Friends DD threw my daughter to the ground

[AmIInside]

Friends daughter is 9 (same age as my DD). My DD is very into dancing and dances constantly. She dances in the house, around the living room, in her bedroom, in the garden, in the shops, in the street - constantly. She loves it.
Friends DD does karate and often practices that too.
Yesterday we were walking home from school and DD was dancing. Friends DD told her to “stop it” saying she was annoying and said “even my mum thinks you’re annoying, don’t you mum?”. Friend went bright red and said she’d never said that and her DD said “yes you did! You said “why can’t she just walk normal, remember?” Friend quickly changed the subject but was clearly embarrassed. I felt really awkward. Didn’t know what to say. DD said “I don’t care that I annoy you, if I want to dance I will do” and started to exaggerate her dancing a little and was swirling around us all. I told her to walk properly before she ends up crashing into someone. She swirled in front of friends DD who grabbed her and threw her to the floor. She landed awkwardly in a muddy puddle and really hurt her arm. She cried like mad 😢 friend told her DD off and told her to apologise, she refused saying DD started it and should just walk normal (echoing what her mum had obviously said). In anger DD shouted that friend was too ugly to be a dancer and that’s why she’s jealous. I told her off for that remark obviously but friends did retorted that DD was an attention seeking idiot and everyone thought so, even the teachers.

Anyway it got horrible and nasty. I can’t stop thinking about it.

Did she deserve to be thrown on the floor? I don’t think so. AIBU to message the mum and tell her how upset I am about the fact she’s clearly been slagging DD off at home?

I actually think the least acceptable thing anyone did in this situation was the OP’s daughter saying the other girl was too ugly to be a dancer. That’s viciously nasty. Worse than shoving someone over who is up in your face IMO. The word violence is being used a lot in this thread but it’s a spectrum and I believe some things are worse than some acts of physical violence. Calling a nine year old girl too ugly to dance is horrific and could trigger life long issues.

No. An assault is ‘viciously nasty’; a word is unkind. In the adult world physical assault will get you arrested.

Compare the hyperbole over namecalling: ‘could trigger lifelong issues’ with the much more real danger that throwing someone down could result in serious injury.

According to the simple-minded mentality of the thread: DD got what she deserved for prancing around. By that reckoning surely the other girl got what she deserved for physical assault.

@ancientgran

Why can't she do what she wants, dancing, if it isn't harming anyone and it isn't illegal? I find lots of things annoying, people who swear constantly, people who sniff, people who use loads of perfume (makes me cough) I can't go round ordering people what to do and attacking them if they don't comply.

We live on a crowded island, the little madam who was dictating to the OPs daughter needs to learn that the world doesn't revolve round what she wants and that if she doesn't learn that attacking people is wrong she will find herself in trouble with the law.

This.

Why can't she do what she wants, dancing, if it isn't harming anyone and it isn't illegal?

Yes, OP's DD's right to dance up the street trumps everyone else's right to walk, without someone twirling round them and invading their personal space 🤦🏽‍♀️

It wasn't nice at all, but your daughter was told she was doing everyone's head in. While it's great to be yourself she also needs to be considerate of others. Doesn't excuse the use of violence but Dancing everywhere would have me rolling my eyes too - and as for her comment about being too ugly. Well that smacks of feeling superior doesn't it. She's be grounded for that.

[quote TatianaBis]@ancientgran

Why can't she do what she wants, dancing, if it isn't harming anyone and it isn't illegal? I find lots of things annoying, people who swear constantly, people who sniff, people who use loads of perfume (makes me cough) I can't go round ordering people what to do and attacking them if they don't comply.

We live on a crowded island, the little madam who was dictating to the OPs daughter needs to learn that the world doesn't revolve round what she wants and that if she doesn't learn that attacking people is wrong she will find herself in trouble with the law.

This.[/quote]
So you're happy with a kid dancing around in shops and in the street where you're walking?

Not annoying at all...

[quote SalmonEile]@Clementineapples would you be all sweetness and light to some one who just publicly told you how annoying you are and tried to get their mother, an adult , to gang up on you ? Then physically threw you into a muddy puddle where you hurt your arm badly and refused to apologize? Wouldn’t you be in shock and pain ?

Like yes, I get the OPs DD was being annoying and shouldn’t have doubled down by swirling more but the kid was just insulted by her friend and an adult ,
Everyone is piling in on the OPs DD for the ugly remark but the Karate Kid didn’t hold back or control her feelings either, why does she get a pass to be a violent bully and not apologize just because the OP was dancing?
Friends DD didn’t just shove out of frustration, she does martial arts and unless she only started that week and the OPs DD slipped at the same time then she’ll have known what she was doing. It takes a bit of force to knock a 9 year old down . She needs to learn to control her temper pronto because the next time she finds someone “annoying” she could really hurt them.

Now maybe the OPs DD berates Friends DD all the time for being ugly or whatever and Friends DD finally snapped but I can only go on what OP has written
Sounds like the resentment was brewing for a long time[/quote]
She doesn't get a pass. But her mother isn't here and it's up to her mother to punish her...

I’d probably be telling my kids to keep a distance from your DD, as I couldn’t trust them to keep control in situations like this. Kids are reactive and impulse driven. If provoked like this they may do something stupid. For everyone’s safety and happiness I’d be keeping them apart.

@ancientgran
"Why can't she do what she wants, dancing, if it isn't harming anyone and it isn't illegal? I find lots of things annoying, people who swear constantly, people who sniff, people who use loads of perfume (makes me cough) I can't go round ordering people what to do and attacking them if they don't comply."

I would think constantly twirling around on a pavement in a potentially crowded area (I.e. the school run) and obviously not being able to watch where she is going, is maybe going to end up harming someone....not least of whom could be OP's DD.
As for the annoyances you describe, unless someone stuck their nose right up into your face to sniff, sprayed perfume actually around and onto you or put their mouth right up to your ear to swear into it, then the situations are hardly comparable are they? A BIG difference between learning to deal with those annoyances and having someone twirling and flapping around right in your face to intentionally annoy, goad and provoke.

Why can't she do what she wants,

Why can't the other girl do what she wants, which is to walk without having someone constantly twirling around her? Why is Dancer Girl more important?

She’s 9 not 19 months, you really need to teach her to stop twirling in the street demanding attention and respect others personal space and boundaries.

Great typed a long reply then lost it. Dd sounds very precocious and blind to how annoying she can be. It's all a learning curve though and time for some home truths before she gets any older. Sounds like you / she has this out of date stereotype of pretty little ballerina girls, and she's of the very wrong and spiteful opinion that girls have to be pretty to dance. Calling another girl ugly is just nasty and where has she got this idea from? