family it’s going to be so hard for him.
No he hasn’t taken full responsibility for it.

He has done the opposite in berating her, you, your DIL, and their other friends and family - he has put it all out EXTERNALLY and VERBALLY in desperate, abusive, coercive, demanding and manipulative words and actions to create a false narrative and control your DD.

Did he tell all the friends and family that he is emotionally violent to her? That he has led a secret and deceptive life from her? That he is harassing her?

Doubt it.

He is still behaving abusively and this will escalate.

If you think that he will sadly fall back into gambling because your DD has walked then you are still not grasping the enormity of what you are dealing with - the gambling is the least of her worries - once he realises she isn’t playing ball his “taking responsibility” and promises of recovery will flip back to threats and abuse.

ESGdance · 26/01/2022 14:44

Please encourage your DD to get ahead of this - even if it is just a plan of action ready to go with numbers of his seniors, a heads up to her work place, gym, friends and family (she doesn’t have to give details just a request not to give access or info about her or engage with him) also to understand the process for police report etc

Icecreamlover63 · 26/01/2022 16:23

Billy1996
I 100% agree with you.

OP posts:
Icecreamlover63 · 26/01/2022 16:27

She moves out in 5 weeks time.
He has told me he is having counselling from welfare at work for his gambling but I can assure you he wants to stay in the house. So I can guarantee he hasn’t told them the truth on that score!

So right now the Army think he only has a gambling issue not that his marriage has broken up because of it!
He has asked that my daughter just tell them she is working away from the marital home because he wants the house

OP posts:
Icecreamlover63 · 26/01/2022 16:29

It’s a fake name !
Please give me some credit

OP posts:
MananaTomorrow · 26/01/2022 16:53

He has asked that my daughter just tell them she is working away from the marital home because he wants the house

Still lying then…..
And not just to your Dd but to the Army too. That’s going to go down well when they realise…..

Ormally · 26/01/2022 16:58

I also know someone with a mirror image story of @billy1966's - divorced her OH in her 60s. 3 children by then, the youngest of university age. This was because they'd lost their house, and she had no idea until there was no more hiding it. Don't sign your DD over to that. Don't. She has already had too long with just a few years.

There is something really chilling and not right about his single minded vision of going through the motions of GA as quickly as possible so that "I will get her back in 4 months." Notice the 'I' - there is no sense of what HER wants or hopes might be and not a lot of doubt that he will 'only' need that length of time.

He's woven rather a tangled web so it is almost certain that all their/his friends are not getting a fully rounded story. This is sad and unfair but not your priority at the moment. The notice period will go fast - if it's a hospital, is there any student nurse accommodation, for example, that could work for a short time? You need to put time and distance between the old life and a much better new one.

ChargingBuck · 26/01/2022 17:47

He has asked that my daughter just tell them she is working away from the marital home because he wants the house

Then he is misinforming his employer, see post above from PP who was pointing out the ramifications of this, & what a dim view the military will take of it, & the whole caboodle. As you rightly point out OP - they currently know the bare minimum.

As to asking DD to collude in his lie - how is this demonstrating his much-vaunted respect or taking full responsibility?

ESGdance · 26/01/2022 17:58

@ChargingBuck

He has asked that my daughter just tell them she is working away from the marital home because he wants the house

Then he is misinforming his employer, see post above from PP who was pointing out the ramifications of this, & what a dim view the military will take of it, & the whole caboodle. As you rightly point out OP - they currently know the bare minimum.

As to asking DD to collude in his lie - how is this demonstrating his much-vaunted respect or taking full responsibility?

He is getting the DD to falsify info and commit fraud to the military - she was also somehow tangled up in a fake break in (at least she knows it was fake)

This tosser has zero boundaries and a high threshold for risk and breaking the law - as well as dragging your DD unwittingly into his criminal ways.

She needs to be honest otherwise she may well get implicated.

Expect loads of other shit to come out of the woodwork - as the secrets and lies seep out over the coming months.

Icecreamlover63 · 26/01/2022 18:38

Unfortunately it already is, slowly but slowly.
My DD can argue with the best of them but everyone argues they really do. It’s the lies, it’s the gambling, it’s the control element.
I’m so full of mixed emotions right now.
In an ideal world you would like people to work at differences but this is not an ideal world! This all seems very surreal to me.
I’m really tired and so sad I think of the future that they could have had if he hadn’t gambled.
I think of the places they could have gone.
But then reality kicks in and you think of the very hard times. It’s just not worth it!

My hope is that he sticks to GA and my daughter is happy and relaxed. I would like to think they could remain friends but I have never split up from my DH so I have no experience to draw from.

Everyone has been so kind to me on here I feel so humbled.

Thank you

OP posts:
billy1966 · 26/01/2022 19:03

Tosser is right.

Absolutely advise her OP NOT to lie to the army in any shape or form.

He is a con man.

He doesn't care if he drags her down into his pit.

All he cares about is himself and keeping his gig going, like any addict.

OP, if you could go to some GA meetings with your daughter to support her, it would be fantastic.

My friend went with her sister and the reality of the lives of some of those women in their 60/70's are so chilling.

