To be so upset about Arthur is it normal

[Onthedowns]

I just cannot stop crying. I know it's another thread but listening to those recordings of that poor boy i have been physically sick and so upset. I have cuddled my children so hard. I came from an abusive background but nothing like him.

I feel completely irrational

Coupled with covid what has happened to society 😔

@Kippersfortea

The fact that both grandmothers wanted to help, reported concerns snd would have housed him/loved him but didn’t get the chance is just fucking awful and people need to lose their jobs as a bare minimum but won’t

@IamtheDevilsAvocado

Disgusting treatment of anyone, let alone a small child.

It IS upsetting, we wouldn't be human if we didn't feel for this terrified child...and feel revulsion at the abusers.

Sadly, there WILL be other Arthurs and Baby P and Victoria Climbie... Social workers can't be everywhere...their abuse will be happening NOW, vile as it is to consider.

The best thing we can all do... Is keep our eyes open for future Arthurs, if you have concerns... report, report, report... It is NOT up to members of public to investigate.

It's the only way it can be stopped.

@IamtheDevilsAvocado.........at last a voice of reason. Please, posters, FFS stop all the squabbling on this thread. It wasn't OP's intention to start a bunfight. I'm an ex social worker, 'though I'm way out of touch as I left in the 90's. My knee-jerk reaction when I knew there had been Social Services involvement in this case was one of utter shame for my previous profession. But I know absolutely nothing about this case other than what I've seen, read, and heard in the media, same as everyone else here on this MN thread. The details of what agencies were involved, and who did or didn't do what, will come out in due course. Child abuse and neglect has happened since time began, and I'm afraid there WILL be more cases long into the future. Unfortunately there is a particular type of human being that ill-treats children, simple as that, and there always will be. I have no idea what extra kinds of pressures social workers are under now compared to when I was practising, but we certainly had no such constraints as "austerity" back then. I certainly knew some incompetent social workers, but I also knew some VERY plausible, manipulative parents. Sometimes you had an uneasy hunch about a family, but not enough proof to take action. That doesn't seem to be the case here, but I've reined in my initial reaction until I know the facts. I can only reiterate what IamtheDevilsAvocado has said, in that all of us are responsible for reporting concerns we have about children. You can remain anonymous, and I certainly preferred to investigate a referral which turned out to be unfounded, rather than people look the other way and be scared of getting involved.

Obviously what happened to Arthur was truelly horrific. And I feel very angry towards his father and step mum

However I find threads like this really distasteful. For me I have read enough to know what happened and I don't need to keep rehashing it. It feels very disrespectful to keep replaying his abuse and I often feel these threads use a young boys distress to demonstrate how empathetic some people are. It's competitive grief, and it's morbid and self serving.

Those videos and recordings are of a real boy, and I think we should give him some dignity. Would anyone want to be remembered by their last moments of distress when they are most vulnerable? Genuinely how would you feel if that video was of you, and a lot of strangers on the Internet started threads about how they kept being physically sick because of something that happened to you. Or if it was your grandchild, or nephew.

By all means feel angry, by all means find what happened to Arthur upsetting. But to start threads detailing exactly how upset you are by it, to me just seems very disrespectful and quite distasteful. It is grief tourism

@Onthedunes

I do not believe in watering down the evidence in this case. If that upsets people - Good.

We need to bear witness to what this poor boy went through.
Any video clips are not there for entertainment, or to make people who want to complain about it being innapropriate is missing the point.

We cannot begin to understand the level of abuse and pain Arthur went through, daily, consistently and without mercy.

That poor boy was broken, I really don't know how he survived as long as he did, he must have wished his own death to get out of that hell.

The least we can do is watch a mere few seconds of his daily life which must have felt never ending. We can cry and feel empathy and anger but nothing and no ones feelings come into this, nobodies distaste of it and no ones upset.

We are remembering Arthur.

Are you saying it is a moral duty to watch/listen to the recordings?

