To wonder if the majority of women might be happier without men

[Mummylookatmex1000]

I like men and always have, however, ever since I became a mum I’ve noticed the complete unfairness in life for females.
I think back to my mum and although my father’s a good man and was a good dad in his own way, it was my mum who was often in the background and busted her ass more.
In my group of friends, even the ones in happy relationships, they seem happier in the home or things run more smoothly when their dh’s/dp’s aren’t around.
In the less happy relationships, the women prefer when their partners aren’t around or weekends are filled with moodiness/stresses etc.
I remember in my own childhood, having to work around my dads moods or it affecting the family if he was stressed etc

Would we be happier if we were just a large community of women, with our friends and family?

@NadiaVulvokov Love this recommendation, have been trying to find a good graphic novel/comic to read for ages! Although I note the show was axed after season 1 so will stick with the books.

Also OP, it's sad that your friends have these relationships in their lives. I have a friend like this, she manages the house and the kids and works stupid hours too and is generally sick/tired/unhealthy. Her DH is abusive emotionally and they're always on eggshells. She would be better off without.

I have a DH and DF who I love dearly and life would be poorer without them. DH has done every night shift with me since DD 1 was born 15 months ago. He is fantastic, and is an equal in the house with me.

Sounds good to me. Where do I sign up? 😁

@TractorAndHeadphones, I think you may have nailed it. I have friends to talk culture and books with. It's not a primary topic at home, because most of our chat this week has been about practical matters, child, education, health, aged parents, finance especially pensions as we near retiring, business. It's not romantic, at all, but it is totally tender caring for each other, just not in a youthful sentimental fashion.

I love DH, but if anything ever happens, I wouldn't want another relationship. I'd be very content alone.

I feel like I've spent a huge amount of my adult life compromising by being in a relationship. I don't regret it but I'd never repeat it if that makes sense.

@JaniieJones women have to just choose their partners carefully. So many seem to settle for feckless lazy fuckers who are addicted to porn and don't pull their weight

No, society needs to stop pressuring women into relationships and judging our worth / success first on whether we have a boyfriend / husband (and then children).

Also we need to better support women with children to live alone.

Social pressure encourages women to settle for crappy me (also their crappiness isn’t always visible pre kids)

And financial AND social pressure make it really hard to leave.

So many stay and are miserable.

It’s structural. Under current conditions many women holding out for the good ones would stay single and childless.

Yes we need to expect better of men, and teach men / boys better.

They current pitch is skewed against women.

As a woman who isn't really into anything stereotypically 'feminine' & definitely has a big 'inner bloke', I've always found all-female environments a bit meh and am pretty happy in my current all-male household. DH is genuinely fab though so I am lucky.

DM, now 86 and single via death and divorce since she was 59, has never wanted another live in relationship. A companion to do things with would have been nice, she thought, but only as long as it didn't involve laundry and wife work.

I like men in a sexual capacity, would I be happier living alone: most days!

@RubyTuesday70

I love DH, but if anything ever happens, I wouldn't want another relationship. I'd be very content alone.

I feel like I've spent a huge amount of my adult life compromising by being in a relationship. I don't regret it but I'd never repeat it if that makes sense.

This.

I think I’m over people more generally. Totally agree that women are not straightforward either, but men just seem so, dunno, righteous or something. All the time. I can’t think of any man in our large friend group who I would love as a backup DH But as I say, I think I’m becoming less peopley day by day….

The men in my family are great. So are my male friends. I'm quite happy with them.

I'm surprised by all the posters who really like men. Sorry to say, I don't trust them and hold women in higher esteem. Men are overrated.

@WeBuiltThisBuffetOnSausageRoll

I think you'll get hundreds on NAMALT posts, but judging by the number of posters who seem to be in shit relationships, I'd say you're probably right

The posters are self-selecting, though, so of course they'll disproportionately show the bad.

Oddly enough, you don't see hundreds of posts from women asking for urgent advice on how to deal with a DH who is amazing - or, more realistically, one who can sometimes be a bit annoying (being human), but is kind, loving and respectful.

The evidence supports the 'a bit shit' posters more than the 'not my Nigel' ones.

