To be absolutely LIVID about this email?

[Lividlavidacoco]

‘Hi Livid,

I hope you’re well and your return to work went smoothly? Just to let you know, a few of the mums messaged me after Monday’s session to express discomfort at having a penis in the group environment. They expressed they felt uncomfortable breastfeeding with him in the room and we want the group to always be a safe and inclusive space for breastfeeding mummies. I am a small business so think it’s best that he doesn’t attend again. Sorry for the inconvenience, I’ll refund any sessions you have pre-paid.’

WTAFFFFFF.

Context: I returned to work 2 weeks ago, DH is now a full time stay at home dad to our 8 month old son and he’s loving it. He’s a brilliant father and this will be the set up until DS starts school.

I attended a baby music group with DS since he was 2 months old and he really enjoys it (as much as a little baby enjoys anything!) with other mums. No where in the literature of the group does it refer to mums, everything is ‘baby and parent’ so I assumed him attending the group instead of me would be fine. I told the group leader 3 weeks ago that DH would be bringing DS from now on and she was totally fine about it.

There are only 3 groups for babies in our small town and I attended all of them: a breastfeeding group, a ‘mums and babies’ coffee morning and then the baby music group. Obviously DH can’t attend breastfeeding or the coffee morning so this was the only one he could do

WIBU to fire back an email asking firstly why she feels the need to refer to my husband by his genitals and secondly, where in the group descriptions anywhere Eddie’s it says it’s a mums only group??

AIBU here???

@WomblingKnobhead

What do you feel about the breastfeeding women who feel vulnerable whilst feeding? I think the use of the term penis is shocking and unnecessary

It's a music group, not a breastfeeding group. They can do whatever they'd do in any other space not designed exclusively for breastfeeding. Crack on with it where they are, take the baby elsewhere, feed before & then wait until the short class is finished.

They don't get to dictate a baby class is women only!

@Lividlavidacoco

That's a horrible email (even if you discount what they're actually asking) to refer to your DH in that way is horrid.

Plus see above!!

I'd be tempted to write back & ask how they know DH has a penis? What's in his trousers are his business, not theirs!!

Ridiculous!!

Oh & as much as I'd WANT to rant about it to DH, I actually wouldn't tell him, it's hard enough as a SAHD to fit in/socialise. I wouldn't make it harder.

Please get DH to say at the end of the next group - "Right vagina owning people everyone, who's up for a coffee now?" would love to see their faces

Your DH sounds brilliant btw in his laid back response. Well handled from you both

@Aphantasia

Urgh, she referred to your husband as a penis?? I’d right back and tell her she and all the other vaginas can go fuck themselves

@Lividlavidacoco. I was just about to add, if it's a 'chain' of businesses (like she has a franchise or whatever) I'd forward it straight to the Head Office asking for their feedback.

But

This by aphantasia would be very tempting

Urgh, she referred to your husband as a penis?? I’d right back and tell her she and all the other vaginas can go fuck themselves

Send her a box of chocolate chocolate penis sweets?

Please do this!

https://www.etsy.com/market/chocolatepenis?gbraid=0AAAAADutTMdpp2fOvXh0fvwZDHk0aG8T&utmmsource=google&utmmedium=cpc&utmmcampaign=SearchUKKDSAGGLLENGGeneral-NonbranddCatch-AllNew&utmmag=UK-ENDSA-General&utmmcustom1=kkEAIaIQobChMI3JbmxaHH9AIVxOvtCh3NcgjVEAAYASAAEgK3oPDBwEEk&utmmcontent=go1112072734221121183102275444533175955dsa-19959388920mm&utmcustom2=11120727342&gbraid=0AAAAADutTMdpp2fOvXh0fvwZDHk0aG8T&gclid=EAIaIQobChMI3JbmxaHH9AIVxOvtCh3NcgjVEAAYASAAEgK3oPDDBwE

She didn't actually apologise though, sh said sorry this has happened. I think that's a shit reply tbh
Wouldn't it just be easier if she spoke to you?

@JetRocket

You are completely right…obviously. That’s a hideous email and horrid to exclude your DH.