No heating, no food in the house.
Jobs lost through stealing.
Unemployment.
Constant promises to change.
Constant lies.
The unbearable loneliness.
Lying to family for years.
The exhaustion of keeping up appearances.

IMO it is worse than alcoholism.

My friends sister had a lovely home but the final round of debts caught up with him via 8 credit cards with a 120,000 of debt.

They sold the house, he paid his debts and went into 6 weeks of treatment.

He appears to be clean since.

She has her own small home now and has peace but she feels so robbed.

Raising children with that stress is a huge sadness.
She feels robbed of their childhood.
Alway working so hard, watching money because she could never depend on him despite his good job.

He lives in a small two bed apartment and has focused on earning his children's respect back, they were very very upset.

They have enormous respect for their mum.

One very shallow note is how the stress aged her sister.
Despite being younger, looking very like each other, my friend being 8 years older, looks years younger.

When she went to GA, she remarked upon the hard lives etched on the faces of the lovely women that told their stories.

Keep posting OP.

You need support too.

I would be devastated if either of my precious girls ended up with a gambling addict.

The thing is it is so easily hidden, though flags are becoming easier to spot as people become more aware and educated.

Flowers
RainingYetAgain · 26/01/2022 20:13

I'm not clear if your daughter is still living in the house or is staying with a friend. Assuming its a large military base, with a families' medical practice she will need to get her GP changed ASAP. Otherwise, as soon as she hands in her pass to access the camp, it will become more difficult to see the GP.
She cannot lie about where she is living, especially if she is a HCP, as it could be considered fraud. It really is his problem.
She needs to make sure that he doesn't take out any loans in her name, I think there is a way you can notify the credit companies that additional checks need to be made. In her position I would open a new bank account that he knows nothing about and close all others.

Hiphopboppertybop99 · 26/01/2022 20:15

Just wanted to say I hope you are all ok sending Flowers
I haven't RTFT, so sorry if this has been suggested earlier, but can your daughter not see her GP and explain her situation and perhaps they can sign her off work, that way she wouldn't have to work her notice period. Not something I would usually recommend but it sounds like she needs to be as far-away as possible from her husband and be with supportive family and friends during this incredibly difficult time for her. I think you said she works in a hospital, on the proviso that that fact is true can she not apply for a transfer to a different trust, apologies I'm not really sure how it works.

ChargingBuck · 26/01/2022 20:23

I would like to think they could remain friends

He. Is. Not. Her. Friend.

AcrossthePond55 · 26/01/2022 23:10

@Icecreamlover63

So, what would happen if she didn't work out her notice? Again, I'm not in the UK. Here, an employer doesn't set your notice period, you do. I suppose unless you have a stipulated contract, but that's not common here. All that would happen here is that an employer would only be able to say 'left without full notice' but that's about it. It's not like it shows up in any public records. And it's normally easily explained away to any prospective new employer if need be. Would it be worth it to her to be able to leave before he knows she's gone? Even a few days?

I think it's natural that you feel for his mother. Who wouldn't? Every mother has a secret fear of something happening to their child and something (albeit self caused) has happened to hers. Obviously you don't have to do anything but feel bad inside for her and your support will always be for your own DD.

I think it was a really low and nasty thing he did, getting in the 'first blow' with all their friends. Because that was what it was. He just wanted to get their sympathy before she could tell them the real story about how he lied to her, stole from their money (because that's what gambling is), and abused her to her face. It's always harder to fight back against the first explanation so he made sure to get his in their first.

My ex was ex-forces and was receiving what we call the 'GI Bill' to go to Uni when I kicked him out. A chunk of it was a 'spousal supplement' and he asked me not to tell them and to not file for divorce so he could keep it. I agreed until I was told that I could be held liable for repayment if they ever found out that I didn't report it, so I did AND filed for divorce. Your DD will want to be sure she won't get in any trouble or be held liable for not saying anything.

Icecreamlover63 · 26/01/2022 23:18

@ChargingBuck

I would like to think they could remain friends

He. Is. Not. Her. Friend.

You are right it’s just bloody sad it’s come to this. We were so fond of him and this is going to take a lot of adjustment! I’m going to look at a local gym tomorrow that has a spa attached and see if I can get some kind of family membership. So when she comes back she can go there and work out. It has a lovely swimming pool which is the thing I want.
Before he went out tonight and before she came in her wrote a note saying Al he ever wanted was kids with her. But she has just sent me a voice mail saying he should not have done what he did then. She wants him to get back to his old self and kick this addiction she said how hard it must be. He has started well and is having two GA sessions a week and two counselling sessions through his work a week.
Even though he has put my daughter through a difficult time I want him to succeed.
She opened up tonight about a seaside visit and how he was just so hot and angry he walked off and left her for 2 hours. She had no way of getting home and she was scared. When he eventually did turn up she had to pack up with all the bags. I’ve had rows with my DH over the years but I don’t recall anything like this. Anyway like someone said things will come out. I’m quite sure his parents are hearing a different version of events and his Father actually said - to block us! If we were winding him up, which we are not because we are not talking to him. My Daughter said it was awful to listen to. He was not interested in his sins welfare just went on about how much money he was owed.
Once again thank you
OP posts:
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