To feel 0 sympathy-24 hours in police custody *MNHQ adding content warning for distressing information regarding a child*

[Menmy3]

AIBU to have absolutely no sympathy for poor baby Teddie’s useless mother. Going from one man to the next allowing one into her home that was clearly abusing her children and not protecting them. I know she was the victim of DV and usually I’d be advocating for her 100% but she showed no emotion, no remorse. Those poor babies.

@Queenie6655

Was there a specific point that made you switch from protecting the abuser to protecting your kids above all else?

You've been so brilliant to fellow victims on other threads and I wondered if you had any thoughts on that potential tipping point to help us help other women in the same position?

Well done and hats off to you queenie. Really I know it's hard . But good on you x

Thanks LublinToDublin

@stillvicarinatutu

In the last two weeks I've personally been involved in 3 terrible child cruelty cases and a murder of a newborn baby . These things don't just happen on eve in a blue moon . They happen every single day . And unless people report , engage - it will keep happening day in and day out .

It said there was a serious case review going on as people had reported many times to the police and social services

I just wanted to say how brave of the neighbours as well.

I bet they were terrified of him.

@stillvicarinatutu

And while 2 women a week on average are killed by their partners and it doesn't hit the national headlines ....same goes for child cruelty and neglect. You hear nothing of what actually happens.

devastatingly true. Dear god, the police are not perfect but what they have to deal with ...

So much of this happening these days. I really do think it is more commonplace and not the result of increased reporting channels, although happy to be proved incorrect. Babies and toddlers not being seen as human beings, just inconveniences and channels for the violent tendencies of a parent/partner with the other being totally under their spell. Unconceivable and baffling.

I have zero faith in case reviews .

It's like the default position when something goes tits up. It makes no difference in the long term . Because there are murdering arseholes who walk among us, there are victims who refuse to engage with services, social services are cash strapped and have staff with little to no experience and often other agencies hands are tied .
One of the cases I've just been involved in - social services fully aware but the family refused to
Engage . So they just left it . Instead of calling police for a joint visit to get into that house - just left it . By time some poor sod member of the public had the misfortune to have to visit for a
Totally unrelated purpose rang us a 3 year old was almost dead and 4 other children were taken into police protection there and then . If that member of the public hadn't rung 999 - a child would have been dead and 4 others following suit .
Funny how the parents could afford cigarettes and hair dye but starved their children to the point of death .
Really I think people think these cases are just isolated incidents. They aren't . Sadly .

[quote youvegottenminuteslynn]@Queenie6655

Was there a specific point that made you switch from protecting the abuser to protecting your kids above all else?

You've been so brilliant to fellow victims on other threads and I wondered if you had any thoughts on that potential tipping point to help us help other women in the same position?[/quote]
Very good question

Distance from him

Recording every event

And ignoring him telling me over and over that police would t believe me

He brainwashed me and told me no one would believe any of it
He is a high profile well paid professional

Why would they believe me?

One day 6 months after the assault on the kids and I - something just flipped

I drove to my police station
Asked for a female police officer and told them everything

They were horrified and so so kind

@Cocoabutterformula

stillvicarinatutu

The police were great in the programme, I cannot imagine how you deal with this sort of thing day after day. Incredible.

Exactly

How they stay calm with the shit they put up with

And when they try to arrest the perp the victim won't allow it

My god

RIP Teddy - that couple sicken me. I also feel for the van driver who had no chance of avoiding that narcissistic bastard when he attempted to end things.

I can’t believe that she is walking free after all of that, the man said the child has injuries going back to newborn, so she let her tiny baby suffer for 3 months.

I’m sorry but I have been a victim of domestic violence and lived in refuges and nobody would ever so much as raise a voice at my children so to sit back and allow a man to do this is disgusting.

Her Facebook and the local police group suggest on the comments that she’s since had another baby and was allowed to have custody of this child, I’m hoping it’s wrong but it’s unbelievable that she’s not locked up so this wouldn’t surprise me if it’s true.

The police are absolutely amazing, they stay so professional with these disgusting people I could never do the jobs that they do, these stories must stay with them for life. We don’t see even half of the things in that program or in the media that they see and I really don’t know how they do it.

I know of the case, but don't live in the UK so can't watch the show (and to be fair, I probably wouldn't as it would stay with me and haunt me too much).

I have a friend here who has been a victim of extreme DV - her 3 kids are traumatised by it too, one was actually in the room when her ex was throttling her and another came in and screamed at him to stop.

The police have removed him several times (!) from the home, he has been in jail for short periods, and he's not supposed to go to the home. But my friend has had several detailed conversations with me, and says it's like being on drugs - you want the "fix" even though you're aware it might do you serious harm. So she lets him back, even when he's not supposed to be there - and the police have pretty much thrown their hands up in her case because she breaks her own protection orders.
He hasn't physically hurt the kids - but she has been told by social services that she needs to keep him away or risk losing them to the foster system. Plus there's no guarantee that this situation would continue - some abusers DO start on their kids when they grow big enough to be a risk/threat.