@FourTeaFallOut

I've actively avoided any of the recordings from the case. I don't see any merit in having my nose up to his suffering. I think it's voyeuristic and unethical of the media to publish.

I agree.

I wrote to my MP for the first time, after feeling so, so upset last night when hearing this awful case. The details were enough to make me cry, I haven’t heard the voice clips and I wouldn’t play them. I do agree that the poor boy needs dignity now.
I know feeling emotional won’t solve anything so that why I tried to put my feelings into something productive, even if it is a small step. Also researched being a foster carer to see if this something I consider in the future. If it can bring any change then reporting on this case will be worthwhile.

I work in child protection, not front line, and I am absolutely heartbroken that this boy suffered like this. I will never understand why someone could be so evil. Poor little soul

I sonr have the words. I couldn't bear to watch the clips. It was on the news last night and I just couldn't watch it. Poor poor boy. The wee little boy hasnt even had a decent funeral yet and his final very painful hours are broadcasted nationally? I cant even. I cant bear it.

I had a sleepless night as this, again, triggered me. I cannot bear the statistic that 1 to 2 children die at the hands of their parents or carers in the UK every week. Time after time, we hear the same mantra.

Social Work Services are the very worst professionals to respond to this type of thing. Time and time again they ignore the signs, listen too intently to parents, never take the child aside - the list goes on. Case reviews say the same thing, and God knows I have written enough myself (child protection background).

I can't decide if it is plain incompetence, overwhelm, over-work, or just laziness.

I had the misfortune to make a child protection referral myself recently. it takes a lot of courage. I evidenced and substantiated everything. It could have been cut & pasted and used for the application for a court intervention. Yep, no further actioned. Not even investigated. 7 pages. This, on the back of at least 2 previous referrals of concerns.....school says no issues. Case closed, no further action.

Very similar circumstances. Entire family cut off and denied contact. Child is being deliberately harmed every day - by Dad and step Mum. It is harrowing. All she knows is punishments, withdrawal of food, not allowed drinks. Family can't get near and all Social Work say is apply to the courts for a contact order. Sickening.

I've been broken by it. I don't care if people think that's over invested. I feel he was unheard in life and the least we can do is hear his case, so I promised myself and his memory that I would. My heart goes out to his mum so much. Such a beautiful brave boy who fought so hard to be heard. I think his despair will never leave me. I"ve been massively affected by it.

@CarrotSticks19 I think thats one of the best posts I have ever read on here.

It’s rare that I think evidence should be blocked from publication- it’s a dangerous precedent to set- but actually in this case I don’t think the videos should have been made available to the media. I think Arthur should have been afforded some of the care and dignity in death, that he was denied in life.

I've actively avoided any of the recordings from the case. I don't see any merit in having my nose up to his suffering. I think it's voyeuristic and unethical of the media to publish

I wholeheartedly agree with this.

I do think it's normal and understandable for people to have an emotional reaction to something like this. But I also find some aspects of the public outpouring of grief on social media distasteful. Someone I know has shared a picture of Arthur smiling in a big heart with a caption saying something along the lines of "let's fill Facebook with his smile, please share". I have no interest in contributing to this poor, dead child being turned into a kind of celebrity. I'd rather social media was filled with constructive debate about how to fix our broken social care system. Or the societal problems that perpetuate the cycle of the "toxic trio" (domestic violence, substance misuse and Parental MH issues) that is almost always identified as having been a factor when there is a Serious Case Review because a child has died at the hands of a parent/step parent. But that's never going to happen, nobody would get enough likes or shares out of that. It's easier to post a quick "RIP little man, thoughts and prayers" than it is to think about what got us to this point and I wonder how many people who are distraught about this story today will continue to vote for a Government that has spent the last 10 years systematically underfunding and stealth-privatising the very agencies tasked with protecting children like this one.

Sorry for the rant but I work with vulnerable children, the system is fucked and I'm frankly worn-out by it all.

Also agree with @CarrotSticks19

Feel the same @Applesonthelawn.

Mystified at being told not to express these feelings by folks here.

