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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To think DH is selfish denying the DC Christmas?

486 replies

ohganggang · 16/12/2021 21:35

Been together 7 years, married for 5. We have a 4 year old DD, a 2 year old DS and I'm pregnant with out 3rd. DH was raised as a Jehovah's Witness, they do not celebrate Christmas as they believe it is satanic. The religion has a shunning policy and DH got shunned by his family and friends when it came out he was in a relationship with a non-JW (me) at the start of our relationship as that is forbidden. He is essentially dead to his mum, dad and siblings.

DH had stopped believing in the religion long before I came on the scene and was just keeping up pretenses for his family until he got found out. He is now as atheist as they come. He has a lot of religious trauma from his childhood, from growing up believing the world was about to end, watching the kids at his school celebrating Christmas and 'knowing' they were going to be killed in Armageddon for it (they teach that God will kill literally everybody who isn't a JW, no exceptions), being taught that the world is run by Satan etc etc. He lived his childhood in perpetual fear. I have advised him to seek counselling and he won't.

He now rejects anything to do with religion, and can't be doing with Christmas. He actually gets depressed every year around the Christmas season and says it's because it brings up the trauma of his childhood. Because of this, we've never bothered with Christmas together. For the first couple of years of the relationship before living together, marriage and DC I'd just go to my family on Christmas Day as usual. Christmas 2017 after DD was born, we stayed home and did nothing and it was the first year I didn't do anything for Christmas. Me and DH had a conversation that year and he said he doesn't want to do Christmas with our kids as it will trigger his trauma and remind him of the childhood joy he missed out on. He also wants the kids to be completely atheist and have nothing to do with religion. I accepted that.

But DD is now 4, and in pre-school, and the pre-school is making a huge deal out of Christmas coming up soon. I find this problematic because obviously it causes issues for families like mine but we're in a small town with not much cultural diversity so I think they've assumed all of the kids will be celebrating at home. They absolutely haven't considered some families might not be celebrating Christmas and I've debated raising a complaint, but that's another thread. Naturally, the talk of a Christmas nativity, the kids being hyped up about an upcoming Christmas 'party' and general encouragement for the kids to talk about Christmas among themselves, has resulted in DD getting excited for Christmas.

I have told DH today that I don't think it's fair on the kids and that I don't think it's right to project his trauma on to the kids. To me it seems like a case of "I didn't get to have Christmas so why should my kids?". I do understand his trauma though. I tried to compromise saying we don't have to decorate the house but I am doing presents for the kids and me and the kids will go to my parents on the day to celebrate and he can stay at home. He says no, that he isn't comfortable with his kids having "that religious bullshit in their lives". I'm really annoyed with him.

OP posts:
JustLyra · 16/12/2021 22:58

He needs to get therapy for the sake of his children.

I had to have a lot of therapy when my girls were born because of my childhood. Different reasons, but same fact - I owed it to the children I'd chosen to bring into the world to get my head sorted for their sake.

"remind him of the childhood joy he missed out on"

I'd be pointing this out to him bluntly and telling him that he is inflicting the same missing out on his children and you won't stand for it.

This is absolutely a hill I would die on because you've seen how damaged he is. He doesn't get to do that to your children as well.

Adelais · 16/12/2021 22:59

He needs to grow up and put his children first. Why should they have to miss out on the joy of Christmas, especially since he knows from experience how it affected him not celebrating Christmas.

My partner was raised as a Jehovah’s Witness too and didn’t celebrate his first Christmas until his mid 30s and loves being able to celebrate it with our kids.

Has he had counselling? You need to stick up for your kids.

rwalker · 16/12/2021 23:00

Many many people and religions don't recognise Christmas and it's just another day ,
If that a you belief then thats your belief .
Him not wanting anything to do with christmas is no more right and wrong than you wanting Christmas it's just at opposite ends

NoNameHere12 · 16/12/2021 23:01

I had a shit childhood, I loved it when I had kids because I got to do everything with them that I was denied and even though I was an adult I loved every minute of it!!!!

