AIBU to think parents shouldn't get preferential treatment when it comes to time off work?

[KwestTurkey]

I just read an article on Facebook about this. A parent had asked a childfree colleague if she could have some of her saved holiday days and was refused (understandably).

That's obviously a CF request. But in general, what do you think about parents and holiday requests Vs childfree colleagues?

I don't believe parents should be given priority when it comes to time off on any holiday, be it summer or Christmas etc.. I think it should always, generally, work on a first come first served basis. The amount of times I was refused any sort of time off in the summer because every single parent in the office had booked off the summer and they were given first dibs on those dates used to annoy me.

I'm a parent now but my opinion hasn't changed on that. I think if someone childfree has gotten there with the request before you then that's tough.

Same with Christmas, if you work a job that requires Christmas working, I don't think it's fair to allow the same people off every Christmas year in year out.

It's definitely something I've experienced in my workplace before and after having DC and it feels very unfair.

I really don't think it's anyone elses responsibility to ensure you get time off during school holidays or things like Christmas and that a childfree colleague has as much right to book the time off as any parent.

So...

YANBU - parents shouldn't get preferential treatment or priority when it comes to time off work.

YABU - they should.

I don't know because when we agree the Christmas rotas at work we would always let the person with little kids not work the late shift on Christmas Eve, so I worked the late on Christmas Eve a couple of times when it was my turn. Now I am the one with a baby and toddler, and I said id prefer not to work til late on Christmas Eve, which I'm not. I think the kids aren't young forever so don't see a problem in trying to accommodate them

@StrawberrySanta - my DT’s are now 22 but I expect (and do) have Christmas Eve off work as that is the day DT’s arrive in the U.K. for the holidays. This year it’s my colleague with a five and seven year olds turn to work over the Christmas break

@strawberrysanta

What if you never have children, are you happy working the late shift forever? What if you have to travel far to get to relatives, are you happy working the late shift forever? I am so done with well I did it before I had kids so now I dont have to do it anymore because I have kids. For some of us our turn is never going to come, that does mean we get the shit shifts for the rest of our working lives

@StrawberrySanta

I don't know because when we agree the Christmas rotas at work we would always let the person with little kids not work the late shift on Christmas Eve, so I worked the late on Christmas Eve a couple of times when it was my turn. Now I am the one with a baby and toddler, and I said id prefer not to work til late on Christmas Eve, which I'm not. I think the kids aren't young forever so don't see a problem in trying to accommodate them

But for child free people the children are young forever. When your kids grow up and go to uni there will be other colleagues with young kids. There aren’t just your kids.

@rookiemere

You have literally pointed out that you dont have enough holiday to have all the school holiday off, so you are unlikely to take the full six weeks in summer I assume? But its still mean for someone without children to take a week off to sit in the garden in the sun if thats what makes them happy?

My right to sit in my garden (which actually isnt want I do, but I should be able to if I want) is absolutely equal to your right to look after your children. Thats equality. You dont get to say my reasons are mean, what if that week in the sun is literally what I live for each year and the only thing that makes me happy? Screw you if you think its mean to want that in my life, despite the fact most parents arent even going to need the full six weeks left free for them anyway. I think your attitude is mean to be honest

some people struggle to understand this so let me try to explain it with an example

I am Linda, I work in a shop that is open Boxing Day. I start working there in 2000. There are 3 members of staff plus a manager. On boxing day 1 member of staff plus a manager needs to be in.

2000 - Linda works with Rose and Julie, they both have children under 3, Linda works boxing day.
2001 - Linda works with Rose and Julie, they both have children under 3, Linda works boxing day again, she's not overly happy but it feels mean to complain
2002 - Linda works with Rose and Julie, they both have small children, Linda works boxing day again, she speaks up but is reassured that they will do the same for her 'when her time comes'
2003 - Rose has left. Linda now works with Julie and Lorna. Julie cannot get childcare for boxing day and Lorna requested boxing day off at her interview. Linda works boxing day but is reassured by Julie that she will make sure she works it next year.
2004 - Julie has left. Linda now works with Lorna and Charlie. Lorna claims when she said she couldnt do boxing day at her interview she meant every boxing day, and Charlie's baby is under 1, it seems kinder for Linda to work boxing day so she does.
2005 - Linda find out she cant have children and her time is never going to come. Linda books boxing day off well in advance. However a week before Charlie's mother gets ill and cant look after her child and Lorna is still refusing to work boxing day. Linda works boxing day.
2006 - Charlie and Lorna have left. Judith and Rachel start, they both have children under 3, its just assumed by this point Linda will work boxing day. When she speaks up Judith promises to work next boxing day.
2007 - Judith has left, guess what, both of Lindas colleagues have young children, Linda works boxing day. Linda gets fucked off and despite being the most experienced member of staff and therefore the one the management should want to keep she feels she had no choice but to leave and go somewhere where they have a fairer holiday rota.

But of course this system and obligation some of society want to force on non-parents is completely fair and reasonable right?

But for child free people the children are young forever.

Ding ding ding.

I'm on my 7th consecutive Christmas cover this year (for my current workplace). The ones I covered for the first year are now nearly 10. That doesn't mean I'm off the hook, because lots of others have had babies since. It's a never-ending cycle.

@biscuitsforcheese You've... literally given an example of my actual life. Down to the discovery of infertility on the 5th year of employment. That's incredible. You're a wizard!

(I'm trying to leave!)

@rookiemere

I don't think DPs should get preferential treatment but when you have an under 12 and 10-12 weeks of school holidays and get only 6 week of holiday yourself, it is a challenge.

