DP uncomfortable about a school run dad taking DD swimming

[Eastie77Returns]

DD (8) will be attending swimming lessons at a new venue in the New Year. There are a couple of other kids in her class who attend lessons at the same pool, I am friends with both sets of parents. I was chatting to the dad of one of the kids and he mentioned that he and and the other child’s mum take it in turns to take both children swimming each week. He asked if I’d like to join the ‘rotation’ which would mean taking all 3 kids every 3 weeks and I said I’d be happy to. We all live a few minutes walk from each other and DD knows the 2 boys well. I’d already discussed this with the other mum so she is on board.

DP has announced he is uncomfortable about the arrangement as there is a male parent involved (when I originally mentioned the plan to him he thought it would only be mums). I think he is being absolutely ridiculous, I have known the school dad since our children were 2 years old and DD adores him.

However I discussed this with a friend who said she 100% understands why DP is unhappy and I need to see this from his point of view. AIBU??

@BraveGoldie

The girl is undressed. Often young kids don't lock cubicle doors. Men - the dad and any others - have a perfect excuse to be around right by the cubicle. It is a very obvious, desirable place for an abuser to hang out and spy a kid who doesn't have an attentive mother. Nobody knows who belongs to who or is paying attention. They are busy with their own kid. Nobody would question somebody going into a cubicle to 'help' a child. Even if the father taking her is totally trustworthy, he's got three people to watch at once.

I am not an anxious or paranoid person but this really isn't zero risk.

I agree with this. If you trust the guy then no one can really say anything but I'd be weary on the basis that you just don't know what's happening when you or DP isn't there. You won't be sure if someone approaches her in the changing room, you won't be sure that she's definitely looked the door. There's just so many things that you won't be sure of. As this poster has said, he'll have two other kids to be looking after. As I said before, better safe than sorry. I agree with your DP on this even though I don't think you said his reasoning (unless I missed it)

You have to listen to dh concern but I think if you explain the set up he should surely be comfortable? The 3 children will be together. The changing room is busy. Dd will dress herself in the cubical.

You're dh is being unreasonable. There is almost no risk.

Op has said the dad is not going in the changing room.
Are people ignoring this?

You’ve known him for years…so?

Family members abuse, who they knew from birth, they still abuse though.

Truth is you never really know everyone, so just best safe than sorry.

Women do abuse too- but the chances of it being a man is ridiculously higher that it’s almost not worth being afraid of other women as there are so few compared to men

A unisex changing village would make me feel more uneasy than single sex spaces. He may or may not be a peado, but at least in a single sex space he doesn't have easy access to an undressed, otherwise unattended prepubescent girl for a short period of time. In a changing village where anyone can move freely in the space it would be very easy for him to engineer a "Sarah needed a hand with her jumper so I popped my head in on her" situation.

For everyone who is #notallmenning, not all men are predators but until the men that do are stopped then ALL men will sadly be treated like Schrödinger's rapist when it comes to children.

If she's almost 9 and she can dress herself independently in a cubicle on her own I wouldn't have an issue with it at all.

I think you need to point out to your DP that his attitude could significantly limit his daughters opportunities compared to if she were a boy.

I was just as cautious with our son.

My dd would have been uncomfortable with this herself at 8-9, sorry.

Just the fact that she'd be the female 'on her own' to get dried, dressed etc and no, she wouldn't be comfortable asking the dad for help if she got stuck in/out of wet clothes etc.

She was perfectly capable of dressing independently but would much prefer a situation where it was at least other female children and definitely a female parent.

So no from me.

I wouldn't think it a high safeguarding risk but it certainly is one, more as folk have said, she'd basically be without an adult keeping an eye in the changing village because she'd be keeping away from all the others in her group. I wouldn't like it much.

I don't see the issue here.
If the activity wasn't swimming ie Brownies or football would people have a problem with a girl having a lift with a male?
The DD is getting herself changed in private and the only time she is with the dad is with other kids. Therefore it's no different to any other activity.

Yanbu he is she is 8 and will be in female changing rooms not male and so I really can't see the problem of her being driven there and back as I assume would be OK if a drop and go party. Also if u all took your own children he would be at pool anyway.

My 7yo dd changes herself no problem.

To be honest I feel really sorry for men this day and age, any dad just trying to help is basically branded a pervert.
I would question how your DH would feel of this was flipped over?

I feel more sorry for women and girls than men’s feelings being hurt. Good men understand why women and girls need to protect themselves and don’t take offence. It’s really that simple.
My partner wouldn’t offer to take other children. He certainly wouldn’t feel offended that other parents are looking out for their children, he’d be glad they are.

OBVIOUSLY you shouldn't be allowing this. Jesus. How do some people even come to have actual human children.

Haven't RTFT but all OPs posts.

Yanbu.
3 kids, changing cubicles, age 8 can change themselves. Walk there and back (not seeing what difference mode of transport makes!). Known him for years.