It's no competitive it's just one of many human reactions to an absolutely appalling case.

I've seen the video - unwittingly - it played on an auto loop on a news site ( I didn't click) those few moments and the captions were more than enough - I'll never ever unsee it.

We cannot and should not turn away.

We cannot and should not turn away.

We owe it to the many children who are right now suffering like Arthur did to do better and strive to not let this happen again.

I listened to the recordings. The poor kid wanted his voice to be heard, nobody listened to him at the time, the least I can do for him now is to hear him.

I was sickened by a headline I read yesterday about his mum because she was in prison he was "left in the grips of his father and step father" it wasn't his mums fault he died. Yes she killed her partner but I happen to know for a fact through work that that murder case was not as simple as her just being a murderer.

I hope that soon little Arthur can be properly laid to rest.

I couldn’t listen to it. I cried at the pictures though. Poor little thing. 😔

I will remember this thread every time I read a poster gleefully proclaiming 'Grandparents have NO rights' in response to some minor tiff, usually with the MIL. Maybe if the grandparents did have rights, their concerns might have been taken more seriously.

@CarrotSticks19

Obviously what happened to Arthur was truelly horrific. And I feel very angry towards his father and step mum

However I find threads like this really distasteful. For me I have read enough to know what happened and I don't need to keep rehashing it. It feels very disrespectful to keep replaying his abuse and I often feel these threads use a young boys distress to demonstrate how empathetic some people are. It's competitive grief, and it's morbid and self serving.

Those videos and recordings are of a real boy, and I think we should give him some dignity. Would anyone want to be remembered by their last moments of distress when they are most vulnerable? Genuinely how would you feel if that video was of you, and a lot of strangers on the Internet started threads about how they kept being physically sick because of something that happened to you. Or if it was your grandchild, or nephew.

By all means feel angry, by all means find what happened to Arthur upsetting. But to start threads detailing exactly how upset you are by it, to me just seems very disrespectful and quite distasteful. It is grief tourism

Completely agree, and all the 'string them up' and 'let them drop' fantasies on the other thread were bordering into sick fantasy, too.

Some real narcissism shining through when picking over this horrific case.

@FourTeaFallOut

I've actively avoided any of the recordings from the case. I don't see any merit in having my nose up to his suffering. I think it's voyeuristic and unethical of the media to publish.

The media may be cynical, but they aren’t stupid. They understand what their readers want, and they know the grief tourists will lap up every gory titillating detail before making a public show of their self-indulgent vicarious anguish. They do protest too much, methinks….

This type of thing brings out my inner thug. Despite how tolerant or open minded we might consider ourselves, this shit creates powerful, primal emotions.
I want to see those bastards tortured like they tortured him. It makes me furious that scum like that can breed. And yet i know nothing is this simple, and my thoughts are perhaps understandably, temporarily .....disturbed. Im not so sure i ought to be ashamed of those feelings - i think it is a healthy reaction, so long as it passes by and doesn't stew. The story made me want to cry, but the anger shifted in too quickly. Real, real fucking anger. And the only sickness i feel is disgust.

21 years inside, pathetic.

@Katyppp

I will remember this thread every time I read a poster gleefully proclaiming 'Grandparents have NO rights' in response to some minor tiff, usually with the MIL. Maybe if the grandparents did have rights, their concerns might have been taken more seriously.

With all due respect child safeguarding is a state responsibility it has nothing whatsoever to do with grandparents and I'm glad my parents have not rights over my children because they abused me and the law as it stands helps me to prevent the cycle repeating.

Or alternately Carrotsticks, it could be genuine feelings that have no other place to find expression. This is not something we can discuss with our partners, our children. I'm for one doing my best to keep it to myself in real life because I don't want to burden them when there is nothing they can do. It has helped me to know that I am not the only one who has found it so upsetting. This is nothing to do with competitive grieving. I am the last person who would virtue signal.

@royco

I don't know why anyone would listen to, or watch the video.

Just reading about it is horrifying enough.

This