To be really enjoying Boris Johnson's downfall Part 2

[ClaudineClare]

A follow on thread from

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/am_i_being_unreasonable/4457488-to-be-really-enjoying-boris-johnson-s-downfall?msgid=114425763#114425763

@Blossomtoes

Sue Gray is said to be in possession of electronic records of everyone who attended the event, including their arrival and departure times, thanks to the electronic pass system at use in No.10

Johnson lives there. All that system denotes is who entered the building and when. It gives no indication of where they went once inside it.

If 30 staff who normally leave work at 5 pm or 8 pm or whatever suddenly are leaving at 1 am with no explanation it does say something. If they have an explanation I'm sure she will listen.

I feel that a lot of people want all this to go away , more important things going on etc , but if the conservative own MPs are now flagging up things that are wrong or the Sue Gray inquiry is very damming in its findings, then it won't be going anywhere.
There are lots of bad things looming on the horizon , but bullying claims or any illegal gatherings over lockdown are just as important too. I agree it's distracting , but people also want answers too.

@the80sweregreat

All Dominic Raab could say today on the sky news interview ( summing up ) , was ' wait for the Sue Gray report and Labour would have been worse at dealing with the pandemic' .. how does he know that Corbyn would have thrown parties during lockdown or messed up the vaccine programme? Hindsight is a wonderful thing for politicians isn't it ? I know that Sir Kier Starmer does this too, but honestly , they are clutching at straws at the moment and refuse to condemn the gatherings at all or even admit they were a bad idea. I hope the report makes them all squirm. But not holding my breath.

Keir Starmer might use hindsight (although I think alot of it was said at the time) but Dominic Raab is just making it up unless he has some special psychic powers that let him see an alternative reality.

@the80sweregreat

I feel that a lot of people want all this to go away , more important things going on etc , but if the conservative own MPs are now flagging up things that are wrong or the Sue Gray inquiry is very damming in its findings, then it won't be going anywhere. There are lots of bad things looming on the horizon , but bullying claims or any illegal gatherings over lockdown are just as important too. I agree it's distracting , but people also want answers too.

There is of course a simple solution that would mean that none of these would be a distraction for the government anymore.

Interesting to note that Ghani is a leading figure in the Covid Recovery group

That is very interesting, especially in light of the fact that Johnson's timing on lifting the restrictions in England could very well have been a sop to the CRG members in the hope of keeping them onside.

Everything is crumbling around him. He might still survive though.

@ClaudineClare

Interesting to note that Ghani is a leading figure in the Covid Recovery group

That is very interesting, especially in light of the fact that Johnson's timing on lifting the restrictions in England could very well have been a sop to the CRG members in the hope of keeping them onside.

Everything is crumbling around him. He might still survive though.

Sop, may be the wrong word.
I would characterize it more that Johnson lifted restrictions because they needed renewing and he had promised a debate in parliament if that was the case and he knows he doesn't have the votes to get it through if Labour don't vote for it as well.

The current cabinet are all so thick, it is incredible.

I was shocked to discover that Dominic Raab studied law at Oxford, further studies at Cambridge then trained at Linklaters. Wtaf?! 👀
HOW?!🤣

I thought maybe Johnson's people pretend to be dumb to fit in with the cabinet, but now all this is spiralling so unbelievably it confirms to me that they actually ARE dumb.

@the80sweregreat

If someone says something to someone without a paper trail , email or any other kind of evidence ( a mobile phone recording or whatever ) then it'll always be ' he said , she said' situation I suppose. I heard that someone did have a recording? But not sure which case or if it'll be released. Must be hard to switch your phone on without being seen if someone just drops by your office on the quick. How can any of the MPs argue their case if they don't have any hard evidence? How can the police proceed ? Honest questions. I don't understand the law or how that would work ?

They can't - and the Met have already said that they will only investigate Wragg's allegations if there is evidence of criminal activity. He at least needs to produce that tape recording, if it exists, otherwise (as you rightly say) it is just another "he said, she said" issue.

I must admit that Dominic Raab didn't come across that well today , but then Trevor Phillips is a very calm interrogator and tends to get under their skin a bit. I could almost see the pulse on Raab's forehead going mad , he was obviously a bit unnerved at the questions and quick to blame the Labour Party, bizarre as that is. I knew he was a lawyer before becoming an MP, he just isn't that good at being asked things I think ? Tends to become defensive and I bet he has an awful temper too. He just comes across as arrogant.
I hope that the Gray inquiry isn't a total whitewash , because if it's in their favour then the gloating will be heard all around parliament.

CNN report www.google.co.uk/amp/s/amp.cnn.com/cnn/2022/01/23/uk/uk-politics-boris-johnson-intl-gbr/index.html

How about a new slogan as his regime like them so much, instead of Build Back Better:

Banish Boris’ Bullshit

The thing is, how will we know if the Gray report is a whitewash or not if we don't have access to a full version of it?

It is infuriating. The taxpayer is presumably meeting the cost of the report, yet Johnson can decide which parts we are allowed to see.

Raab was a trainee at Linklaters and I think qualified there, but has never practised as a lawyer. He’s usually unimpressive and isn’t seen as a good legal mind.

David Davies on why he called for Johnson’s resignation @ PMQs:

And the day before, he had effectively blamed his staff, he said they didn't tell me that this was outside the rules or something like that.

"That's in my view the reverse of proper leadership but behind all of that, is my fear that this is going to go on forever.