I cannot see any issue with this at all.
It wouldn't even cross my mind to worry in these circs.

I thinking asking DH what specifically he is worried about would be a good thing to do.
Uncomfortable is way too vague. Then you can talk about what he's actually uncomfy about.

And it really good be anything.

• Maybe he has heard something but not told you? (Men do gossip!)
• Maybe he thinks he's flakey/ a boozer/ hangs out with local dodgy types
• Maybe he's worried about strong views that DH doesn't agree with being expressed to kids?
• Maybe he is worried about inappropriate behaviour to DD, (I'm guessing the main focus on the thread)

point is need to find out for sure.

If it's just. Generally not comfy with man taking DD swimming.
Then I would ask specific questions and that conversation should put mind at rest.

Like.
What exactly are you worried about, think could happen?
Seeing DD in swimwear?
Grooming her?
Somehow doing something while on way walking with his child, or going home walking with his child? (Own child first to be there, last to get home).
Doing something while she in cubicle? Like what?
Loads of other parents children about changing, having lesson. No doubt some parents waiting outside kid cubicle to say get a move on, what do mean forgotten hat? Etc.

A vague unease about... Something. About a man family known for years. And in a situation where opportunities to do anything are essentially absent.

I mean sure a determined crafty experienced extreme predator could. But I mean that's like so unlikely that if worried about men that dangerous being everywhere need to keep her at home until adult.

Make him spell it out.

IF he insists full stop. Then he's not being rational, and you need to think about how this will impact DD generally iyswim.

This would never have occurred to me.
What about sleepovers, play dates etc? Is she not allowed to go to those?

@SarahBennettAdvice1978

OBVIOUSLY you shouldn't be allowing this. Jesus. How do some people even come to have actual human children.

Have you actually read what the scenario is?

I don’t trust men as much as I trust women and their is a reason why

I can understand his concerns. Has he met him ?

He’s not taking them swimming, he’s literally dropping them off and waiting in a cafe. What’s the problem?! Does your DH have a bad vibe from him?

Good grief, I can't believe so many of the replies on here.
Your dp is definitely the one being unreasonable and, quite frankly incredibly insulting to the friend's parent on here.

Your dd is 8, almost 9, and has a voice. She will be having a lift with her two friends and not be alone with any adult at any point.
At what age is your dp considering allowing her to have a lift from a friend's parent ?

Wow the hypocrisy. The amount of threads saying 8 year old boys should go into changing rooms on their own and nobody gives a shit.

Some posters on here we nuts. The vast majority of people pose no threat to children so unless your Dh has good evidence and knows otherwise he’s being ridiculous.

OP have you looked at the arrangements here? At our pool (which has a unisex changing village) parents are away in a spectators' area unless the children are too young to get changed themselves.

In your scenario the kids would get out of the pool and sort themselves out, and the parents would not go into the changing area at all but meet them once they are ready.

In that scenario I can't see the issue at all.

Also your dd is nearly 9, quite old enough to tell you if something bothers her.

OBVIOUSLY you shouldn't be allowing this. Jesus. How do some people even come to have actual human children.

@SarahBennettAdvice1978 have you actually read OPs posts?

Reading back not getting cubicle risk.

Changing village surely will get 3 cubicles close together as possible, and hover outside.

Cubicles have locks. 8yo use locks when getting changed in cubicles! How will he pop his head in?

DD could get in intractable tangle with swimsuit?
He takes opportunity to get in there with her?

In practice would she really ask man for help? I wouldn't have, 8yo girl surely vast majority no way in hell!

Anyway easy.
Oh when Dave takes you obv neither of you want to be in situation you not fully covered.
If you ..? Bang head, get tangled up, um...?
Just shout Dave is a mum/ woman about to ask for a hand. If not then sure female member staff would oblige.

Don't want Dave embarrassed or not know what to do, do we hahaha.

Simples. Not a bad idea tbh as I know DH would panic about what to do in that situation!

@OhWhyNot

I don’t trust men as much as I trust women and their is a reason why

I can understand his concerns. Has he met him ?

Yes, I have. It's similar to hundreds of situations that are reported every year where sexual abuse has occurred (and probably thousands that haven't been reported).

I feel more sorry for women and girls than men’s feelings being hurt. Good men understand why women and girls need to protect themselves and don’t take offence. It’s really that simple

@HangingOutWithTheSandman totally agree

You won't be sure if someone approaches her in the changing room, you won't be sure that she's definitely looked the door

But that would be the case if OP took her too? OP says parents don’t actually go into the changing rooms, they wait in the cafe. So if OP took her herself, that would be no protection against a random predator breaking into DD’s cubicle.

Are you saying OP needs to go and lock herself into the cubicle with her DD to ensure nobody else gets in? Until what age? 16? 25?