He doesn’t need to miss out twice- he is allowed to love Christmas! It’s fun!! That’s what life should be about right.

rwalker · 16/12/2021 23:02

@Adelais
He needs to grow up and put his children first. Why should they have to miss out on the joy of Christmas, especially since he knows from experience how it affected him not celebrating Christmas.

Thats quite insulting to the religions who don't recognise Christmas

WildImaginings · 16/12/2021 23:03

He's a fucking arsehole and you've gone along with it. Poor kids.

Yuppie20 · 16/12/2021 23:04

So born and raised a JW myself and I understand where he is coming from, well sort of!
I never celebrated birthdays or Xmas but now I do and have maybe over compensated a bit! I am completely atheist as well.
I would never allow my son to feel the way I did, completely isolated and different from everyone else, always missing out of the fun while I had to sit on the side and just watch everyone else.
Also a few things seem a bit dramatic unless his congregation was a bit out there. I grew up thinking revelations could come true any minute and the worldly people would all die when paradise on earth came etc etc but the whole satanic side of things didn't really come into play. I'm assuming he was disfellowshiped if his family don't speak to him too which is probably where the real trauma lies.

You really need to think about whether you want your kids to feel the same way he did growing up and possibly feel that same trauma to some extent. He is being incredibly selfish really

Rachie1973 · 16/12/2021 23:04

@ohganggang

I think inside he is still that little boy who watched his classmates talking about Christmas with complete and utter terror thinking they were going to be murdered by God for it any day.

He won't get it dealt with.

Yup, we got that. But he’s still hurting his children.

You’re still letting him.

Stompythedinosaur · 16/12/2021 23:05

Can't you do an entirely secular christmas? We do.

I agree he is being unfair to the dc - they will miss out on a huge cultural norm.

He needs therapy, either trauma focused CBT or EMDR I'd suggest.

Ionlydomassiveones · 16/12/2021 23:05

This reply has been withdrawn

This has been withdrawn at the poster's request.

Mooscow · 16/12/2021 23:05

"This must be the first thread ever that has united the atheists, Christians, and now Satanists into speaking with one voice."

🤣 True!

RhubarbCustardy · 16/12/2021 23:05

Surely if you've had a bad experience by missing out on Christmas then you'd want better for your kids? He sounds immature 'well if I couldn't have Christmas why should they?' because you don't take it out on your kids thats why.
Apart from all of this, Christmas isn't really religious anymore except if you go to eve mass on Christmas eve etc.
The other way of looking at it is to make a lovely Christmas for him too and say why don't we make up for all the Christmases you missed and make it really special ? He doesn't actually know what Christmas is like if he's never had it.
Its been a shit couple of years, surely he wouldn't deny you Christmas? I'd put my foot down and he'll just have to grow up and suck it up. Then go get some counselling/therapy as others have suggested.

Noisyprat · 16/12/2021 23:07

Why do his views trump yours?

southlondoner02 · 16/12/2021 23:08

@ohganggang

He's gotten, much, much worse with it since having children though admittedly was always anti-Christmas. I have Muslim friends with kids who don't do Christmas and I always assumed it wouldn't be that much of a problem and yes now my opinion is changing. I admit that.
Presumably your Muslim friends celebrate Eid though? This isn't just about Christmas but about being cut off from your culture.

I'm an atheist but celebrate Christmas because I live in the UK, a culturally Christian country. My children do the same as it's their culture. Plenty of people living in the UK with other religions don't celebrate Christmas (although lots do) but they keep in contact with their culture through other festivals and special days. What your DH is suggesting is leaving them without those reference points which is unfair.

He can't forbid you to not let the children celebrate. Personally I'd carry on with celebrating Christmas with your children. This is his problem to sort out, not theirs.

Clymene · 16/12/2021 23:08

He needs therapy to stop taking out his childhood trauma on his own children.

Religion has nothing to do with Christmas for most people. It's a pagan festival anyway.

