Child maintenance

[anonforpost]

I pay my x 570 PCM for child maintenance as per CMS calculator. AIBU to expect not to pay anything on top of the amount. I believe 570 should be enough to cover all expenses of my 2 year old child.

And yet lots of mums manage even though the max they can get back from UC for one child per month is around £650 per month. Still, they manage to pay any amounts on top of that, whereas it's unthinkable that non-resident dads could unless they're 'wealthy'.

@3mealsaday

And yet lots of mums manage even though the max they can get back from UC for one child per month is around £650 per month. Still, they manage to pay any amounts on top of that, whereas it's unthinkable that non-resident dads could unless they're 'wealthy'.

But they don't. Many women don't return to work or go part time or use relatives for childcare. Some women manage, but clearly they're on high enough wages that they can afford it. Someone on min wage isn't earning £1400 so they're certainly not paying that to a nursery.

You literally can't pay what you don't earn can you?

You're also forgetting that if they're on a low wage on top of UC childcare top up they'll get other funds from UC and if they're renting something towards that too. An NRP on an average wage won't get any of that so yes it's bound to be harder for them to pay.

It's not that single mothers have some magical way of paying that none resident dad's don't, it's that as an NRP you'd get your wage and nothing else unless it was v low and you're renting. You'd get nothing towards children or childcare at all.

Well more bloody fool them. I earnt more than the minimum wage back in 1998 and I realised i couldn’t afford a child then. If you have kids with some loser you can’t enter and round to other people and say aren’t you lucky to get 600 quid a month contribution towards your child because the mother had a brain and you didnt.

Oh god Quattro.. Still? We've done this already. 1. Whatever childcare fee is still payable AFTER any UC etc should be split. 2. The NRP is much freer time wise to work more hours / two jobs / get qualified for something that isn't nmw.

1. On a decent but not spectacular wage, mid 30sK you'll get v little help with childcare fees so the bill is v v high
2. Why should the RP have to go part time, sacrifice their career prospects and pension to protect the nrp from having to contribute either time or money?

5.Why should the state provide additional benefits to RPs rather than the nrp being asked to contribute a more realistic amount to childcare

1. Why should random family members be expected to be free childcare rather than the nrp?

As for the OP, it's lovely that you want to be flexible and available but the reality seems to be that you've made this job decision based on a hope that may not materialise. Its not that hard to go to court and doesn't have to be horribly acrimonious. Be clear to the mum you are seeking more residency and have taken concrete steps to make yourself available so that your application is not just pissing in the wind. Be prepared to demonstrate that you have thought about how to deal with sick days, emergencies etc like RPs have to.

@Jessie75

Well more bloody fool them. I earnt more than the minimum wage back in 1998 and I realised i couldn’t afford a child then. If you have kids with some loser you can’t enter and round to other people and say aren’t you lucky to get 600 quid a month contribution towards your child because the mother had a brain and you didnt.

Wow, so people on minimum wage shouldn't have kids?

Does that go for women too or just men?

You know somebody has to do those jobs, don't you?

It's nothing to do with having a brain. What a vile and snobby comment to make.

@HugeAckmansWife

Oh god Quattro.. Still? We've done this already. 1. Whatever childcare fee is still payable AFTER any UC etc should be split. 2. The NRP is much freer time wise to work more hours / two jobs / get qualified for something that isn't nmw.

1. On a decent but not spectacular wage, mid 30sK you'll get v little help with childcare fees so the bill is v v high
2. Why should the RP have to go part time, sacrifice their career prospects and pension to protect the nrp from having to contribute either time or money?

5.Why should the state provide additional benefits to RPs rather than the nrp being asked to contribute a more realistic amount to childcare

1. Why should random family members be expected to be free childcare rather than the nrp?

As for the OP, it's lovely that you want to be flexible and available but the reality seems to be that you've made this job decision based on a hope that may not materialise. Its not that hard to go to court and doesn't have to be horribly acrimonious. Be clear to the mum you are seeking more residency and have taken concrete steps to make yourself available so that your application is not just pissing in the wind. Be prepared to demonstrate that you have thought about how to deal with sick days, emergencies etc like RPs have to.

Again, I don't agree. There should definitely be discussion about childcare fees first. If agreeable then yes split after UC.

You would still get help though, even if it's TFC and then if you're saying split it, what's the issue?

Nobody is saying anyone HAS TO go part time. Unsure why you think that.

The state provides to anyone who can't. If an nrp doesn't earn enough to pay £££ (again, someone has to do the min wage jobs) they simply cannot pay it. If you're so against state help you're welcome to love somewhere that has none. I would rather state help went on child benefit and UC towards childcare than on people who cannot be arsed to work.

