Dad gave my mum's house away

[user1493035447]

Bit of a complicated situation but I wanted views on this. My parents bought their house together, and when my mum died she had a secret life insurance policy my dad never knew about that paid off the mortgage in full.

My dad later got married to what can only be described as a psychopath. He told everyone he had a will in place to ensure my siblings and I (who were still children) would get the family home if anything happened to him.

The marriage didn't last and he again remarried a foreign bride. At the time I was a student and I told my dad of my concerns - if anything were to happen to him it would have impacted the feasibility of my studies but he assured me that my siblings and I would be taken care of. The subject didn't crop up again until late last year when he was terminally ill. In the intervening years he kept telling all his family and friends how wealthy his wife was, and this is something I believed as I was aware she has at least 2 houses of her own.

Last year however my dad announced that he had no will and everything would go to his wife. My siblings and I were shocked. Firstly he had lied when we were younger and if something had happened to him it would have left the family home to his psychopathic wife, and she would just have abandoned us. It would have made life very difficult for us.

Secondly he lied to my granny who questioned him about a will, and if she had know this I am not so certain she would have left him half her estate.

We are now in a position where the wife is getting everything, the house my mum helped pay for and my granny's estate. I don't want to sound entitled as I don't need the money, and would be just as happy seeing it go to a charity that helped my parents. My sister however is struggling to pay for childcare and she is very resentful of my dad now. I do however resent every time I was out with my dad and I insisted on paying for meals and drinks, that I was basically writing a cheque to the wife. I didn't realise how much he had in his bank account until before he died and I would absolutely not have paid for as much as I did if I had know this situation. Over the years I also helped him by paying for half of any repairs he had on the house and I feel as though he isn't the person I thought I knew.

To complicate matters further he told me he wanted his ashes buried with my mum's. However this is something the wife has developed amnesia over and she is in possession of both sets of ashes.

Had anyone else been through a situation like this or have any views on it? I feel it's something I can't get out my head and can't believe my dad left such a mess - as children we seemed to understand the importance of a will. I do understand she was his wife but the marriage seemed so toxic and we were definitely lied to about her financial situation - not that is was something we ever asked!!

FI, mutual wills can 'survive' remarriage in some circumstances - www.ashfords.co.uk/news-and-media/general/mutual-wills#:~:text=It%20is%20worth%20noting%20that,surviving%20testator's%20estate%20in%20equity.&text=These%20issues%20will%20depend%20on,testators%20enough%2C%20if%20at%20all.

If there is no will the rules of intestacy might mean you are entitled to something if the estate is large enough.

www.citizensadvice.org.uk/family/death-and-wills/who-can-inherit-if-there-is-no-will-the-rules-of-intestacy

If probate has been granted, you can see if your Dad left a will on the government website.

www.gov.uk/search-will-probate

I think you have to reframe this. He hasn't done anything with your mothers house, it became his house almost 30 years ago.

This is so sad 😞 at the very least you should get your mums ashes, I don’t even know why this woman would want them.

@MrsColon

How much is the estate worth? If more than £270k then you and your sibling are entitled to half of everything over that amount.

Actually, yes, if he died intestate in England /Wales this is true!

@user1493035447 follow this link, it gives info for all UK countries too
www.gov.uk/inherits-someone-dies-without-will

Can you put a prevision in place so that once she passes your will be a beneficiary then? I know of somebody that has done this so husband died, wife inherited and once she dies his children will get his half of the house.

It does seem your dad would tell people what they wanted to hear, for an easier life. That doesn't mean he lied to you, he probably believed it when he said it, but that he prioritised having a nice time with you over the necessary awkward conversations. That was his character and not at all a reflection on how much he loved you.

It's quite possible that his wife was never told he wanted to be buried with your mum. Did he tell you, unprompted, that he wanted this or could he just have been responding to what he thought you wanted to hear? I would try to stay on polite terms with his wife to make sure you hear both sides of the story rather than arguing in court (and paying lawyers) to find out he told you different things.

I would definitely ask for your mum's ashes, and see if there is any claim on your grandmother's estate, given that he was included on false pretences. Good luck and take care.

I would definitely get legal advice on this. Mightn't it be relevant that you paid for half of his house repairs over the years on the understanding that you were paying for what would be yours and your siblings property? And also that he deceived his mother into leaving money to him on the understanding that you were going to inherit?

@user1493035447

I'm sorry badlyformedquestion bit this is not the case. He told me several times over the years after a glass of wine he wanted to be buried with my mum. And when I found out he had no will the whole argument I had was about where his ashes should go and he said his wife knew he wanted them to go with my mum and he trusted her so he disnt need a will. I believe he was more in denial rather and didn't want to face up to reality. He got married twice barely meeting the either time and the marriage was definitely toxic. She left him for several months before he got ill. Nobody who saw them believed it was a genuine loving marriage.

Considering how strongly you have reacted to this, it's possible that what he said after a glass of wine, wasn't the truth but what he thought you wanted to hear. I think YABU because you're clouding all your memories of your DF and looking at your relationship in purely transactional terms. You're calculating when you bought lunches, paid for repairs, etc. You didn't make those spends on the basis of an expected financial return. You paid for them because you wanted to. By all means, seek legal advice but from a family pov, don't reduce all your memories of your DF to how much items cost. That's not a good measure of family or memories.