Whydoiwearsomuchleopardprint · 16/12/2021 23:11

I’m not religious and I celebrate Christmas as for us it’s about family, love and giving, you don’t need to be religious to appreciate or enjoy that side of Christmas!

MMMarmite · 16/12/2021 23:11

He needs to work on his trauma. I have every sympathy for what he went through, but he is now responsible for changing these patterns. I think it would be fair, based on what you've previously agreed, to skip all the Christian elements. But it seems so unfair to deny your kids a tree, Santa, decorations, roast dinner, presents, because of his trauma.

CactusLemonSpice · 16/12/2021 23:12

He doesn't want his children to celebrate christmas as it will remind him of missing out on celebrating christmas as a child? That doesn't sound fair...

It does sound like he has been through a great deal of trauma. However, I think there needs to be some separation between his feelings about his own childhood, and the decisions he makes as a parent. With so much trauma not worked through, he could be making reactive/emotional decisions rather than responsive ones based on his values.

The Philipa Perry book is good, 'the book you wish your parents read'... although it is not about trauma, more about separating your own feelings from your parenting choices.

It does sound like therapy would be a good idea for DH although I understand not everyone is open to therapy.

NandorTheRelentless · 16/12/2021 23:12

@theworldsgonefeckingmad

LTB

All he is doing is trying to give his children the same traumatic childhood he had, they will hate Christmas because of the bad memories of back to school everyone talking about it and they will be the only ones who haven't had a Christmas Sad

This

He suffered so his dc should as well??

NandorTheRelentless · 16/12/2021 23:15

They absolutely haven't considered some families might not be celebrating Christmas and I've debated raising a complaint, but that's another thread

Don't be that parent.

Don't allow dh to stop your children enjoying a holiday and fun

I'm atheist, but we have a tree or 4, and it looks like a tinsel explosion in my house

FortniteBoysMum · 16/12/2021 23:15

Maybe celebrate it as a day of giving. Call it santa day if it makes him happy. Point out does he want his kids feeling like they miss out the way he did. Make it a big day for him too.

NovemberNovemberDarkNights · 16/12/2021 23:16

Well, I understand how traumatic his childhood was, but when you chose to become a parent, you need to put them first in things like this.

He won't get help, he's willing to inflict his childhood misery onto his children.

It was a PAGAN Festival before the Christians latched into it & made their story fit around it.

If he wasn't willing to do pretty decorations, presents & Santa (not nativity/church/religious carols) for me & our children then I'd divorce him because he's a selfish twat & I would NOT allow him to spoil my childrens childhood with his attitude!

This Christmas can you go to your parents Christmas Eve & stay there for a few days?

NovemberNovemberDarkNights · 16/12/2021 23:17

Oh yeah, and don't be a twat yourself & complain to the school. You'll only spoil it for other children.

nosyupnorth · 16/12/2021 23:18

I'm going to go counter to a lot of people here and say that there needs to be some respect for your DH's beliefs.

If he was jewish or muslim (for example) would everyone be so quick to overrule him and say his kids should be celebrating a religious festival he doesn't believe in and he should be going along with that?

Billions of children around the world don't celebrate christmas every year -- not participating in a religious holiday, especially while not of that religion, is not abuse.

I think it's worth discussing with your DH if you can compromise on the less overtly religious elements of christmas like santa and having a tree, but I can completely understand his objection to things like them taking part in a nativity -- frankly the lack of secular education options in this country is a disgrace, you shouldn't have to pay in order for your child not to taught to participate in christianity.

He said he wanted the children raising atheist, you agreed. You can't call him unreasonable when you are the one who has changed your mind.

Scottishskifun · 16/12/2021 23:21

Does he see that he is basically repeating the cycle to a lesser extent by doing this?

He is clearly traumatised but is also projecting that onto your children probably through fear.

He needs therapy and a specialist at that.
In the meantime he can say no all he wants your response is I'm not letting you project your trauma onto our children and repeat the circle you had