Husband thinks I should get up earlier!

[AandWsMum]

I am currently on maternity leave for DC2 who is 14 weeks old and EBF. We also have a DS who is three and goes to nursery two days a week, and I’ve just found out I’m pregnant again with DC3, much to my surprise.

My husband works long-ish hours, leaving the house at 8am and getting home about 8pm. He gets up with DS about 5.45am. His job isn’t manual but involves a lot of travelling. In the morning he takes the dog for a walk, does breakfast for DS and gets ready.

I get up about 7am, but have normally been awake for longer feeding baby. He thinks I should get up earlier because he says he finds leaving in the morning stressful if I’m still getting ready, but usually everything is under control. He is never annoyed or moaning he just says it would

Apart from taking out the bins and gardening, I do literally everything else most of the time with him pitching in when he can - the shopping, cooking, cleaning, bath time, bedtime, taking kids to parties, organising bills, school run etc are all my responsibility. So if he’s about at bath time, he will do it while I clear up from dinner as an example but it’s not a given.

He struggles with being woken in the night so atm sleeps in the spare room while feed baby (I don’t mind tbh at least I get more space) but it also means I deal with the 3 y/o if he wakes up at any point too.

I go to bed around 11pm and feed baby usually from 1-2 and then again 3.30-5 ish.

I don’t mind doing everything I do and appreciate that the main reason he doesn’t is because he just not here, but I am also EXHAUSTED.

AIBU to stand my ground and stay in bed til 7am and leave him to do the early mornings?

@Mumdiva99 I can see why you did all of the childcare and housework then, but I have to say I wouldn’t have tolerated that. A 14+ hour working day (I’m assuming at least 5 days a week?) when you have a young family is abnormal and unnecessary in my opinion. There are surely always other options? Take a paycut / Move to a cheaper area / downsize / go back to work / have fewer children etc. I assume you had your 5 children over a period of several years so it’s not like this was a very short term solution to an urgent situation or anything. I totally appreciate that you felt happy with the set-up and that’s fine for you. I’m just saying that I wouldn’t be, and I don’t think I’m unusual in that.

Just buy a microwave? Thats the porridge sorted and saves a pan on washing up.

A microwave would make it easier for him to re-heat dinner too.

There's a theme here, that OP mitigates the consequences of her DH's choices, by taking on extra work. Until he experiences the consequences of his own choices (oh, dinner takes longer to re-heat in a standard oven than a microwave? Who knew!), nothing will change.

(See also, it's much easier to survive day after day of childcare, if the other parent has covered one of the night feeds with an expressed or formula bottle, allowing one decent stretch of uninterrupted sleep and just enough hours over all. He doesn't feel this because he's never experienced it).

@SpanielSprint I didn't have 5....I have 3!! Lol. That's enough.

I guess we know quite a lot of people.that commute for work so not too unusual for us (I commuted too before kids). Husband working those hours in those locations allowed me to be home. You are right that isn't for everyone.

@JHMJHM

Look we see it again and again on here. People who find parenting a massive struggle. Break ups, divorces, resentment, exhaustion. We need frank and open discussions about how having too many children is a shit idea. No, the OP cant change it now but that wont stop me from having this discussion. It isnt fair on the children apart from anything else. 2 years down the line this could be another guy who goes on to have more kids wirh someone else. It happens so often and the kind of faux bemusement about how hard parenting lots of kids is, is kind of ridiculous. We need to educate ourselves and be responsible for decisions. Society is really suffering because of crap parenting. It needs to be talked about.

Agree that there are a lot of crap parents around, that bringing up children is very hard, and that society doesn't benefit from crap parents. However, there's nothing to suggest that the OP and her husband are crap parents or that they are irresponsible for having a third child (and who is anyone else to judge whether someone has "too many children"?). By all means have that discussion, but not on a thread where the OP and her husband are clearly decent people and good parents, but are trying to work out ways to iron out a particular problem. On balance, I agree with @Sillawithans

Well it's very hard for both parents when the kids are young but it shouldn't all fall on the mother. If he's working 8 am to 8 pm then so are you. Kids don't supervise themselves, not legally, anyway. If he's an architect I would guess he's bringing in a good income. If he refuses to decrease his work hours so you aren't on your knees then maybe he could use some of that income to outsource some of his share of the at-home labor, so you aren't on your knees. If he won't reduce his hours, won't outsource some of the work he's not doing at home, won't even let you get a microwave, I would say you might ask yourself whether he's a bit controlling.

