Active discussions

Meet the Other Phone. Flexible and made to last.

Meet the Other Phone.
Flexible and made to last.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

Talk
AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

Child maintenance

315 replies

anonforpost · 01/01/2022 18:45

I pay my x 570 PCM for child maintenance as per CMS calculator. AIBU to expect not to pay anything on top of the amount. I believe 570 should be enough to cover all expenses of my 2 year old child.

OP posts:
Getyourarseofffthequattro · 02/01/2022 23:39

@HugeAckmansWife

Oh I can, but it involves a complete overhaul of cms, folding it in with hmrc and a fleet of specially trained judges to hear each individual case and review properly every 12 months. But there's no political will or money for that so we leave the deeply flawed and institutionally sexist system we have in place because the vast majority of the 'victims' are children who are invisible in that they can't vote and women who can quickly be gaslighted and dismissed as greedy lazy cows who want their nails done in the nrps dime. Of course the other solution is to bring men up to think it's not OK to fuck off and abdicate 98% or 100% of parenting.
I mean I am doing that... I don't think most parents intentionally don't do that.

But when people think children shouldn't have more contact in the name of routine we're never going to get to that are we?

HugeAckmansWife · 03/01/2022 00:11

quattro that is a separate issue. RPs denying or reducing contact for whatever reason is a valid and real issue, but not relevant to this discussion. The op has said nothing about being denied greater contact.

Getyourarseofffthequattro · 03/01/2022 09:40

@HugeAckmansWife

quattro that is a separate issue. RPs denying or reducing contact for whatever reason is a valid and real issue, but not relevant to this discussion. The op has said nothing about being denied greater contact.
No, the op hasn't but others have. And apparently he is only allowed to reduce his maintenance if he has the child more (and not because of any actual finance related issues) But what if he can't? Should he have to pay x amount because mum says no?

This is the issue with the demand to pay half isn't it? Too many variables.

Excitedforthefuture · 03/01/2022 09:46

@ancientgran

I find it quite strange that my exDIL has always complained that my son didn't pay her enough for my GSs maintenance. She now pays me the exact same amount although she earns more than him, inflation has increased and he is bigger and older and has more expenses. Hard to get my head round.
Huh?
Mellowyellow222 · 03/01/2022 09:51

@aceintgran have you gone to cams for child support?

Mellowyellow222 · 03/01/2022 09:51

Cms not cams

liveforsummer · 03/01/2022 10:42

While it seems like a lot it's a significant cut and if her present outgoings are based on the original amount it may leave her (and dc) in trouble. How much, for example, is childcare? It could be double what you are now paying

liveforsummer · 03/01/2022 10:58

@Excitedforthefuture I think she's saying that as a grandparent who now cares for the dc she is getting the same amount in maintenance from dil that dil previously received when she cared for the child and complained about not being enough. What isn't clear is why her son isn't also contributing

ancientgran · 03/01/2022 11:06

[quote Mellowyellow222]@aceintgran have you gone to cams for child support?[/quote]
I haven't and I know I would get alot more financial support if I did but it is a difficult situation and I am trying to do the best for a child who has been through alot. But thank you for the suggestion, in other circumstances it could be the answer.

liveforsummer · 03/01/2022 11:07

@ancientgran surely she only has responsibility for half the child maintenance though compared to your son having full responsibility so the same amount is fair?

ancientgran · 03/01/2022 11:11

[quote liveforsummer]@Excitedforthefuture I think she's saying that as a grandparent who now cares for the dc she is getting the same amount in maintenance from dil that dil previously received when she cared for the child and complained about not being enough. What isn't clear is why her son isn't also contributing[/quote]
He is, he gives me more than the mother does so I do get financial support, the puzzle is that say he was giving her £x and she felt it wasn't enough although she is his mother and should also be contributing to costs, I now get £x times 2 (with a bit more from dad due to inflation) and she thinks that is more than enough.

I can only assume she didn't think she should contribute or she thinks as he lives with me I am now responsible for any costs she was covering.

I don't think I'm explaining it very well although it is clear in my head, think I'm tired.

Mellowyellow222 · 03/01/2022 11:13

@ancientgran I assume it is a very difficult and sad situation for the child of neither parent is able to care for him and only parent can contribute financially.

As others have said in normal circumstances both parents would be paying you child support so the mothers contribution would probably be less than your son used to pay.

HugeAckmansWife · 03/01/2022 11:13

quattro if an NRP chooses to reduce his income and passes that reduction on to the RP with no benefit in terms of reduced childcare costs or more child free time so they can work themselves, that is clearly wrong. You are raising a totally different scenario where the nrp is in reduced circumstances not by choice. In that scenario I would expect them to bust a gut and reduce all other outgoings as much as possible before cutting cms and not, as any do, just cut it and leave the RP to pick up the slack or have the child lose out (which they rarely see the consequence of as they aren't the ones on the spot). As for 50% costs, Ive agreed there are practical difficulties in that but the current situation, with cms so low in most cases is also unsatisfactory. You seem happy with current unfair status quo. I'd rather see one that is fair, but if thats not possible, I'd absolutely rather the nrp was pinched than the RP and child. If it can't be fair, les have it unfair to the grown adult who can work two jobs if needed, not the child or the adult who is keeping everything spinning.