Nobody should be expected to help, but there may be someone willing and able on the NRPs side who would like to help for say a day a week. A grandparent for instance is not a "random family member" - many many people use grandparents for childcare, it's not an outlandish suggestion.

Also the NRP working two jobs etc - when do they see their child? Or do they just simply not?

People on minimum wage are more than welcome to have children that applies to both men and women but don’t come and then complain that other people decided not to make those choices and be jealous and bitter towards them.

We’ve covered the race to the bottom comments it’s at least seven times in this particular thread.

And no somebody does not have to do those jobs for so little money, the pandemic demonstrated very clearly that society doesn’t work without people doing cleaning, shop work etc you would’ve thought they might of grasped that opportunity to unionise and start making demands for a more fair society where they’re paid for the contribution they make, that that’s all sounds a bit too Communist isn’t it 🤦‍♀️

@Jessie75

People on minimum wage are more than welcome to have children that applies to both men and women but don’t come and then complain that other people decided not to make those choices and be jealous and bitter towards them. We’ve covered the race to the bottom comments it’s at least seven times in this particular thread. And no somebody does not have to do those jobs for so little money, the pandemic demonstrated very clearly that society doesn’t work without people doing cleaning, shop work etc you would’ve thought they might of grasped that opportunity to unionise and start making demands for a more fair society where they’re paid for the contribution they make, that that’s all sounds a bit too Communist isn’t it 🤦‍♀️

I don't think anyones being jealous or bitter by pointing out some people simply cannot afford the amount you seem to expect. It's not hard to understand is it?

And yes I agree minimum wage jobs should pay better, but the long and the short of it is right now, they don't, so where would you suggest people get this money from?

Unionising and making demands clearly doesn't work - look at the NHS payrise. Even if it did, it's not a short term solution.

I think you're being very closed minded and showing your privilege here.

If you only see your kid 4 days a month as many nrps are happy too, that leaves plenty of time to work extra jobs or hours to provide an appropriate and proportionate level of maintenance. In the end its v v simple. Most RPs pay far far more of their income, whether thats earned or UC toward childcare and other related expenses than an NRP. That isn't fair. The only reason this happens is because of a lack of political will to put a robust system in place of both maintenance and contact.. Eg for the OP, it shouldn't feel so impossible for him to achieve a more even split if thats what he wants.

@HugeAckmansWife

If you only see your kid 4 days a month as many nrps are happy too, that leaves plenty of time to work extra jobs or hours to provide an appropriate and proportionate level of maintenance. In the end its v v simple. Most RPs pay far far more of their income, whether thats earned or UC toward childcare and other related expenses than an NRP. That isn't fair. The only reason this happens is because of a lack of political will to put a robust system in place of both maintenance and contact.. Eg for the OP, it shouldn't feel so impossible for him to achieve a more even split if thats what he wants.

You're right, it shouldnt be so hard for him, but it is.

I don't think you should have to work two jobs just because your ex thinks you don't pay "enough". What is "enough". For some people nothing is ever enough.

That's why there's not a better system, it's too ambiguous. One child does not cost the same as the next.

Whilst I agree for some people maintenance is not enough, people can't pay money they don't have. I don't know what the solution is. I don't think it's forcing people into second jobs.

@3mealsaday

And yet lots of mums manage even though the max they can get back from UC for one child per month is around £650 per month. Still, they manage to pay any amounts on top of that, whereas it's unthinkable that non-resident dads could unless they're 'wealthy'.

Not been funny. But we need to be sensible and realistic I can read you and some others are struggling. I'm a single parent and actually I get the full 80 percent of my childcare fees paid!! Along side working....I absolutely think that the NRP should step up but there's stepping up and demanding that pigs fly FFS.

A lot of people simply don't earn that type of money it's a simple as that!

@Jessie75

Well more bloody fool them. I earnt more than the minimum wage back in 1998 and I realised i couldn’t afford a child then. If you have kids with some loser you can’t enter and round to other people and say aren’t you lucky to get 600 quid a month contribution towards your child because the mother had a brain and you didnt.

This is really shallow. Get off your high horse. Many people had good jobs before having kids perhaps ill health cropped up or they couldn't do unsociable hours as a single parent any longer. There's many reasons!

And the point was dont sneer at those who aren’t in that situation… its not a race to the bottom as has been stated about a squillion times 🤦‍♀️

@Jessie75

And the point was dont sneer at those who aren’t in that situation… its not a race to the bottom as has been stated about a squillion times 🤦‍♀️

It's not a race to the bottom but you're sneering at people less fortunate than you which is apparently okay