If he refuses to decrease his work hours so you aren't on your knees then maybe he could use some of that income to outsource some of his share of the at-home labor, so you aren't on your knees. If he won't reduce his hours, won't outsource some of the work he's not doing at home, won't even let you get a microwave, I would say you might ask yourself whether he's a bit controlling.

THIS ^^

I think he is controlling, seriously up himself, and also pretty weird (that microwave business).

Hence all the 'supervision' of various work sites, necessitating 12 hour days, and hence also the request that the OP gets up earlier in the morning.

Many people on MN think 'boundaries' is another word for rules you are willing to enforce, but that's not what they are. There are boundary problems here, by which I mean he has a problem understanding where he ends and other people begin, and letting other people be other people.

He can't delegate at work, and he needs the OP to be up when he's up in the morning, as if he can't function without his 'other half' and other professionals on work sites can't function without him.

'Paid help' is being suggested because we are assuming this is a wealthy (architect) family. Monied or not, I still strongly believe having multiple children (for what? Appearances sake?) is a really bad idea unless you are really really good at parenting

@JHMJHM

There are very few people who embark on parenting for the first time together who have any idea of what parenting entails. The quality of the relationship between the parents is of the utmost importance. Ditto the level of maturity of the individuals involved.

'Good at parenting' is a function of 'Good at adulting' and 'Not a narcissist'.

Well, it's going to be fun when DC3 comes along... he doesn't get woken up during the night, doesn't help with 90% of household/childcare tasks...

I"d suggest a vasectomy for one thing...

Throw money at the problem.

For those interested in the weekend routine -

DS still gets up at 5.45, that’s just his wake up time. He loves going out for his morning walk with Dad and Dog about 6.15 and it’s generally a short one.

I still get up at 7 and we all get ready together, more or less.

Husband takes DS to Rugby class at 9.45. After that I meet him at the rugby club and take over childcare while DH plays a match, then generally we socialise with other families who have Dads playing the match a well.

While DS & DH are at rugby first thing is when I usually sort out the weekly shop, which I click & collect as we are quite rural and can’t get delivery.

On a Saturday we do have a cleaner who comes in for a couple of hours to “blitz” but it doesn’t negate the need for cleaning, washing etc in the week of course.

On a Sunday we all have the same morning routine (sometimes if I feel very awake I’ll take the dog so my husband can have at least one later morning)

Church at 10, all together, and then we spend the afternoon with my parents most sundays, having to leave at 4 to get home for bedtime.

My parents don’t live exceptionally close and are busy their own company, and my in laws live in Sweden so I can’t often rely on family in the week.

And good for you all with the dogs that can last as long as long as they do but if our Saluki isn’t our first thing she doesn’t stop barking until she gets her walk. Yes we do have a garden but it’s not the same

Seems like you’ve mad a rod for your own back with the dog

I feel exhausted just reading your weekend routine

You won’t like what I have to say but it needs to be said. You aren’t just the mum of a baby you have 2 kids and have conceived a third, you absolutely can’t get to opt out of parenting one of your DCs in the mornings every single day. Bring your baby downstairs and breastfeed them there, or wake half an hour earlier, have your shower and then breastfeed.

You aren’t just the mum of a baby you have 2 kids and have conceived a third, you absolutely can’t get to opt out of parenting one of your DCs in the mornings every single day
Opting out? What in the name of fuck? You do realise that if the DH didn't take care of the toddler for a little while in the mornings he would not parent the child during waking hours for the entire week?
I'm 100% convinced OP knows exactly how many children she has since she's the one juggling them all day to day apart from this one little window where she gets to sleep and wash her hair

@Ozanj OP is responsible for both children for every other of the 24 hours of the day, she even deals with night wakings for both. Why, exactly, shouldn’t the morning routine be divided between the two parents?

@Youseethethingis

You aren’t just the mum of a baby you have 2 kids and have conceived a third, you absolutely can’t get to opt out of parenting one of your DCs in the mornings every single day Opting out? What in the name of fuck? You do realise that if the DH didn't take care of the toddler for a little while in the mornings he would not parent the child during waking hours for the entire week? I'm 100% convinced OP knows exactly how many children she has since she's the one juggling them all day to day apart from this one little window where she gets to sleep and wash her hair

This. The op gets to opt out of sweet fuck all. She does however insist on a very small amount of sleep, and being able to have a shower, while her partner is up anyway. My dh works long hours, and he is going to be doing approx 100x what her partner does at home when I go on matleave with dc3 next year.

