To feel like f*** them all.

[Outsidermum]

DH family. They’ve just never accepted me. I’ve been excluded at every opportunity and I’ve known them now for over 20 years. It’s been obvious and it’s also been passive aggressive. In the early days it was very obvious. They’d tell DH they didn’t really like me. They preferred his ex. It was hurtful. They’d try to get him to go see them alone and not invite me. His DM said when I was pregnant that he didn’t have to stay with me “just because of the baby”. They warned him not to marry me. I’ve never done anything to any of them - they just didn’t warm to me. I honestly can say hand on heart I was always lovely and really tried. My face just didn’t fit. I am very non confrontational and mild, I’ve put up with more than many would. Even when I knew what had been said about me I’d sit there in my PIL house being friendly and pretending to be comfortable and happy, wishing it was time to leave already. My DH never showed any sign that he wasn’t in a happy relationship and always defended me (quietly to them in private of course). Sometimes he didn’t notice the smaller digs or actions but that’s men for you.
A couple of his female siblings are nice to me on the surface and stab me when my back is turned. I’ve learned not to trust them. The SIL is as bad. BIL are both kind but they don’t rock the boat and why should they. When we got married abroad it was the perfect excuse for them all not to come (by then I was glad not to have them there). Photos of us were never put on display in his parents house. Even when we gifted them of us and the DC. Photos of his ex were put on display in the upstairs bedroom where we slept when we stayed over. They’d not been there the first time DH showed me his old room. It was shocking now I think about it more. I kept thinking it must have been accidental - why would you put out photos in frames of DH with his ex. I wouldn’t have the nerve to be so blatant.
The children of his siblings referred to DH as Uncle DH and I was just outsider mum (we are talking years in, kids that never knew him without me). Presents would be received with “Thank you DH” or “Thankyou Uncle DH” and I would be sat there, the one that bought the gifts! My FIL wanted to take photos of DH and our DC. DH tried to include me and was met with “we will have one with everyone in, in a minute”
I’ve stopped caring. I now feel like “f* them” We moved some distance away from them all in the first few years and I now don’t feel inclined to visit. In fact I don’t feel inclined to visit ever again. I don’t answer the phone when they call. We only go to see them now for large family events and I’m even considering just making my excuses. I’m sure DH would feel more comfortable without me there and I know I don’t want to go! Yesterday DH had a text from one of the nephews who’s now a teenager “Thank you Uncle DH for xyz” I just give up. In the early days so many things were said that I actually used to think I could leave DH and never have to endure them again. I still have this thought. Sorry this was so long and well done if you got this far. I suppose my point is, I feel like I want to detach from them all. To protect my mental health. Life’s too short to have to mix with people who don’t like you and treat you like a piece of crap. AIBU?

I would go completely no contact, not even large family events. If your Dh wants to see them that is up to him however I would question why someone who is meant to love you would want to see people who openly hate you and treat you badly. In a way this gives them exactly what they want, you not there.

Again re your children why would they want to spend time with people who are mean to their Mother? Mine would certainly refuse to go.

Your Dh doesn't have to do a face to face confrontation but just email them and tell them he is tired of their attitude toward you and is not prepared to see them. Sounds like they favour the other grandchildren so why would he make an effort with his parents when they treat his wife and children this way? Same with the nephews, don't just correct them by adding and Aunty Outsidermum but tell them it is bloody rude and how dare they do this.

Wow. Stunned you and dh haven't taken a giant step back from this a long time ago. You must be very patient and caring (to your own detriment in this case I think).
I'm very glad your dh who must be very conditioned to accept this dreadful treatment has managed not to replicate those relationship dynamics by marring you though. That at least is one big positive, as so often children of toxic parents sadly repeat it all in their choice of spouse. I think you lovely gentle souls just need to skip off over the horizon together.

I'm NC with my bullying, PA, vile PILs. They'd wait until DH was out of the room and start in on me. When I had DC and had that post-natal fog they ramped it up.

DH was a product of his family. You've not said what your DH is in their dynamic, but mine was the scapegoat child, the accidental pregnancy too soon after his sibling's birth. The useless, stupid, unpractical one he's an engineer with a degree and he's always, always wrong in their eyes. He couldn't defend me because he himself needed to get out from under their bullying. I always come onto threads where the DH is expected to do better to say sometimes by posters. Sometimes they just can't, and if they are a victim too - well we don't blame those...

