To ask you to see who girl guides support.

[RedCarpetRebellion]

www.google.com/amp/s/www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-10235539/amp/Girlguides-launch-probe-trans-Commissioner-58-saucy-dominatrix-style-picture.html

A woman sacked for speaking up for girls safety was replaced by this person.

Girl guides are not safe for girls. AIBU?

Signing a letter written by someone who is an activist indicates an interest in their position.

If you sign a letter written by Graham Lineham it says something about your views on women's rights. If you sign a letter by Aimee Challinor it says something else.

There is a connection. But this is semantics and missing the point of the thread which is about Guiding and the safeguarding of girls.

This makes me so sad. Im a guide leader having a break for personal reasons. I loved guides as teenager - my leaders were wonderful, strong women who showed me that I could do anything. We had fun doing things we would never have had the chance to do - camping, hiking, campfires, first aid, canoeing. We did do a few crafty things but guides was about trying new things, gaining skills, giving service. I feel sad the organisation I love has become so politicised. My experience on the ground is that most units try to run despite the missives from HQ. Grassroots guiding and Hq guiding are two different things. Sad times.

Signing a letter in support of a person does suggest you support that person - seems a bit odd to have to point that out. This GG leader has declared their support for Challenor which leads to people questioning their judgement at the least.

It is very noticeable that the standard for judging the suitability of trans candidates for roles in GG is completely different from the standards for women. No woman who photographed herself in a dominatrix outfit would be permitted in GG.

@Lockheart

But no one said anything about a ‘close connection’ they just said ‘connection’ which is true. If you often sign letters by people without checking their background and credentials then that’s on you I’m afraid.

I've signed letters in support of Graham Lineham, does that mean I'm connected to him? Because as far as I'm concerned I have no connection to him at all. I don't know him, I've never met him, never spoken to him.

Signing a letter someone has written does not give you a connection to that person.

But you are aware of him and agree with some of what he has to say.

So you have, at some level, an ideological connection with him.

But Glinner doesn't carry the long and openly disturbing baggage that the Chellenors do!

WTF.

I googled this travesty to find out more and what do I find? Girl guides fired someone for raising safeguarding concerns. And then they hired the dominatrix with guns and started to hand out condoms.

www.newarkadvertiser.co.uk/news/amp/investigation-launched-into-guide-commissioners-social-medi-9227238/

There's something about someone being unsuitable for roles involving children who is found out to have volunteered to multiple children involved organisations.

I don't like it.

Have we reached the NATWALT stage yet?

Gross. They don't let boys in to guiding but a middle aged dominatrix with a cock is just fine. Vote with your feet and send your daughters to Scouts instead.

[quote HoardingSamphireSaurus]@DrSbaitso yes. Girls wanted to join the scouts for the activities. So Socuts became a mixed sex organisation, with all the safeguarding that entails.

But men want to join the Guides as women. Girl Gudies have acquiesced and accepted them as wmen. So no safeguarding has been done as Guides remains single sex by dint of being single gender.

Which is why so many women stronly object to that change in terminology!

This is about safeguarding. An issue often highlighted by some now permanently banned posters. I doubt we could shout I told you so loudly enough![/quote]
Absolutely. It relies on the belief that males are literally female on the utterance of a sentence that says it is so. So no extra safeguarding takes place.

For anyone else woefully behind like me - here are what some of the terms / people keep referring to actually mean…

autogynophilia - sexually turned on by fantasies of being a woman

GRC - gender recognition certificate

Aimee Challenor - en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aimee_Challenor

(This woman recruited family - ie VERY close connections (!) ie her known paedophile father to be her managing agent at the Green Party and husband expressed disgusting sexual fantasies of children on Twitter.)

Graham Linehan - anti trans activist who argues that transgender activism endangers women, and he has likened the use of puberty blockers to Nazi eugenics programmes. (Wikipedia)

@EverNapping

YABU - go back to the Feminism boards, that's what it's for

Putting such nonsense to the side for a moment - there will be many mums here who don't consider themselves feminists but would still prefer their daughters not to be provided with condoms whist at GG by a non appropriate adult

I expect your going to be very busy policing AIBU for all the threads you feel should be elsewhere. Good luck with that.

I find it terrifying the amount of people that rent aware of what's happened to GG. My kids are older now but I would not be sending them to guides or brownies now.

It's awful for all the decent people that have dedicated their time over the years volunteering and providing a safe fun space for girls. My local pack is merging with another one because of the rate of girls leaving, and this has a lot to do with the reasoning.

@HoardingSamphireSaurus I agree on all points, but holding up this person as having a connection to Challenor on the basis that they signed one open letter is IMO misleading and intended to do nothing more than aggravate further.

