To think that time off with ill DC should still be split even though I WFH?

[HardbackWriter]

I have a 3 year old and an 11 month old and have just returned to work after my second maternity leave. DH and I both work four days a week - he's a teacher, I work in an office job but I've been working from home since March 2020 and it doesn't look like it's going to change anytime soon (I have actually requested to have some time in the office but my employer is reluctant and my request has dragged on with no resolution). Pre-covid, when we both worked out of the home, we split days off when DC1 was ill pretty rigidly 50-50, with some flexibility if one or the other of us had something particularly big on when it was 'our turn'. This morning DH made a comment that made it clear that he thought that from now on he'd only take time off work for ill DC if I had one of those 'notable/big' things on, as otherwise I could just do a bit of work around the DC and then make up the time later (I control my own diary and my job is more of a 'get the tasks done' than a clock-watching type one), whereas for him he has to have the day fully off. I was a bit taken aback/cross at this, but now I'm not sure if he's being the reasonable one? He's right that this is possible for me (though it ends up with me working until midnight, and potentially having to rearrange or drop out of meetings last minute) and not for him, but I also really don't think it'll make me look professional and engaged at work and it feels inherently a bit unjust (but is this petty of me?). It's inevitably going to be a pressing issue because both children have spent this entire winter being ill, and I'm sure there's loads more to come. AIBU? How do other people arrange this?

That was a ridiculously long post. In summary - sure, you can do more, but that doesn't mean he gets to swan in at 6:30 to prepared supper, kids bathed etc then watch tv until 10pm while you're working until midnight. Non-teaching work can be done by him later in the evening or early the following morning to facilitate you getting at least a few hours to work in the late afternoon.

I think he’s right but with some conditions. He should come home immediately after his last teaching period and take on 100% of dinner/bath/bed so you can work. During COVID when I was wfh and homeschooling dh would leave work at 4 and I got a solid half day work in while he did all child and house stuff.

I don't think you're being unreasonable OP. If your employer is getting a raw deal compared with your DH's employer because you're picking up a disproportionate amount of child care, then I don't think that's on. I get that it might not be a perfect 50/50 split between the two of you, but you shouldn't be the default carer. Also, looking after very young sick kids in the day and then working on the laptop late into the night can be brutal, even if DH is on hand with cups of tea and doing bedtime etc.

Thinking about anecdotes, I know a female teacher who picks up all the sick child term time care as her DP apparently doesn't get paid in his job if he takes time off for child care. It seems so often that it's the man's job that's positioned as the most important and unable to accommodate child care, for whatever reason.

How does it work if you have meetings scheduled? Do you ask for them to be moved or send apologies? The woman I mentioned upthread would say something like "my children are unwell so I'll be working this evening instead of today, the lunchtime meeting needs to be changed to 4.30pm onwards". That didn't fit in with the other people on the project so it never happened, also constant apologies would not have been acceptable either.

We have a similar set up currently as I wfh and OH works in the office or is at clients. My work is fairly flexible so we have done things so I take poorly child in day. He does drop off/collection for non poorly child and takes over poorly one on return home & sorts tea/bath/bedtime so I can catch up. Ours are older (5/7 now and 3/5 when this whole shit show started) so can be entertained for a bit by Netflix or similar. I feel for you as trying to work with a 3/4 year old was very hard but I think it probably does make sense overall for you to split in a similar way. School hols and any training days should be him and if it’s a longer time they are off he should share but for the odd day I think it’s reasonable to ask you to cover it

I understand where you're coming from but I think if both of you can get your jobs done without either of you having to take time off, surely that's the best option?

@BlingLoving

That was a ridiculously long post. In summary - sure, you can do more, but that doesn't mean he gets to swan in at 6:30 to prepared supper, kids bathed etc then watch tv until 10pm while you're working until midnight. Non-teaching work can be done by him later in the evening or early the following morning to facilitate you getting at least a few hours to work in the late afternoon.

Yes great point aswell, if OP has to work later to make up her work than certainly her DH should be coming home and taking over food and child duties straight away

Generally my job is v flexible so I am allowed to either make up my hours later, or take emergency leave etc, or take AL (I get loads compared to DH) so where I can I usually take the time.

