AIBU to ask why ppl make fatphobic comments?

[Claralaura]

While out for coffee with a good (slim) friend who I love dearly, she made a nasty comment about an overweight couple sitting next to us who were enjoying some cake. Something along the lines of "I'm sorry that makes me sick, they are killing themselves". I pointed put to her that the people she was so disgusted by weren't that much larger than me, so why would she say that? She got a bit flustered and then gave various "but you carry it well" "you're tall" "you're not even that fat" I wasn't even particularly hurt just found it interesting that she would think that would be an OK thing to say especially to someone who is fat.

I am 35 and I am fat, (about 3 stone overweight(, I have 2 kids a lovely husband and a happy life. I enjoy running but also enjoy my food would I like to be slimmer? absolutely! but I am pretty happy the way I am. 10 years ago I was very slim but drank to excess smoked and was very unfit and unhealthy and I am 100% happier now than I was then.
But it got me thinking about similar comments over the years, slimmer friends who put on 3lbs complaining to me about how disgustingly fat they looked.

So I suppose my question is.... if you are one of those people who say these things why do you say them? No judgement just interested to hear the other side of the coin

I wouldn't want to be friends with someone that commented like that on other people's bodies/made disgust sounds about others behaviour. I'm just not into people who are that judgemental they have to tell everyone else about how much better they are than others. If the only thing you have going for you is that you are slim, well, meh, it's just not that interesting. I'm always happy to support people's eating goals and chat about weight, but not to bitch about others eating out. That's not nice and I don't have any friends that would do it either.

I don't blame anyone who is fatphobic it's completely understandable and honestly my own brain can be fatphobic to myself on a bad day. Society/diet culture has pretty much told us that being overweight is the worst possible thing you can be we are not going to unlearn that overnight. But if we try to be kind and mindful then maybe we can stop making hurtful comments to fat ppl (even if they are well meaning).

Unfortunately some people do it because they want to feel superior and because they’re insecure about their own appearance. I wouldn’t want to be friends with such people.

Fear it could be them if they unravel or let loose. It's a very unhealthy mindset.

I do blame people for saying it out loud in a coffee shop though, and to a friend who isn't stick thin and might be worried about their own weight. The other people might overhear, or just see people whispering about them, how lovely for them, and it bothered you enough to post about it.

Even if she can't help the contents of her mind, she can stop them spilling out negatively all over the place.

[quote OnwardsAndSideways1]**@Noavocado* I would never make a judgement on weight but I disagree with the healthy comment. Of course a size 10 person will have a reduced chance of heart disease, diabetes and highblood pressure. That is a medical fact. Size 18 is unhealthy. Plus a bigger person's joints will wear much faster*

It's actually not a medical fact. It's called the Obesity Paradox, where people who are overweight and obese seem to live longer than those of normal/under weight and a lot has been written about it. Risk for diabetes higher, but all cause mortality lower. So, it may be being a size 18 is a better way to enter old age than size 10...we simply don't know.

www.frontiersin.org/articles/10.3389/fnut.2020.00053/full[/quote]
I have also read that while obesity increases your risk of cancer, having a low BMI to begin with adversely affects cancer outcomes.

To the comment about no need to be fat - really? What a clueless comment. Yes over eating plays a part. Yes not exercising enough can make a difference. But what about the studies that show that if you work out base calorie needs and feed people the same amount over, some people will gain 5 times as much weight as others? If you are at that end of the spectrum you have to restrict yourself much more than others so this kind of comment is particularly offensive.

@OnwardsAndSideways1 I 100% agree and it did make me think a little less of her if I'm honest, but looking back I could think of a few other people who are actually really kind people in most circumstances who have said similar things (maybe not quite as nasty) and it made me wonder why it is that a really sweet kind people who are inclusive in all other ways can be so hurtful to fat people.