The taxpayer should see the entire Gray report
If we don't, then we will never know the truth.
Nick Robinson interviewed ' adrenaline rush ' Steve Baker for his pod cast, he is another arrogant' do as I say , not as I do ' type.
How they get voted in is a mystery to me.

Raab was a trainee at Linklaters and I think qualified there, but has never practised as a lawyer.

My guess was that he wasn't good enough to be kept on there and the prospect of being a provincial solicitor doing conveyancing or divorces day in day out wasn't a very appealing prospect.

Nus Ghani's response to the No10 statement

twitter.com/nus_ghani/status/1485259972430774274?s=21

@GreenLunchBox

The current cabinet are all so thick, it is incredible.

I was shocked to discover that Dominic Raab studied law at Oxford, further studies at Cambridge then trained at Linklaters. Wtaf?! 👀
HOW?!🤣

I thought maybe Johnson's people pretend to be dumb to fit in with the cabinet, but now all this is spiralling so unbelievably it confirms to me that they actually ARE dumb.

Well its always a puzzle isn't it? Are they thick or are they evil?

Sort of doesn't matter. Though I'd have more pity if they were thick.

@JaniieJones

'those of us who want to discuss the issue of Johnson's potential downfall get on with it'

There's not much to 'get on with' is there until we know the actual facts that Gray will establish.

Johnson still seems very popular from what I've seen on sm. Yes Twitter isn't representative of the nation but many intelligent folk do seem to understand they've got the big things right like jobs, furlough, vaccines and the economy, whilst perhaps being a bit lax regarding workplace eating and drinking arrangements.

If you look at the latest YouGov polls he’s hit rock bottom. The public don’t take kindly to effectively being put under house arrest while their leaders enjoy boozy get togethers. People don’t like being taken for fools.

yougov.co.uk/topics/politics/trackers/boris-johnson-approval-rating

Can we be sure that's rock bottom?
There's still 22% who think he is doing well.

@jgw1

Can we be sure that's rock bottom? There's still 22% who think he is doing well.

You can fool some of the people all of the time.

Johnson still seems very popular from what I've seen on sm. Yes Twitter isn't representative of the nation but many intelligent folk do seem to understand they've got the big things right like jobs, furlough, vaccines and the economy, whilst perhaps being a bit lax regarding workplace eating and drinking arrangements.

Carrie, is that you?

@BrightYellowDaffodil

Johnson still seems very popular from what I've seen on sm. Yes Twitter isn't representative of the nation but many intelligent folk do seem to understand they've got the big things right like jobs, furlough, vaccines and the economy, whilst perhaps being a bit lax regarding workplace eating and drinking arrangements.

Carrie, is that you?

Well I will give it to Boris, he is doing better than Theresa May. He is now more unpopular than she ever was.

www.theguardian.com/politics/2022/jan/15/boris-johnson-now-less-popular-than-theresa-may-as-polls-show-tories-dire-predicament

Sorry for the cut and paste, but some of the detail emerging of the about the treatment of Ghani is not good for Johnson. But fear not, he has Michael Fabricant to help smooth things over. This is from the Guardian. Bolding mine.

"No 10 sought to defuse the row on Sunday, saying in a statement that “after being made aware of these extremely serious claims, the prime minister met with Nusrat Ghani to discuss them. He then wrote to her expressing his serious concern and inviting her to begin a formal complaint process. She did not subsequently do so. The Conservative party does not tolerate prejudice or discrimination of any kind.”

"However, Ghani said that after she had spoken to Johnson about her treatment: "He wrote to me that he could not get involved, and suggested I use the internal Conservative party complaint process. This, as I had already pointed out, was very clearly not appropriate for something that happened on government business"

She added: “In my statement yesterday I was careful not to mention any names or implicate the PM. All I have ever wanted was for his government to take this seriously, investigate properly and ensure no other colleague has to endure this.”

Meanwhile the Conservative backbencher MP Michael Fabricant caused fresh controversy by saying it was unlikely Ghani was discriminated against for her faith, because “she’s hardly someone who’s obviously a Muslim”.

I suppose it should not be a surprise that Johnson would not help her. We all know he is a bigot.

@ClaudineClare

Sorry for the cut and paste, but some of the detail emerging of the about the treatment of Ghani is not good for Johnson. But fear not, he has Michael Fabricant to help smooth things over. This is from the Guardian. Bolding mine.

"No 10 sought to defuse the row on Sunday, saying in a statement that “after being made aware of these extremely serious claims, the prime minister met with Nusrat Ghani to discuss them. He then wrote to her expressing his serious concern and inviting her to begin a formal complaint process. She did not subsequently do so. The Conservative party does not tolerate prejudice or discrimination of any kind.”

"However, Ghani said that after she had spoken to Johnson about her treatment: "He wrote to me that he could not get involved, and suggested I use the internal Conservative party complaint process. This, as I had already pointed out, was very clearly not appropriate for something that happened on government business"

She added: “In my statement yesterday I was careful not to mention any names or implicate the PM. All I have ever wanted was for his government to take this seriously, investigate properly and ensure no other colleague has to endure this.”

Meanwhile the Conservative backbencher MP Michael Fabricant caused fresh controversy by saying it was unlikely Ghani was discriminated against for her faith, because “she’s hardly someone who’s obviously a Muslim”.

More evidence that Fabricant is a Labour mole. @JaniieJones do you think the police should be investigating this?