I do feel for the police in these situations - impossible for them (Hello @stillvicarinatutu!) - but they can't just wash their hands of the situation entirely either, however frustrating it is. My friend felt that this was what happened here, when her ex would show up drunk and screaming and she would call the police but they'd take hours to respond - but then when they would take him away, keep him overnight and then release him, he'd go straight back there and she'd let him, so what are they supposed to do? (As I said to her)

She's finally free of him, thankfully - but it took a LONG time.

Thumb.

There is only so much police can do.
We can only hold anyone in custody for 24 hours. After that they're either charged to court , bailed , released under investigation or released no further action. We CANNOT - cannot - babysit adults with the capacity to make their own decisions. We can try to prevent harm to minors or people without capacity- but at the end of the day what can we do when someone chooses - chooses - to stay with someone who is abusing them ? We are not a police state where we dictate to people what they can and cannot do .

We cannot be made the scapegoat of people who can't /won't / refuse to help themselves .

I am not being cruel . I was subject to abuse as a child . I don't hold the police responsible however - I hold my (nc) mother responsible for putting me I that situation and I hold my step thing responsible for the acts of violence .
People HAVE to take some responsibility for what they allow themselves and their children to be subject to. The police cannot prevent this .

The whole thing was just so hard to watch. I think I remember you @stillvicarinatutu from the doghouse, I think we got GSD puppies at a similar time. Either way, your job must be very frustrating, I feel for you and your colleagues.

@stillvicarinatutu

Thumb.

There is only so much police can do.
We can only hold anyone in custody for 24 hours. After that they're either charged to court , bailed , released under investigation or released no further action. We CANNOT - cannot - babysit adults with the capacity to make their own decisions. We can try to prevent harm to minors or people without capacity- but at the end of the day what can we do when someone chooses - chooses - to stay with someone who is abusing them ? We are not a police state where we dictate to people what they can and cannot do .

Yeah, I know - sorry if my post made it look like I didn't appreciate the police's efforts. It was more frustration with my friend and understanding why the police reacted the way they did in her situation - apologies if I didn't convey that adequately.

Hi bitter yes that gsd puppy is now 8 ! Great big soft mutt he is !

@stillvicarinatutu

We cannot be made the scapegoat of people who can't /won't / refuse to help themselves .

I am not being cruel . I was subject to abuse as a child . I don't hold the police responsible however - I hold my (nc) mother responsible for putting me I that situation and I hold my step thing responsible for the acts of violence .
People HAVE to take some responsibility for what they allow themselves and their children to be subject to. The police cannot prevent this .

It is exactly the same position in Probation, yet we too are thrown under the bus at an alarmingly regular rate. We work with the most extreme and serious sexual and violent offenders on a daily basis, yet nobody is interested in the small victories made or the huge amount of people we protect. As threads like this prove, we don’t even get a look in.

She was a repeat victim, he was a known repeat perpetrator , various referrals had been made to children's social care by neighbours yet again like so many other recent high profile cases, they weren't open at the time that poor little boy died. The older child willingly spoke about the abuse they had suffered and witnessed, why had those questions not been asked of the child before or other soon taken, despite numerous prior reports and call outs describing high levels of violence and domestic abuse? . There's a reason there is a serious case review in progress. The mother clearly wasn't safeguarding those children, there were opportunities for earlier intervention by agencies why wasn't it taken?

@stillvicarinatutu absolutely but how many times do you make social care referrals only for the case to be closed due to not meeting thresholds when you know there are children in those homes at risk of serious harm? The whole child protection system needs an overhaul

Women are MOST likely to be killed by partners immediately following an attempt to leave, especially if the attempt was preceded by severity’s violence, in particular strangling. It is terrible but the choice to stay sometimes IS the safest choice if they don’t have a secure place to go and a lot of support. A very insightful book, No Visible Bruises, came out a year or two ago and offers a (horrifying) window into domestic violence and why women stay, when from the outside it seems so crazy.

YANBU. She facilitated what he was doing. Another thing that pisses me off is when these things happen and people blame the police or social services for not stepping in quicker. I think that’s a load of crap. There’s only so much these people can do. Until there is clear proof they can’t just step in and take people’s children. There are only two people to blame for that poor baby’s death and that’s the bastard that hurt him and the idiot that let it happen.

I was very moved by the professionals - those in the hospital and in the police station.

They had anguish on their faces, all of them, at some point. They really wanted to help Teddie, or at least to get justice for him, and definitely to keep his mother and siblings safe.

What a job. How do you turn off from that? How do you try to save the life of a tiny baby that you think might maybe possibly, definitely doesn't but let's hope he does have meningitis - and then be kind to the people you know have killed him, because they are about to watch a little infant die? Do you just find compassion for them because that's what Teddie needs? He needs his mum, to hear and smell and touch her? So, you set aside the fact that she has failed him, and his siblings and you know she's going to go on having babies?

I had no idea the police would be getting calls from an ITU to say "yeah, baby's brain dead, bail them, we'll give them time to be bedside". And then the police officer sitting there, watching them figure out that the baby is dying, and having to record it as evidence? Fucking hell, that's a shift that needs a glass of wine on the way home.

All those people, traumatised because of one man who thinks he might get a bit verbal sometimes.

Jesus wept.

policing doesnt look appealing here