I think it's just a way of competing really. Like most things with humans. People saying it's deep and subconscious don't really take into account that societal preferences and the relationship between weight and beauty have been different in different eras and in different cultures. Victorian pin ups tend to be plump. The 60s was very waif. A lot of soft porn painting from the past had larger bodies with lots of flesh on display. Different countries at different times value different things. I personally think it's more to do with associations of class and wealth. Ie being plumper at some periods was a sign of wealth and rarer and valued. But now it is the reverse as food is readily available and fattening food is cheap and it is more a sign of wealth to be thin (ie able to devote time go to gym get trainer time and money to buy and devote to more expensive healthy food etc etc). I think the fact we all readily internalize these attitudes is quite sad. It's like a lot of fashion stuff. People obsess over it and then stand back at some point and wonder how it could have such a hold on them. As to the friend she might feel what she feels but whether that is inherent or whether it is just another internalized message shes picked up from society that she's never examined is another matter. In a way I doubt she even applies that criteria or thinking to you OP and that's why she doesn't even realise how her remarks might make you feel. Maybe the nice side of this is that it shows when people know and like people they don't necessarily see them the same way. It sounds like she was treating these strangers as people to look down on.

the other thing I think is worth bearing in mind is that looks and fashions about how bodies should be is a lot about selling stuff. If something is too easily achieved you can't sell much on the back of it. When I was young tiny bums with flat stomachs and huge breasts was in. This is not a hugely common combination and led to the fashion of the boobjob. Making a lot of money for some. Now this seems to have reverse and big bottoms and tiny waists are in. In Victorian times plumper was valued but combined with impossibly small waists and women suffered and hurt their bodies trying to achieve this artificial effect. I read that plastic surgery to make bums bigger is now big business (although these procedures can be very dangerous apparently) yet big breasts seem to not be the rage as they were and quite a lot of people and celebrities are now are removing their implants etc. I just find this sort of thing interesting to take a long view of and a step back from as it can help remind that like everything else these things are partly to do with selling insecurity and partly to do with competition between people rather than "innate" as such. And also that ideas do change. I figure we should all stop going on about the appearance bodies so much and instead use them to live, have experiences, do things with them.

And that's why the person I really disagree with on this thread is the one who is against fat and fit. I think this is a very positive idea. It is by using and doing things that you grow to have more appreciation for your body not just by constantly thinking about what it looks like.

It is misogyny. Women policing other women

I couldn't be friends with someone like that personally. 1. They don't know when to shut up 2. They try to make their food issues your issue as well.

Being overweight can absolutely be bad for your health but you cannot tell just by looking at someone what their health is like and honestly I don't know why you'd want to guess what a strangers health is like based purely on how they look?

I think saying 'being overweight (well, very overweight at least) can be bad for your health' is a bit misleading. It is bad for your health. Obviously a person who's a size 20 but has no current major health conditions is healthier than the slim person standing next to her who has a deadly but non-visible disease. So no, you can't absolutely reliably judge people's total health by their body shape. Though obviously the bigger they are, the more likely they already have health problems.

But if you take 1000 people of the same age and sex with no other current health issues and half of them are a size 20 and the other half are a size 10, run a bunch of physical tests on them and project their likelihood of various diseases or mortality in the near or further future, I doubt the stats would surprise many people.

I'm not fat-phobic and I don't go around 'wanting to guess' people's health on the basis of their body shape or anything else, but that doesn't mean being very overweight isn't bad for you. Sure there are exceptions who escape the major health effects- but they are just that, exceptions.

I don't think I've ever been with anyone who has commented on someone else's weight.

(apart from my mother, and she's a bitch)

There is an obsession about weight on mumsnet which I don't see irl - one both sides - from people going on about the cost of obesity to the NHS, but also the opposite where people who post a picture of themselves (obviously very overweight) or state they are size 16 and 5.3 and people will tell them they have a lovely figure. It's odd I think.

@CounsellorTroi so are you suggesting everyone should become Obese to live longer and disregard the medical conditions they will need to be treated for? If the NHS wasn't already crumbling it certainly wouldn't last long with that approach.

@Hadtocomment really interesting points!

@Siameasy

Honest answer? I really dislike obesity. It looks absolutely repulsive and obese people look extremely uncomfortable just moving around. I would hate to be like that. I wouldn’t say anything but I would definitely think it. I know that some people are obese as a result of illness, injury, medication or disability. I’m aware that could happen to me. Nonetheless this is how I feel. The increasing amount of morbidly obese clothing models has probably had the opposite effect to what was intended. It has put me off of obesity even more. A relative of mine is morbidly obese and in denial completely-like most addicts of course. He will die prematurely due to his addiction. The drug of choice in his case is totally legal; sugar.