This makes sense for us as DH doesn’t get paid to take time off, his job isn’t flexible (he is out of the house) and he gets the minimum annual leave. On these days he would do all the cooking, bedtime duties, take over as soon as he gets home so that i can get work done and still get some evening downtime.

If I have something important, or me being off will be detrimental for my colleagues, work, career etc then he’ll take the time but most of the time it makes more sense for me to manage. This would work the same if our jobs were vice versa.

So it depends on the individual family circs really.

What I noticed in the pandemic as a single parent was that if I said “I’ll home school and then work in the evening”, it meant sitting down to it at 9 pm when kids are in bed.

If a married / in a partnership colleague (with an at least baseline decent husband) said it, it meant sitting down at 5.30 once he had finished work and could take over completely (for those whose DH couldn’t work from home/ weren’t sharing the homeschooling for some reason)

That’s a massive difference!

Generally YABU, but - no he does not get to set out what's 'going' to happen, and no it absolutely shouldn't be set in stone that teacher = can't do it, wfh = can.

Like most things, the fairest way is to agree that the golden rule is no assumptions and lots of communication. Generally, it's going to be easiest for everyone if you do more sick days, yes. But no, it's not going to be ok for you to cover day after day and end up working evening after evening with his work time protected. If they have a bout of sickness, if there ends up being a week where cover is needed every day - yep he's going to have to be prepared to take a day simply when you say 'No more, can't do today as well' without you needing to justify why it's required.

@HunterHearstHelmsley

How does it work if you have meetings scheduled? Do you ask for them to be moved or send apologies? The woman I mentioned upthread would say something like "my children are unwell so I'll be working this evening instead of today, the lunchtime meeting needs to be changed to 4.30pm onwards". That didn't fit in with the other people on the project so it never happened, also constant apologies would not have been acceptable either.

During the lockdowns and various isolations/illnesses I sent a note in advance apologising that I have my kids so there might be an interruption and then just join. I’d usually stick the TV on for one or both of them in living room and then sit and join call from bottom of stairs where I could keep an eye on them. Alternatively if joining really wouldn’t work then I’d send my input in advance and catch up on minutes or if I was leading the call I’d reschedule or delegate to my team.

I also think teaching is a profession where it's particularly hard to take time off flexibly.

BUT when your kids are older he will be a huge asset in being able to take main responsibility for school holiday childcare. So while things aren't even at the moment, and you may always be the one doing bulk of the illness cover where flexibility is needed, he will be able to compensate by doing a lot of school holiday cover, which is always a problem for working parents.

I think you do need to be up front with your employer, not pretend you're working when you're not. Could you do a Saturday in lieu rather than working at midnight? People do understand.

And yes, single parent teachers have it harder.

I'm in a similar position, husband is a teacher and I've also just returned from mat leave with a 10 month old. I'm also wfh. The first day I was back in work our 4 year old daughter had an asthma attack which she ended up going to hospital for and staying in 2 days. As I was only back off mat leave literally the morning she'd been taken to hospital (and I'm still breastfeeding) my husband took the time off to stay with her in hospital. It was an emergency (taken in an ambulance etc) and he obviously couldn't leave her. Once he returned to work his boss informed him he wouldn't be paid for the 2 days off. Given the hours he puts into work outside of working hours and the circumstances, this wasn't a child off with a cold, she was in a+e poorly, it felt harsh (also bar paternity leave he's never had a day off since starting 5 years ago!! He even went to work when he knew i was in labour!!). I told my boss when I returned what was going on and he said if you need to be with her just go (I couldn't anyway because of covid and the baby). When I found out my husband wouldn't be paid I mentioned it to my boss who said they would have paid me in those circumstances. I do work in the public sector though and my organisation really shouts about being family friendly.

If you are able to carry on working and not lose pay or if like my employer yours are more understanding I'd say it probably is better you looking after them when they are sick. Before this happened I didn't realise how shitty my husband's school would be, this happened in December so it was his Christmas pay packet too!! In future it'll probably be me who juggles even in an emergency (it's likely to happen again) as we now know my employer is far more understanding, plus I wouldn't lose pay.