I appreciate it is a self generated one and nobody's problem but the DPs own, but nonetheless oddly enough most DPs prefer to take the holidays at the same time as their own DCs. That doesn't mean they get to hog all the best time off, but it does seem mean to say that someone's right to sit in their garden equals that of a DP to look after their DCs.

Maybe I'm biased though as can't wait until DS finishes school and I no longer have to work around the holiday dates and can enjoy cheaper times away.

But the thing is it's nobody's business why someone has requested leave.

It's not mean for someone to request leave and sit in their back garden, even in school holidays. They don't need to justify that holiday to anyone.

School holidays are tricky. As a parent of two kids who's partner often worked away from home over the entire summer holiday I understand. However that's a known issue and if you can't get time off then you need to arrange an alternative. I would have been horrified if I was given priority over someone with no kids or adult kids.

My work do it in a first come first served basis and also consider the work required. No one is guaranteed a holiday. And although we close for Christmas a few staff have had holiday requests for the week before refused. Simply because there is work that must be done.

@biscuitsforcheese
Idiots for not keeping linda and I'm sorry.

@AudacityBaby

Pretty much my life too at one point! Luckily I work somewhere much better now (in fact on the very very slim off chance you work in data send me a pm and I will point you in the direction of a vacancy in a nice team)

I hope you do find somewhere where you are treated better!

‘ If we want happy, well rounded young adults in society we need to support parents who want to put time & resources into young children. ’

Oh shush. Sending your kid to a holiday club doesn’t mean they aren’t going to be well-rounded.
You’ve got all year round to pay attention to your kids- it doesn’t have to just happen in holiday time or at Christmas. Some might argue reading with them and helping them with their homework is more important to taking them to Tenerife in the summer.

I know plenty of parents who work over Christmas, have done for years and quietly got on with it. It’s a shame if there are parents out there demanding they are more important than anyone else but I think these people surely think they are more important than even other parents. Perhaps they are the minority. IRL I have never experienced these type of parents, may be I’m very lucky but I really don’t think you can tar all working parents with the same brush. We are not all entitled twats.

@StrawberrySanta

I don't know because when we agree the Christmas rotas at work we would always let the person with little kids not work the late shift on Christmas Eve, so I worked the late on Christmas Eve a couple of times when it was my turn. Now I am the one with a baby and toddler, and I said id prefer not to work til late on Christmas Eve, which I'm not. I think the kids aren't young forever so don't see a problem in trying to accommodate them

Many people dont care if they work late on Xmas Eve though. Only people I know who have cared is those with young kids, those of German origin and very religious people.

Many people dont care if they work late on Xmas Eve though. Only people I know who have cared is those with young kids, those of German origin and very religious people

I don’t have young kids, am not of German origin and am an atheist, yet I don’t want to work late (or in fact, at all) on Christmas Eve.

The main reason I don't work is because DH has a job with awkward and variable hours and my old field requires full flexibility (city law). Most of the roles that interest me don't fit the hours I can do around him (he is on call 1 in 4 weekends (at best) plus 1 variable night a week). I can just about get him to mostly protect 1 evening a week but he'd not be guaranteed to be back for any childcare pick ups and is unreliable for childcare dropoffs (variable on calls).

Christmas and other bank holiday availability is the least of the issues keeping me stuck at home with the kids but certainly limits my options...

@sammylady37 fair enough. I actually realised before I was married I would not have wanted to work Xmas Eve as I had an 8-hour journey to my parents for Xmas day. Now I don't care. I would work Christmas Eve for parents of young children, if I can get say Easter off instead?
I don't think most care about working one of the days most people want off, but not every day.

@KwestTurkey

Unless you’re lucky enough to have a retired grandparent who is happy & capable to look after the children, what is the alternative?

Well put very bluntly, it was your decision to have children, not your colleagues.

Well, without kids, no society. I agree that holidays should be shared - but it's sad to see so many use this argument: having kids was YOUR decision. No. Having kids is also a societal decision.

I hated that old chestnut when I worked years ago.,,., but I’ve got kids!

Anyone with caring responsibilities should be given priority, really don't understand people who don't have kids getting annoyed about this, the way our society is set up penalises parents, usually mothers for having a job and kids and just expects childcare to magically happen and not impact work at all. I think you people without family or caring commitments can suck it up. Yes everyone should aim to be flexible but the ways things are mothers need all the help they can get.

@greendiva children have fathers too.

At one place I worked, all the staff members with children got priority for Christmas/summer holidays - even when their children were in their mid/late teens - which meant that staff without children didn’t get a look in at peak times (ie all school holidays), which caused a lot of resentment.

But what I don't understand is why people without kids would want to take holiday when the kids are off!
Seriously? You cant understand that some could be married to a teacher. Or that many events and festivals happen in holidays. I haven't got responsibility for children but I like to take a week off in August to go to the Edinburgh Fringe and usually take Feb half term off to skiing with my friend who is a teacher. I happen to like Christmas off as well!

I think parents should prioritise their children, so having a job which requires holidays in order to give your children what they need is not prioritising your children, it's prioritising work and then asking that work to sort out the issue that you did not prioritise your child. I'm aware this will not be a well-accepted message but that is my thoroughly considered opinion.

Caring for a child is a full-time job and it's one thing to give your child time away from you say with family but if you work full-time then you aren't being a full-time parent and I honestly believe children deserve full-time parents and parents who consider it a full-time job to be a parent.

A full-time job is 8 hours a day. Then the child gets the rest? People can get upset by my stance but unless they can explain to me how 8 hours for a job and the excess for the child, often at morning and bedtime when the child is tired and getting ready for school, is not prioritising a job over a child, they can moan all they like, it's not a rebuttal.