Look at how many mothers had to leave the workforce during lockdowns. How the split of home learning was managed. How many crappy dads don't pay child support. How many men around you have time consuming weekend hobbies that require their female partners to look after the kids solo for more hours. The argument that men are the breadwinners doesn't hold up either, because research shows that heterosexual women who are the main earners tend to do more at home, whether to ease their own guilt or placate a fragile male ego.

Of could it's not all men... But the statistics suggest that is is MOST of them.

I wouldn't be happier without men at all. I know it's not the done thing, but I enjoy a bit of flirting, even banter, sex and affection. Controversially, I enjoy a heated debate in the issues of the day with men more than women. With women there's too much risk someone will take something personally, I find.

I won't ever tie myself financially or domestically to a man again though and I don't have a distressing story to tell, late DH was a perfectly nice husband, we shared chores and money without any issue, I just don't want to do it again.

I think my husband is great and I'm sexually attracted to men, but if anything happened to him I probably wouldn't bother with another one (certainly not in a LTR sense).
I'm incredibly mistrustful of men I don't know and unfortunately the things I've read about in discovering feminism make me think I'm right too, which is sad I suppose.
I love hanging around with women and had an incredible time at Filia conference this year - if home and family life wasn't so full on, would really like to do more of it.

@JaniieJones

Women have to just choose their partners carefully. So many seem to settle for feckless lazy fuckers who are addicted to porn and don't pull their weight.

Oh come on. Do you think these men start out like that and women gloss over it? Or is it more likely that they wait until the woman gets pregnant and is more tied to the home/working part time etc to show their true colours?

Teach me a lesson podcast ... the episode'how equal is your home?' Is an eye opener and rather depressing .

@OverTheRubicon can you provide these statistics, sound interesting

It's not for everyone but yes I completely agree for me personally and have thought about this a lot since becoming a mother. I do know some good men but most are surplus to requirements IMO and a negligible amount are as good as women when it comes to parenting. This revelation has quite shocked me as I was ALL about the menz in my pre-DC years. Lots of internalised misogyny and very much a "cool-girl" attitude. Nothing like procreating with a sub-standard male to knock that out of you! YANBU.

@Pinkgorrilaz it's difficult to say - there are a fair number of people where things become skewed post children. Woman stays home so does stuff, gradually becomes go to person, husband thinks he provides all the money so doesn't have to do much etc etc.

However there are a lot of people who not only choose to stay with unreliable partners but reproduce with them, thinking a baby will make them more responsible.

I wouldn't know which proportion is which but equally women shouldn't be blamed. There's still a lot of social pressure on people to partner up. And sadly modernisation and technology (in my experience at least) has made this worse. People live far from their support networks (e.g. family). Friends come and go, or get married/have kids and then have other priorities. There are lots of people up for a good time, maybe help you out every now and then but very few you can bare your soul to.

Maybe I'm just a weirdo. I don't know

Well I would be, and I am, because I am single and plan to remain so.

Oh come on. Do you think these men start out like that and women gloss over it? Or is it more likely that they wait until the woman gets pregnant and is more tied to the home/working part time etc to show their true colours?

Tbh in the relationships I've seen where this dynamic has played out, the man has in fact always been like that and didn't even disguise it to his social circle. The women thought he'd change/they could change him and ignored warnings.

The PP who said people would be happier if they didn't feel the need to stay in shit relationships with people they didn't like or weren't compatible with, just because they were afraid of being single.

You don't need to have men in your life who don't enhance it... you can pick the select few who will.

YANBU to wonder about it - you can ponder whatever you like.

I can't agree with your conclusion though. I mean, not for everyone. You might be happier - if that is what you are asking, but 'women as a whole' wouldn't be, I don't think. I actually love my dh.

I think MN is very biased. In real life, all my friends have partners/husbands that do as much and them. My own partner does at the very least half of the childcare/house chores, some days I think he even does more.

@Ledition Completely how I feel and how I was before versus now. It’s disappointing. Looking all around me, the women are much more capable in so many ways. I’m not a girly girl, feminine type and do love guys company at times and did love a flirt, the romance etc up until having dc..but now, meh

I think women would be happier and fulfil their potential if men weren't in their lives in a romantic sense or cohabiting sense, certainly.