To worry that I might lose my British citizenship one day because of the new law going through parliament?

[flashbac]

I was born here and so was one parent.

There is a Bill that has just been passed, while we were all distracted with shenanigans with parties and what not, that will allow citizenship to be revoked without notice.

I know the power to remove citizenship already exists but the without notice bit is quite scary. I assume that means someone could happily go about their business until they need to show right to be in the UK e.g new job or new rental and then poof, they can't access things and possibly get detained and then deported when they enquire about it and it's probably too late to contest it through the courts.

I know the responses will indicate how so many don't care, "don't do anything naughty then and they won't put you in the naughty bin ready to be turfed off to another land" but remember the right to protest, to give an example of how easy it will be to get on the wrong side of the authorities, will also be outlawed soon so anyone could be arrested, if the circumstances meant a person was driven to it, e.g you do a sit down protest outside a hospital because they covered up malpractice or, it's decided that a huge Amazon warehouse is built in the field behind your garden and you wanted to protest with your neighbours.

Lots of people will think this only affects 'foriners' so probably won't care. I think it's awful.

@TooBigForMyBoots

Don’t be so OTT dramatic. Do you think it’s about you? And the average law abiding citizen? Don’t be ridiculous.

Any average law abiding citizen can find itself under suspicion, this bill is broad enough to cover that. Also, the government don't have to tell you!🤯 You could go on holiday and come back to find your citizenship stripped from you and barred from entering your own country.😲😲😲

Well I’m pretty sure you could go to the European courts of human rights or British courts of humans rights…. And if your crime was getting a bit pissed and singing, I’m pretty sure you’d win your case!

Its an old bill which has been about for a while from what I've read? What has changed?

Where are you going to live while you're pursuing your court case @Starcup? How are you going to get money to pay for food and shelter nevermind legal fees? You will be a stateless person stranded in another country.

I don't think you are grasping how serious this is for everyone, particularly British minorities.

The problem is the way this bill could be used.
It does create a two tier citizenship.
I’ve been here before (British subject rather than citizen even though born here).
This bill is dangerous to all ethnic minorities.

The Home Office make many mistakes. Fatush Lala was left stranded in Belgium because apparently his identity was confused with someone else's. He was not allowed to return from holiday www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/fatush-lala-british-man-europe-uk-home-office-sleeping-streets-a9334781.html

You can sign the petition against this legislation here petition.parliament.uk/petitions/601583

IABU because you gave a platform to a certain type of poster. I don't even have the energy to argue anymore, while being unable to feel the layer of protection they have simply by being "proper" British.

@lljkk

Is this a way to deport Priti Patel? I mean... it might not be all bad.

I don't approve of it either OP, but no, you aren't going to loose ypur citizenship.

@TooBigForMyBoots

Where are you going to live while you're pursuing your court case *@Starcup*? How are you going to get money to pay for food and shelter nevermind legal fees? You will be a stateless person stranded in another country.

I don't think you are grasping how serious this is for everyone, particularly British minorities.

Yo think there’s bigger issues to be concerned about right now as oppose to a made up hypothetical situation!

This bill is not a made up hypothetical situation, it is a big issue to be concerned about right now.

The petition linked above is specifically to remove Clause 9, the clause which means the Home Secretary no longer has to inform a person they've being deprived of citizenship.

9 Notice of decision to deprive a person of citizenship
In this section, “the 1981 Act” means the British Nationality Act 1981.
In section 40 of the 1981 Act (deprivation of citizenship), after subsection (5) (which requires notice to be given to a person to be deprived of citizenship) insert—
“(5A) Subsection (5) does not apply if it appears to the Secretary of State that—
(a) the Secretary of State does not have the information needed to be able to give notice under that subsection,
(b) it would for any other reason not be reasonably practicable to give notice under that subsection, or
(c) notice under that subsection should not be given—
(i) in the interests of national security,
(ii) in the interests of the relationship between the United Kingdom and another country, or
(iii) otherwise in the public interest.
[...]
bills.parliament.uk/publications/44307/documents/1132

@TooBigForMyBoots

This bill is not a made up hypothetical situation, it is a big issue to be concerned about right now.

No it’s not, you’re making a mountain out of a molehill. It’s almost like you want to create a drama. How will affect YOU? Do you think you’re going to get tap on the door to say you’re getting deported?

So anyone who objects to this particular change, but not to the rest of the Bill, can safely sign the petition.

@CayrolBaaaskin, yes, there is a substantial difference from existing legislation: this new dilution of the need to inform a person being deprived.

Stop making it about you. It’s a law fo help kick out terrorists! Do you think they should be allowed back here like? Despite despising Britain?

That’s what it’s for so stop acting like a victim. It’s not about you!!!

Your feelings don’t trunk national security….

Trump

Funny you should mention him, Starcup... Just when we're discussing how the unscrupulous try to use laws in unintended ways once in power...