No one is trying to 'put you on' obesity. There is an increase of fat clothing models because we've finally figured out fat people also wear clothing and need to know how it will look on them. Hope that helps.

I can't cope with the "fat positive" or "fit and fat" movement very well either.

Do we want fat people to exercise and keep moving or not? Wish people would make up their minds. Complain when they do nothing and then complain when they actually do something.

I judge really overweight people too. We all judge others, its human nature. People judge my botox/fillers or style I'm sure. I know how much willpower it takes for me to stay slim so if I see overweight people gorging food then I will probably give it a passing thought. I have a couple of overweight friends who are in complete denial about their weight and appetite.. stating regularly that they don't eat that much and can't understand why they are that weight when I've been out with them and seen how much they eat. I wouldn't say anything to them though, unless it was getting dangerous. It's not my place to. Conversely, I drink too much and do other things that people would probably judge. It's just life.

Did she really?

YABU for being friends with “fatphobic” people

@Clymene

It is misogyny. Women policing other women

Because fat men don’t exist? Men don’t get judged for being fat?

@WillyWollyWandy

Ok you asked.. I would never dream of commenting about someone’s weight. But I do inwardly judge people who are fat because for the fast majority of people, notwithstanding those with thyroid issues and other health conditions, there is no need to be fat. If you eat healthily and exercise, even only having a walk a day, you will not be fat. So if a person is fat, I assume they’re lazy and eat junk food to excess. They may argue that they don’t, citing gym sessions etc. However if they accounted for every calorie that goes in, and that includes finishing the kids’ dinner, the hugely calorific takeaways and wine, it would easily outweigh the output. It isn’t rocket science. But as I said, I’d never actually say this to a fat person, albeit I don’t really know any fat people. I do know anecdotally that people struggle with their weight. But some willpower and discipline should fix the issue. I also presume however, that for some larger people, there are mental issues at play which leads to comfort eating etc. No idea what the answer is. Counselling?

And therefore…..isn’t rocket science

Do we want fat people to exercise and keep moving or not? Wish people would make up their minds. Complain when they do nothing and then complain when they actually do something

So you deliberately take one line out of a post about the death of my sister and present it out of context. You absolute ghoul.

@Atlas2021 even if it was getting "dangerous" I really don't think commenting on someone's body is the way to go. Sometimes people who are overweight feel the need to justify themselves to people they think are judging them (which you clearly are if you are monitoring their food intake at every meeting) but it's extremely unlikely that they don't know they're fat so they definitely don't need someone to point it out.

No-one should ever be nasty about anyone else like this, whatever their weight. It's hurtful and horrible.

However, I do think it's also problematic to talk about fat-phobia as a 'prejudice' akin to racism, sexism et al. The point about those prejudices is that they have zero foundations in truth - it is not 'better' to be white than black, and men are not better than women. But it is better to be slim than fat, and I say that as someone who has been both at various different periods of my life. Just like it's better to drink moderately than drink excessively.

I think there's a real danger in where the 'as long as you're healthy and happy with your body' line of thinking leads. Being overweight is objectively less healthy and I'm not talking about costs to the NHS and so on. I mean that when I have been overweight and then lost weight, I have felt instantly, noticeably better. I am also capable of recognising that during periods where I've been overweight, I have sometimes eaten disgustingly. I might, for example, eat an entire box of chocolates in one go. That's not disgusting because of society's expectations of me etc etc, it's disgusting because it would make feel sick, and a bit dizzy, and really not good for me at all. For someone who doesn't have a craving to eat so much chocolate, I can see how it might look a bit gross, just as I (as a light drinker) might think it was a bit gross if I saw someone drinking 10 pints of beer.

It should be possible to have a rational conversation about this where people can talk about the benefits of losing weight, without ever lapsing into meanness or judgement. But I have been in the place of kidding myself that I am 'healthy and fine' at 2 or 3 stone overweight... I really wasn't.