To be really enjoying Boris Johnson's downfall Part 2

[ClaudineClare]

A follow on thread from

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/am_i_being_unreasonable/4457488-to-be-really-enjoying-boris-johnson-s-downfall?msgid=114425763#114425763

Err maybe we wasn't in lock down at the time

Hope you all enjoy this as much as I have. I love Marina.

www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2022/jan/21/tory-hunger-games-pork-pies-mps-

I'm wondering what's the point. If he resigns he is just going to he replaced by another self serving, amoral Tory. The only difference is that the next one might be a bit smarter and the fleece the public without being so obvious about it.

The Tories aren't getting rid of him because they think he did anything wrong. If they get rid of him it's because he got caught.

I'd rather he hangs on till the next general election.

@Peregrina

Mines a cuppa tea and a sandwich

I'm confused. Does that make it work or a party?

Depends on the perspective I intend to convey, but generally I'd say, if work topics are being discussed then it's a work function.

@AliveAndSleeping

I'm wondering what's the point. If he resigns he is just going to he replaced by another self serving, amoral Tory. The only difference is that the next one might be a bit smarter and the fleece the public without being so obvious about it.

The Tories aren't getting rid of him because they think he did anything wrong. If they get rid of him it's because he got caught.

I'd rather he hangs on till the next general election.

Completely agree

[quote Blossomtoes]@Hawkins001 when the Torygraph, with all its close relationships in the government, is putting the boot in I feel inclined to believe what it tells me. Particularly when nobody’s denying it.[/quote]
Fair point, but sometimes not all is as it seems, and I guess I'm cynical, especially after studying the philosophy of Machiavelli.

@AliveAndSleeping

I'm wondering what's the point. If he resigns he is just going to he replaced by another self serving, amoral Tory. The only difference is that the next one might be a bit smarter and the fleece the public without being so obvious about it.

The Tories aren't getting rid of him because they think he did anything wrong. If they get rid of him it's because he got caught.

I'd rather he hangs on till the next general election.

This ^^

@Youngatheart00

I’ll admit I voted for him. But it’s now time for him to go, he’s lost all credibility. I heard him described as the turd that won’t flush!!

This is brilliant!!!

I'd rather he hangs on till the next general election

I suspect you’re out of luck with that one. It seems that opinion is divided between getting rid of him well before the local elections to minimise the number of lost council seats or waiting until they’re over so all the lost seats prove he’s an electoral liability. Either way, I can’t see him hanging on much beyond May.

@Peregrina

If it's just due to the narrative by the papers, why didn't we hear of constant alcohol fuelled beanos in Gordon Brown's time as PM? Would that be because they didn't happen or that no one believed that a dour Scot could sanction parties, but they know damn well that Johnson can and would?

Different agendas for different situational aspects.

Thanks for the article @Blossomtoes very interesting.

@Hawkins001

Although does anyone consider that it could be Boris being setup with regards to certain events ?

Only in the sense that Al Capone was 'set up' in being convicted for tax evasion.

Coincidentally, Al is what Johnson is really called by those who know him...

Different agendas for different situational aspects.

That implies though that they - Brown and Johnson - were treated differently when in essence they are more similar than we'd think. They weren't, and aren't.

Fair point, but sometimes not all is as it seems, and I guess I'm cynical, especially after studying the philosophy of Machiavelli.

No Machiavelli needed.

His MPs don’t like him. He has made many unforced errors. They think he will be a liability at the next election. Many MPs want to be PM.

It's like watching an episode of family guy. Brilliant entertainment 🤠

@Youngatheart00

I’ll admit I voted for him. But it’s now time for him to go, he’s lost all credibility. I heard him described as the turd that won’t flush!!

Did you actually vote for him, you vote for your MP not for the party, this was what we were firmly told on the thread about the defecting MP anyway.

www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2021/dec/22/tories-cake-stuffed-boris-johnson-covid-restrictions-freedom

Cakeism and why it is falling apart.

I read before that they study rhetoric at Eton as a subject, which is the art of spinning, and many of the previous pms went to Eton. It’s a real skill and other people are disadvantaged without this skill.

I set up the last thread, glad to know it's provided lots of interesting discussion! He might not be gone yet, but he's definitely on a downward slope.

@VikingOnTheFridge

Wonder if the Met will manage to take any time out of their busy rape schedule to actually investigate this.

The Met have said "As with any such allegations, should a criminal offence be reported to the Met, it would be considered."

But, as widely discussed on the radio this morning, putting pressure on MPs is how Westminster works - it would be surprising if parliament has acted criminally for the last few centuries.

But surely nothing that he has done can really be a surprise to anyone who supported him? It is not as though he was some sort of pristine character prior to the 2019 election.

I didn't vote Tory at the last election, in part because I wouldn't vote for a party led by a racist. But I am still surprised at just how awful he has been as Prime Minister. Now I didn't expect he would be competent, but also didn't expect that he would actively try and destroy the country.

*The Met have said "As with any such allegations, should a criminal offence be reported to the Met, it would be considered."

But, as widely discussed on the radio this morning, putting pressure on MPs is how Westminster works - it would be surprising if parliament has acted criminally for the last few centuries.*

@Florianus If I broke into your house every week for 25minutes for a century, does that then mean that I am not breaking the law?

But, as widely discussed on the radio this morning, putting pressure on MPs is how Westminster works - it would be surprising if parliament has acted criminally for the last few centuries

Huge difference between persuasion and blackmail, what was acceptable in the 1640s may not be now..

Wragg has been an MP for 7 years, is v/chair of the 1922 committee and is well respected, his allegations are backed up by 2 other MPs

I loved bojo's response "i have seen no evidence..." From the party that bought us "No evidence of Russian influence on Brexit..." then told us all "We never looked for any"

I want him to stay.

Because I want him to hang on by his fingernails and do as much damage to the party before a GE. And all the MPs supporting him would have a light shone on them and they could then potentially lose their seats.
(Desperate for my MP to lose his as he honestly is dire)

@3luckystars

I read before that they study rhetoric at Eton as a subject, which is the art of spinning, and many of the previous pms went to Eton. It’s a real skill and other people are disadvantaged without this skill.

3luckystars I read before that they study rhetoric at Eton as a subject

Back in the 18th century! In fact, all university students studied rhetoric, grammar and logic back in the middle ages, as a compulsory introduction to liberal arts courses (followed by arithmetic, music, geometry, and astronomy).

What Eton, along with many public schools, cultivates is a thriving debating society, which feeds into the Oxford Union when its students go on to university, and of course leads to politics for some.