Go NC as it's the best thing for you. Completely NC with anyone of that ilk.

Honestly your DH sounds like an enabler. He should not let his family treat you like that and should have made it clear that you're included otherwise he will not continue to visit etc

I don't know how you can sleep next to a man who allows people - his own family - to be abusive towards you. That's what it is - abuse.

Long-term, sustained, relentless abuse. Your husband weakly flaps about saying the occasional word but actually doing nothing to truly defend you.

He should not be visiting them alone. What message does that send? 'I've left my hated wife at home because you've all won'? No way.

I'll tell you what he is doing - protecting himself. He doesn't want to be NC, cause a scene, disrupt his position as adored son, invite conflict. So he doesn't defend you so he can instead remain 'safe'.

He lets you take the brunt of abuse because rather you than him.

His family is vile, no doubt about that but the fact he doesn't bother to look out for you is worse IMO.

What use is a husband who doesn't love his wife enough to protect her?!

Good that you've got to the point where you aren't happy to allow them to treat you badly, OP. You may even find that when you draw a line and refuse to allow them to act horribly to you that they improve their behaviour. (They may not!)

My one thought is that you will need to consider how you discuss this with DC. They will probably notice, they may ask questions and they may make awkward comments.

It's hard to get a balance of honesty and diplomacy, so when you speak to your DH make sure you are both on the same page and can explain to the children in a straightforward way that doesn't make them feel awkward or worried.

In my experience it's usually the secrets and the unspoken issues that fester in families. And interfamilial strife can upset children, especially if they don't understand what's going on. So best to be open with your DC without getting too much into history and detail.

'Mummy doesn't get on with ILs' is probably enough! That's honest enough that they'll understand but not be discombobulated by not knowing what's going on.

Others may think it's better to say nothing, but I think we sometimes underestimate how perceptive children are to these things.

I would mentally check out from all of them, but above all, your husband.

He has caused this issue by not signalling early on to his family that their behaviour was unacceptable and that he would choose you.

I have this in my own family. There was child abuse growing up and my father shoved me out of the family when I brought it up and my siblings and other relatives went along with it. It is a narcissist family dynamic.

I always liken the people at the centre of this dynamic it to the exceeding cruel child who gets pleasure from pulling the legs off live animals who never grew out of it. It is the best way for people like us who would never do stuff like you’ve experienced to conceptualise it. Unfortunately these types of people are master manipulators and thrive on power and control like you are experiencing secondary through your husband’s siblings and the grandchildren. These people actually get a kick out of treating you like shit and the worst thing you can do is react because they only enjoy it more. The best thing you can do is stay well well away like you are doing and also understand their nature so you don’t have to take their faults personally. It isn’t about you anymore than it would be about the random animal the child selects to torture. It is about their damaged nature.

It is an aspect of human nature that is common enough to be concerning but uncommon enough that you can literally relatively easily avoid the people like that for the rest of your life too. Take care of yourself you do not deserve to be treated like this.

Absolutely go NC with them, I wouldn’t want anything to do with these people. You don’t need to make any excuses to your DH, just tell him the truth, you’re not wanted there and you’re not prepared to sit there anymore, let him go with the DC and enjoy a nice day out yourself instead

No, do not let DH go on his own with the children.

You need to present a complete family unit to them, or they will think that they have won.

Either you all go, or none of you go.

I can’t believe your dh has allowed this. I could not respect my dh had he allowed this for so long.

Your husband may be kind and gentle and all other lovely things but...but..he has allowed his disgusting family to bully and exclude you for many years. Probably as said by pp, to protect himself as he can't emotionally deal with facing it head on.
I applaud you for finally taking a stand and saying enough is enough.
I would be telling DH that you will no longer have anything to do with them and going forward he can sort out cards and presents as your contribution has never been acknowledged so you won't be bothering in future. I would be telling my kids exactly why you are going NC with their awful grandparents etc. Why should you protect those bullying awful people. You have been far too kind and gracious for too long.