Surely there's enough to be concerned about here without having to stretch the truth.

The person in question is also involved in Scouting. As an inclusion advisor but given they posted a photo in uniform, probably in a youth facing role too.

Fuck.

I wonder if I can send her to PGL. Is there anywhere that will accept that men aren't women and child safeguarding is necessary?

@DrSbaitso

If feminism is the only movement to give a toss about child safeguarding, you can count me right in, and draw your own conclusions about those who sneer at it.

👏 👏

[quote PumpkinGin]WTF.

I googled this travesty to find out more and what do I find? Girl guides fired someone for raising safeguarding concerns. And then they hired the dominatrix with guns and started to hand out condoms.

www.newarkadvertiser.co.uk/news/amp/investigation-launched-into-guide-commissioners-social-medi-9227238/[/quote]
"Monica, who referred to herself as Mistress on her Instagram page, took over the role after Helen Watts, a supporting member of the Guides for more than 15 years, was expelled from the organisation.

"She stated girls had a right to female-only spaces — specifically toilets, showers and accommodation — following the introduction of a transgender-inclusive policy.

"Last night, Helen Watts tweeted her reaction: "In case you forgot, I was thrown out of Girlguiding, ostensibly for breaching the social media policy, when I objected to sex self ID.

"But posting inappropriate violent and sexual content on social media (that any girl could find) gets a self-identified woman promoted."

@Sillydoggy

Signing a letter in support of a person does suggest you support that person - seems a bit odd to have to point that out. This GG leader has declared their support for Challenor which leads to people questioning their judgement at the least.

It is very noticeable that the standard for judging the suitability of trans candidates for roles in GG is completely different from the standards for women. No woman who photographed herself in a dominatrix outfit would be permitted in GG.

It suggests you support the views set out in the letter.

I only know one Aimee Challenor open letter off the top of my head, the one that sought to silence lesbian having their own group and own right to peaceful protest about issues they feel impact their rights.

I’d be concerned anyone in a position of trust over girls safeguarding sought to silence lesbian rights.

If it’s a different letter then please post here.

Thanks @PumpkinGin

So the previous Commissioner got fired for speaking out in favour of single sex safety?

I just cannot believe I’m reading this!

The problem here is with GG themselves & not just one individual. An experienced guide leader with 15 years experience was expelled from GG for raising concerns about this exact situation & she was replaced by Sulley, a BDSM, gun toting trans woman, with a public Twitter account which also featured photos of young girls from guides.
It’s either been locked or taken down now but it took less than 2 minutes to find & view.
So either GG didn’t look or they saw it & decided it wasn’t a problem, make up your own minds.

@brighousepres

Thanks *@PumpkinGin*

So the previous Commissioner got fired for speaking out in favour of single sex safety?

I just cannot believe I’m reading this!

Why can't you just BE KIND?????????

[quote Lockheart]@HoardingSamphireSaurus I agree on all points, but holding up this person as having a connection to Challenor on the basis that they signed one open letter is IMO misleading and intended to do nothing more than aggravate further.

Surely there's enough to be concerned about here without having to stretch the truth.[/quote]
What stretch of the truth though?

They were aware enough of Challenor to sign up alongside them. The question you need to ask after finding that out was did they sign up before or after Challenor Snr was charged and sentenced?

That's what safeguarding does.

Safeguarding with all due diligence would have done a few things:

• found the signature. GG could then have asked the sensible questions

• found the pictures, including those in uniform. GG canNOT have found them or they, surely, would have stringly suggested they be removed. I was a teacher, I would have been heavily censured for posting those picture.

• would have given GG an idea of the possible pushback. They didn't have any idea, which is why website pages were taken down and social media streams deleted, others inundated.

That's what safeguarding does. That's why employers trawl social media of potential employees and have social media policies. It protects both organisations and clients.

That GG left themslves open to this says so much about what they do NOT do. The ramifications are unlikely to be negligable. And nor should they be!

[quote PumpkinGin]WTF.

I googled this travesty to find out more and what do I find? Girl guides fired someone for raising safeguarding concerns. And then they hired the dominatrix with guns and started to hand out condoms.

www.newarkadvertiser.co.uk/news/amp/investigation-launched-into-guide-commissioners-social-medi-9227238/[/quote]
The second woman they fired for raising valid safeguarding concerns.

"Last night, Helen Watts tweeted her reaction: "In case you forgot, I was thrown out of Girlguiding, ostensibly for breaching the social media policy, when I objected to sex self ID.

Initially it had bypassed me entirely that this was Helen Watts' position. That REALLY only adds to the questions that need to be asked.

Was this just an error or is it yet another of those deliberate 'take overs' we have seen in other organisations just a little bit too late?

That was quick!