YANBU. Until men start using their special leave policies as much as women then equality at work and outside work well never happen (and I use men and women here deliberately as it is not simply mother's and father's that this applies to as it is disproportionally women providing care for older family too).

I voted YANBU as his job doesn't absent him from being a parent to his sick children. My kids are a similar age and this winter has been relentless - between the various doses going around the covid testing requirements, it was a rare week last term that we had both in nursery all week. When sickness is at that level, both parents need to pull their weight.

However, the differences in your jobs do need to be considered, so I would say that he should be doing, say, 1/3 of the term time absences and all of the ones during school holidays.

Good luck with the conversation about the change in your load.

@msgloria my husband’s job is definitely not more important, but I get paid for emergency childcare time off and he doesn’t, so it would be silly for him to take time off to the detriment of the family purse, when I can accommodate it. I guess I have the better job, realistically.

Sorry I'm with the majority same set up we have at the moment. I'm in full time and DH works from home so he sorts the childcare as he has that flexibility without having financial implications that I would be needing to come home

I'm married to a teacher and it's a fucking pain in the arse. He won't pick up any slack, ever. My job is more flexible but I can't drop out of a client meeting because he's a teacher. He's gone to work when I've been bedridden with noro and 10 month old twins to deal with.

It's a giant bone of contention tbh.

@itwasntaparty

I'm married to a teacher and it's a fucking pain in the arse. He won't pick up any slack, ever. My job is more flexible but I can't drop out of a client meeting because he's a teacher. He's gone to work when I've been bedridden with noro and 10 month old twins to deal with.

It's a giant bone of contention tbh.

That's not because he is a teacher though. It's clearly because he is a dick.

Oh and I'm the higher earner by at least 50k so my job IS more important.

I think your flexibility is key here; no-one is saying your job is less important, but out of the two of you it is much easier for you to look after ill children.
I would venture you can and probably would do a bit of work around caring for them as well, so I would imagine the ' working until midnight' thing was perhaps a bit OTT.
Also, going against the grain, I believe employees should have to take holiday days or unpaid leave when looking after sick children.
My employer has issued a new rule stating 2 days per calendar year will be allowed for parental leave..basically giving to extra days holiday to parents as lets face it, every parent is going to use them whether their child is ill or not.

A way around it of course is phoning in sick yourself when your child is ill, which I have done.
In one previous workplace, I was lucky enough to have a line manager that just trusted me, and if I had to be off if a child was ill, they just didn't take any action ( didn't ask for a holiday request or report as a sick day for me )

@Cyw2018

YANBU. Until men start using their special leave policies as much as women then equality at work and outside work well never happen (and I use men and women here deliberately as it is not simply mother's and father's that this applies to as it is disproportionally women providing care for older family too).

This is a good point. I bet all the female teachers at his school have to take childcare because their DH's have "Big Important High Paying" jobs that can't possibly be disturbed, even if they're working from home.....

I get that it's hard because time of when kids are ill is the more concrete thing to discuss but I think you need to discuss the mental load the more subtle ways that this seems to have shifted towards you. Maybe brainstorm what areas of domestic life are bothering you the most in this sense and bring those up to see if you can improve any of those things?

It might help if you approach this in a problem-solving-between-you way, if you can.

No you are not being unreasonable and this is coming from a teacher .

DH and I have always shared time off when the children were poorly. He has always had the flexibility to work from home but there is no way you can work with young children around you .

The lockdowns have already shown how difficult this has been.

He's absolving himself of any responsibility and quite thinks his work is off higher value than yours.

Stick to sharing equally otherwise this is the start of where many women find themselves , juggling everything because he has decided ( and many others trying to convince you ) that just because you are in the home is more convenient.

@itwasntaparty

I'm married to a teacher and it's a fucking pain in the arse. He won't pick up any slack, ever. My job is more flexible but I can't drop out of a client meeting because he's a teacher. He's gone to work when I've been bedridden with noro and 10 month old twins to deal with.

It's a giant bone of contention tbh.

Please tell me you threw up directly on him when he got home. Please.