I have gone nc with people for less than this and l don't do that sort of thing lightly but 20 years of it??
Nobody could blame you for never seeing them again as long as you live!

A former boyfriends uncle had a new wife and child, child was about 10, and the couple seemed very happy, I visited their house once. But my boyfriend, said that she wasn’t regarded as family, his ex wife was, and she was still always invited to family occasions with her children .
I met her too, it was a strange atmosphere at a big family party, but fair, for all parties I think.
The Grandmother, told me she loved both families, and had felt it was best to welcome both wives, as they were both family, which I thought was a lovely sentiment really, and she full embraced both women, and all of her Grandchildren equally.

So although my boyfriend may not have thought of the new wife and child as family, the Grandmother did, and she was an important factor for family unity, she did say it wasn’t easy, but she was determined to make things as nice as possible for her grandchildren.
Lovely woman…

The only way to deal with this is for you and your children to go no contact forever. No way should those venomous family members be allowed any access to your children.
If your husband cannot back you up on this then ditch him too because he doesn't have your back and why would you want to be with someone who just stands there hand wringing and not actually stopping their behaviour. Vote with your feet!!

Oh and stop buying them cards and gifts!! Cannot believe you are still doing that.

My ex’s sister and father were like this and I was always taking the “high road.” After my divorce I stopped having to deal with them and was amazed at the relief/lack of stress. I never should have been so “nice.”!we have backbones for a reason.

Sounds very unkind. However to exclude your husband from his family would be unkind too so probably best just to tolerate them a few visits a year but don't buy their presents of course - if your husband wants them to have presents he can buy them and wrap them and hand them over.

However on the photos this Christmas I did one without the husbands etc first as I wanted one of my 8 blood descendants first - first photo of them ever as there is a new baby amongst them and then adding me on. After that I added the WAGs etc so we had one with everyone on. It was a not a slight to the husbands. It was just wanting the different combinations of people.

They sound awful. Let your husband read this thread. I would go no contact. 💐

I can totally relate to what you have written here - apart from the ex photos scenario it sounds so familiar. I also had the ex is much better kind of talk. I do think you need to have a grown up conversation with them - perhaps a word with your father in law as he seems to be more approachable/ not the instigator of these personal slights. He may just brush off your concerns but you have to be more direct and more assertive here to fix this. Alternatively, do just cut them off and let your husband go to his parents without you. Either way you should feel better and I hope things improve. Relationships with in laws are strained at the best of times, it's worse at Christmas I find. I managed two whole days with mine - nearly finished me off.

I would make a vow today never to see them again. They've behaved so badly. Of course they'll know why you don't visit in future and your husband should be blunt with them. If they can dish it out, they should be able to take it.

It it were me, I’d explain how I felt to DH, that I was not prepared to put up with being treated like a pariah any more. So, no contact or he needs to sort it. Have to say, I’d be really upset if my DH had not sorted it before. No more mild comments - direct confrontation - if you won’t accept my wife, you’re not accepting me etc.
Can’t believe photos of the ex put in the bedroom for you. Id’ve taken them home.

Stop doing his family grunt work for him: no more present buying, no more visiting 'gifts', no more making arrangements to see any of them.

If he wants to see them, do birthday/Christmas presents, share a meal, he does all the shopping and makes all the arrangements.

He can go by himself; you're out.

And you're allowed to ban them all from your home if you're going to be around. Why should you have to be subjected to people who treat you like shit in your own home ... you shouldn't.

@driftcompatible I agree with every word.

Being with someone who doesn't have your back is completely pointless.

Everythig you have described is not normal. The ex pictures in the house, WTF?

If my DH saw that at his parents he would rip them a new one and take us all home immediately, going NC until they do some serious grovelling.

My mum spent years keeping the peace and encouraging my dad not to fall out with his family. But it never works in the long run - these people believe they are entitled to behave like this.
My mum and my dad would have been better off cutting their losses years ago. My grandparents are dead now but my dad finally cut my aunt off when her nastiness started to spill over onto my dad's children. By that point it was years too late!

It does make me sad that DH relationship with his family will be seriously affected by all this but it isn’t my fault. My own DM always told me to go still and ignore them. But I just can’t anymore.