Mellowyellow222 · 03/01/2022 11:15

I was wrong it shouldn’t be less - sorry - fuzzy logic

ancientgran · 03/01/2022 11:15

[quote liveforsummer]@ancientgran surely she only has responsibility for half the child maintenance though compared to your son having full responsibility so the same amount is fair? [/quote]
If she thought £x was not enough for his fathers support why would she think that is now more than sufficient for her contribution? Why should my son have had 100% responsibility. Don't you think the RP should also be contributing financially?

So when GS was with his mother his father was paying and mother (who earns more) should also have been contributing to his costs. I'm his grandmother why shouldn't I get finance from both of them? If I went to CMS she'd be paying more than his father would due to her income. She works in public sector so I know what she earns due to her level and years in the sector as I used to be public sector so know how it works.

ancientgran · 03/01/2022 11:22

[quote Mellowyellow222]@ancientgran I assume it is a very difficult and sad situation for the child of neither parent is able to care for him and only parent can contribute financially.

As others have said in normal circumstances both parents would be paying you child support so the mothers contribution would probably be less than your son used to pay.[/quote]
Why would she pay less support than his father paid her? They were both responsible for his financial support then and are both responsible for his financial support now. If what his father gave her wasn't covering 50% of his costs why would them both giving me that amount suddenly be more than 100% of his costs now?

ancientgran · 03/01/2022 11:23

@Mellowyellow222

I was wrong it shouldn’t be less - sorry - fuzzy logic
Sorry just saw your update.

I do think it confuses people when mother and father are both responsible for paying for child maintenance. In my case, and others I've heard of, the formerly RP doesn't seem to think they have an equal responsibility.

Jessie75 · 03/01/2022 11:25

@ancientgran Take it up with the CSM then absolutely fantastic they won’t hesitate to slap an attachment of earnings on it

ancientgran · 03/01/2022 11:29

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Mellowyellow222 · 03/01/2022 11:40

Ancientgran I hope your son has a very good reason for not being there for his son?

I can’t think of a reason that would be good enough to be honest.

His son clearly needs him - why on earth isn’t he there for him?

Mellowyellow222 · 03/01/2022 11:41

Also if your son knows you are out of pocket why isn’t he contributing more?

Yes his mother should be also contributing her fair share - but why is your son standing back letting you raise his child and suffering financially for it?

His mum seems have issues, but your son also sounds like a disappointment as a parent

Getyourarseofffthequattro · 03/01/2022 11:43

@HugeAckmansWife

quattro if an NRP chooses to reduce his income and passes that reduction on to the RP with no benefit in terms of reduced childcare costs or more child free time so they can work themselves, that is clearly wrong. You are raising a totally different scenario where the nrp is in reduced circumstances not by choice. In that scenario I would expect them to bust a gut and reduce all other outgoings as much as possible before cutting cms and not, as any do, just cut it and leave the RP to pick up the slack or have the child lose out (which they rarely see the consequence of as they aren't the ones on the spot). As for 50% costs, Ive agreed there are practical difficulties in that but the current situation, with cms so low in most cases is also unsatisfactory. You seem happy with current unfair status quo. I'd rather see one that is fair, but if thats not possible, I'd absolutely rather the nrp was pinched than the RP and child. If it can't be fair, les have it unfair to the grown adult who can work two jobs if needed, not the child or the adult who is keeping everything spinning.
It's not clearly wrong if their financial situation changes though, is it? Where do you expect him to find the money?

Ah I see you expect them to suffer but nobody else to. Got it.

This is it with you, the nrp is nothing more than at ATM.

Getyourarseofffthequattro · 03/01/2022 11:46

I'm not "happy" with it but it's at least workable, which your idea is not. I don't agree that someone should work two jobs and therefore barely see their child just so that their ex doesn't have to make any compromises. And you're going to say it's not about the ex, but it is because it's them in charge of the money. If I for instance got say 750 a month, reduced to 550 it wouldn't make a bit of difference to my child because their well-being wouldn't rely on it. The day to day costs are simply nothing like that much. Would I prefer my ex to work two jobs to put hundreds in a bank account for my child every month or would I rather him see him more? For me there is no contest. But then I would do my absolute best not to rely on maintenance having had a dad myself who didn't pay any.

ancientgran · 03/01/2022 11:48

@Mellowyellow222

Also if your son knows you are out of pocket why isn’t he contributing more?

Yes his mother should be also contributing her fair share - but why is your son standing back letting you raise his child and suffering financially for it?

His mum seems have issues, but your son also sounds like a disappointment as a parent

My son does contribute, he contributes more than she does although she earns considerably more.

They are both disappointments believe me.

Jessie75 · 03/01/2022 11:49

I totally agree just save the child-support and then if it ever disappears you will never build in your life around it. Although I have to say that caused me problems when I applied for a mortgage because I had to explain that yes I did get child-support, no it is not court ordered because courts don’t do that any more, no I did not want that counted in my affordability calculation and yes I was weird and no I didn’t anticipate the support stopping. Neither the broker nor none of the banks get their heads around it.