@PerkingFaintly

Funny you should mention him, Starcup... Just when we're discussing how the unscrupulous try to use laws in unintended ways once in power...

It’s like arguing against the change of food at the local prison, thinking you should get a say and be involved incase you end up there one day…

Unless you’re planning on committing a crime then it doesn’t affect you whatsoever ever.

Do you think you’re going to get tap on the door to say you’re getting deported?

They don't have to tap my door. They don't even have to send me a letter. They can close the door on me and strip me of my British citizenship if I go to Ibiza or Paris on holiday, leaving me stateless, homeless and stranded.

And yes, this is about me. I am a British citizen. One from Northern Ireland, I fully understand the sort of shit the British government have pulled in the name of controlling terrorism.

@TooBigForMyBoots

Do you think you’re going to get tap on the door to say you’re getting deported?

They don't have to tap my door. They don't even have to send me a letter. They can close the door on me and strip me of my British citizenship if I go to Ibiza or Paris on holiday, leaving me stateless, homeless and stranded.

And yes, this is about me. I am a British citizen. One from Northern Ireland, I fully understand the sort of shit the British government have pulled in the name of controlling terrorism.

🙄 well if you’re the type of person where your glass is always half full then there’s nothing anyone can say to make you feel better.

@Ace56

Oh for goodness sake. This is being blown out of proportion. As PP have said, you’d need to commit a pretty serious crime in order for this to even be remotely considered, and even then it is heavily debated/brought to court/fought against etc (e.g. Shamima Begum). You’re not just going to be walking around Tesco, living a normal life, and have your citizenship stripped away from you.

This . 🖕

@Mamamia7962

I voted YABU for using the word "foriner". If you want people to take your post seriously don't use stupid words.

Agree

But is it ok that people could have different consequences for the same crime due to their heritage?

This is a terrible piece of legislation. And far too woolly in terms of what can count to get your citizenship removed.

Extinction rebellion was listed as a terrorist group. Hardly in the same league really as terrorists who blow up people is it.

An unscrupulous government could use this legislation to remove 'inconvenient' people from the country. Environmental activists, political campaigners, etc.

Let's not pretend that governments are filled with people who stick to the rules, even the very clear ones that they make themselves!

Appalling people think that restrictions on rights specifically for a whole host of British - yes British - people are ok.
And did nobody read ‘unacceptable to public good’ including terrorism, not even specifically or only terrorism. This is similar to current rules around non conducive to public good where people can be refused a visa for crimes other than terrorism or even apparent behaviours. I expect this clause not to be limited to terrorism in reality and practice - no one will mind a serial rapist being stripped will they, or a drug baron - or then maybe someone who steals a lot, or been arrested a lot perhaps.
Imagine a person born here, availability to apply elsewhere, but they have difficulties growing up, don’t get much support as a million threads around no support for kids in schools/medical, evidence could happen, get in with the wrong crowd, start racking up various offences as a juvenile, get involved in county lines perhaps, tip over to 18, get another arrest, trot to Spain for a fortnight and can’t re enter as you know they’re just getting unacceptable to the public good.
If someone is British and a criminal then actually Britain should deal with them in Britain as they are British and so our problem. Personally, shipping terrorist supporters elsewhere is in my opinion actually not that helpful to our security as here we can deradicalise or imprison and deal with the issue - kicking someone straight out is only likely to encourage acts against us.
Terrorism itself is a subjective term too - Don’t forget that Nelson Mandela was a terrorist- until he was a freedom fighter. Our courts should have oversight of the potential use of any legislation and in this case the government are blatantly avoiding that protection for our citizens. Yes our citizens, we can’t have class 1 and class 2 British.

@Sometimeswinning

Its an old bill which has been about for a while from what I've read? What has changed?

Deprivation of citizenship has always been in the Nationality Act.

It's just been tweaked, as far as I can see, to allow the govt to revoke the citizenship of (for the main part) dual nationals who have (for the most part) been recruited by hostile foreign powers/groups and are (at the time of the revocation) not in the UK. I think it's fairly easy to see which high profile cases have made them tweak the legislation.

It's always also been in the UK nationality legislation that someone cannot be made stateless. No matter what. So, yes, it puts dual nationals or those who have the right to other nationalities at more "risk" though arguably, to arrive at the point where citizenship would be revoked in the first place would seem to infer the subject has already decided they're up for a risk or two of one kind or the other. Additionally, the UK authorities can't comment, or rule on another country's nationality laws so that would make the stateless issue more complex. (Though there are very very few people in the world who are truly stateless- many think they are, or consider themselves to be, but usually the legislation of one country or another recognises them as nationals of that country- the last "big" group of stateless people were the Vietnamese refugees from 30-40 years ago.

Nobody is going to start depriving anybody of their British Citizenship because they nicked a few fags or forgot to wear a mask.