It is a difficult time for most families but it doesn't last forever. I suppose the dog adds extra work. Do you ever delay him leaving, just hang on for 5 minutes while I do whatever? I know when I was doing a job where I had a busy commute then leaving 5 minutes late could add half an hour to my journey on a bad day.

If you are fine dealing with crying son when he's leaving even if it means having to leave drying your hair then I don't think it should matter.

You do seem to have a busy life 7 days a week. I know you worked long shifts as a nurse (one of mine is a nurse) but it wasn't 5 days a week so I think you have to allow for that.

@Bagelsandbrie

I feel exhausted just reading your weekend routine

I thought that. When does anyone relax?

What I notice about your weekend is that it is almost completely filled with formal leisure activities; rugby, rugby social, church, visiting parents. That strikes me as unusual (though I can see why you'd combine socialising with spreading the childcare load, by mixing with other families so much). Thoughts:

1. With small DC none of this is truly 'leisure' time. Someone is looking after and entertaining them constantly. Clearly your DH gets time off from that while he's playing rugby. When is your time off? Do your parents lift the burden so you can have some time to yourself? Or are you leading the childcare while at your parents' too? When is your leisure time, your mentally essential 'me time', to do with as you will?

2. The flip side of that; when does your DH ever get the chance to look after both his DC together and learn how to do that? (An essential skill, in case you're ever incapacitated, which you will be with the new baby - at which point he will need to develop the skills to look after three at once too).

Is he pulling his childcare weight at rugby social, church, your parents'? That is a list of potentially very traditional, patriarchal institutions. It isn't hard to imagine the men all socialising with other men, while the women collectively do all the childcare (and cooking, serving and clearing up). Let's hope not. It reads a lot like you do 24/7 childcare, while he maintains his social life and social status.

3. With two days of solid, scheduled leisure every single weekend, when does your DH get any domestic tasks done? When does the gardening happen? Mending things? Batch cooking? Pulling his weight with cleaning, tidying, putting laundry away, shopping, buying gifts etc? Most families cannot afford two full days of leisure time, because this stuff needs doing at the weekend.

Actually what I came back to the thread to say was something quite different, about his working hours and the terrible message those send to his employees. (Then saw your update).

All that presenteeism and perfectionism. Not being able to work smart, wind things up for the day and get home for dinner, then catch up on work later as necessary. Can you imagine what message that is sending to his employees? That to be senior in this business you cannot have a personal or family life. That's what.

The male managers I have respected most have been the ones with obvious humanity and the ability to prioritise. Those who always left on time to get home to see their DC and play a part in family life (unless there was a specific event that precluded that). Interestingly, those were always the smartest, most focused, best organised, most successful, whose careers really went somewhere.

That behaviour also sends an important message to their staff. That employees are expected to have a life outside work, a social and emotional hinterland, not to be dull drones who risk stress and burnout.

How would his working model work if you were both doing it? (Sure that's necessary for some, high-flying jobs, the kind that afford nannies and housekeepers. Not for anything like as many jobs as nappy-shy dads would have you believe though). It wouldn't - but I bet your equally high-flying job would be perceived as the flexible one.

He sounds like he could do with some mentoring, maybe some management training, professionally.

I question whether he really needs to work until 8pm.

A man I used to work for did this & openly joked it was to avoid sorting out the kids of the evening.

Your DP is own boss, he has the control.

I don’t think YABU for being exhausted and needing the time in bed. He’s not doing too much at al!!
I would only say - does your shower and hair-drying make him late for work? If so, I can understand his query. Can’t you be hard-hearted and plonk the kids in a cot & playpen while you do it? Easier said than done I know and I couldn’t do it at the time but looking back I wonder why on earth I didn’t!!
You must both be shattered!!!!

And of course your dog needs to be walked and your DH is right to do that with DS.

God men can be so self-inulgent and self-important. Absolutely unable to see past their own noses and able to empathise. Yes, he's tired and he works. You have not yet recovered from your last baby and you're growing another one. Your body is literally sacrificing nutrients in favour of two other babies right now. He needs to really understand what is happening biologically and psychologically right now.