All I will say is that it’s the other mums to blame not the class owner. They’re over a barrel as their income and livelihood relies on lots of attendees coming. The class owner will always side with the majority because being morally or politically correct doesn’t pay their mortgage. It would be very different if it were a large company would could absorb a small loss in the interests of ethics.

Nope.

In a similar situation the complainants got told that it was not a 'mummies' PUKE class, but a baby class & they needed an accompanying adult to assist them. In parallel language they were told what was under that adults clothing was of no consequence & if they didn't like it they could fuck off find another group.

I don't sell my soul/integrity/morals/common sense/whatever, for pennies.

It's nearly 20 years since I was going to baby and toddler groups and whilst in the minority there, were always some dads (and one grandad) at them, always welcome.

Is this a sign of the times or demonstrative of a small section of society I wonder? I bet this isn't in an area where 30% have free school meals like my groups were

Glad it's (sort of) been sorted out but ,and i may have missed it , why did she address the email to you and not your husband , surely she would have some sort of contact details for him ?

That doesn't excuse the organiser thinking it's ok to exclude Mr Livid on the basis of the other members of the group feeling uncomfortable having a man there though. She (assuming it's a she) thought it was ok to send that email when she thought it represented the majority view. So whilst Mr Livid is now officially welcomed back with open arms, the original complaint still stands IMO.

@EightWheelGirl

Although I do feel the organiser is probably somewhat stuck in the middle. But she could’ve been more tactful. Guarantee she’s a feminist!

She's not caught in the middle at all.

Women have the right to breastfeed where they like, they don't have the right to make every space they fancy doing it in 'breastfeeding mummies' PUKE ONLY.

All the woman needs to do is remind the stupid 'breastfeeding mummies' that it's a music group for babies with an accompanying adult & whilst they're free to bf, they can go elsewhere if the presence of a man bothers them.

Well handled @Lividlavidacoco. Mr Livid sounds a star.

I pity the child of complaining mum, what a poor example of how to have adult relationships this child is going to have.

@Lividlavidacoco

The ‘penis’ comment will have definitely been the language the mum used now I know who she is. No doubt. Not sure why the leader saw fit to repeat it but there you go!

Exactly. Why on earth would anyone think it the right terminology? Unhinged.

@BonnesVacances

That doesn't excuse the organiser thinking it's ok to exclude Mr Livid on the basis of the other members of the group feeling uncomfortable having a man there though. She (assuming it's a she) thought it was ok to send that email when she thought it represented the majority view. So whilst Mr Livid is now officially welcomed back with open arms, the original complaint still stands IMO.

Agree with this.

I'd still be showing head office her email.

Good outcome I am very happy for you all.

OMG, so TwatMummie thought that the answer to her own social inability to manage a coffee situation was to get him kicked out of the activity? Gif I HATE this awful passive aggressive inability to communicate except through some nuclear option. You see it all the time on threads here.

She sounds well toxic, too.

And I hope group leader has had time to reflect on her ethics and legal responsibilities. She’s bloody lucky that you did choose to communicate in a direct and honest way because had you gone straight to the franchise with a complaint she may have found her small business in jeopardy.

FWIW I wouldn’t take it further: it’s your DH’s situation, TwatMummie has failed and everyone knows how horrible she is.

Please get him to refer to the other women as "you vaginas" next time he goes!

Anyway, it’s almost certain that one way and another the group leader will get a heads up about this thread. And see the full and frank appraisal of her legal position and moral failings… but good that she back tracked. Though ‘for any offence caused’ is one of those disingenuous mealy mouthed apologies and makes me itch.

That's still not good enough and I will still forward to head office 🤷

He really needs to take his penis-having friends along to the next session.

Great result OP.

In his words ‘what’s she going to do, chop it off at the door??’

I need to raise a complaint at this.

I was drinking quite hot coffee when I read it and snorted it through my nose, now my nose hurts.

I shall accept my compensation in pennies to make it easier for you.

TBF, if I were your DH I'd be tempted to turn up at the next class, stand just outside the door and put DS on the floor on the right side of the door. Or if DS is mobile, let him crawl into to class while DH waves from the corridor. That way DH isn't involved in the class but DS is and then see what the 'girls' all think about that

And it wasn’t a trans issue after all.

@CounsellorTroi

And it wasn’t a trans issue after all.

No, it's a Mean Girls issue.