I have experienced something similar, though so cruel it hit the national press at the time. My advice is to try and pick yourself off the floor, decide if the battle to have your mum's wishes respected is worth the cost, pain and distress (probably not, our solicitor told us, even when there is evidence of coercion and domestic abuse) and try not to let the justified anger make you bitter, despite the overwhelming hurt and shock you feel.
I'm so sorry.

It doesn’t matter if he had a will or not it would have been invalidated when he remarried so don’t worry about that.
Whether you have any recourse to any of his estate is unclear - if he died with no will then he died intestate whether or not he was married . The law around this is complex and depends on how much the estate was worth. Have an initial conversation with a solicitor .

Oh my what an arsehole.
Your DM done everything possible to secure the property for your future before she died.
See a Solicitor immediately.
What is in your DM's will? Any mention of DC?

I'm in Scotland, so I'm not sure how the law compares with E&W (if that's where you are), but you always imagine it must be at least similar?

In Scotland if someone leaves no will, then 'descendants' (even great grandchildren) are entitled to a share of the estate.

www.gov.scot/publications/death-scotland-practical-advice-times-bereavement-revised-11th-edition-2016-9781786522726/pages/20/

Unfortunately if the widow lived with your dad she would be entitled to keep the house.

I'd still be getting on to a solicitor though - don't let her just take everything and disappear.

I feel for you ,you feel betrayed and having already lost your DM at a young age ,felt that DM had made provision for you all was some sort of a comfort . To lose that to some other woman who may have been after his money ,is a cruel blow. Many men want a "quiet life " and want to appease new wife .Clive Owens(from Our Yorkshire Farm) daughter was interviewed ,and said she felt less welcome since he remarried .And that he didnt want his Granddaughter to call him Grandad as that made him feel old FFS! Obviously try to get legal Advice as to where you stand.I would also get some Counselling as well .The facts are he is unlikely to have told his new wife that he wanted to be buried with his first wife. He has behaved badly ,but seems to completely live in the present time .So many men seem to want to feel "young" and a new younger spouse seems to be all they think of.I think they are not deliberately unkind ,but just seem to go with the moment in the here and now.I would try to get some Counselling as well if you can .

The fact is, some men - particularly if they’re older and have always been helpless when it comes to cooking and cleaning etc. - are a complete pushover for certain women with an eye to the main chance. How often do they go for men with no (owned) house or flat, and very little in the way of savings?

I know personally of two older men who, within only months of the death of their terminally wife, married the woman who’d either helped to nurse her, or had largely taken over household chores, or both.

As my DM once said, ‘She was there and available, she fussed him and made him comfortable.’

As for those posters who say they have the right to leave their money/estate as they wish, whether they have the legal right to do it is not the point. I dare say we all know that they do.

Whether they have the moral right is another matter, particularly if half of that property/estate had formerly belonged to a wife, who had fully intended for her share to go ultimately to her children.

This is just awful.I am so sorry OP.

Can you leave your house to your DC if you have remarried? How does it work?

It’s really sad OP and I feel for you but once your Mum was no longer here and the house was inherited by your Dad it was his to do what he wanted with.
It’s shite that he lied to you but if it’s all legal then there’s not much you can do. He inherited it and then his wife did

This is a terrible situation, him lying to you about it is nothing short of evil. Parents should not be able to exclude their children from their will, it causes so much hurt to people who are already grieving. It's the final message the deceased can give, and "I don't give a fuck about you" is not a good message to be sending.

If there is a heaven and hell, I think it's pretty obvious which one he'll be destined for.

"particularly if half of that property/estate had formerly belonged to a wife, who had fully intended for her share to go ultimately to her children."

If I have read correctly, the house still had a mortgage on it until Op's Mum died, so I'm not sure that she actually owned anything to leave?

@Chippymunks it depends on the jurisdiction. In England, remarriage would revoke previous wills except mutual wills, but one of the spouses - the father in this case, could write a new will after being married. That would not stop the new spouse staking a claim for reasonable provision through the courts potentialy over-turning the new will (Havers?) and also directly receiving a share of the house depending on whether they are named on the title.

@diddl

"particularly if half of that property/estate had formerly belonged to a wife, who had fully intended for her share to go ultimately to her children."

If I have read correctly, the house still had a mortgage on it until Op's Mum died, so I'm not sure that she actually owned anything to leave?

A mortgage doesn’t have to be the whole value, or even much of it, though. Depending on how long ago it was taken out, it could easily be only a small percentage of the original sum.

Op so sorry for all this angst on you

A bit left field I know but they were officially married weren't they ?
Did he marry abroad or here

@user1493035447 you definitely have my sympathy, I witnessed both my parents having to deal with 'unfair inheritance' issues, it's such a toxic subject when things are left unclear. It is very hard to contest a will successfully, the only winners are generally solicitors. I would personally choose to walk away, ask for your mum's ashes and get on with your own life.

On a slightly different note, I've never understood why people take so much to their graves. If you have a good relationship with your kids and have money, why are you not passing on the wealth while you are alive, I don't just mean money as I know there are limits but by paying for dinners, trips, etc. My FIL/MIL pay every time we go out so it doesn't go to the Govt, and recently passed on some medals to their GC as they thought their own parents would want them to have it.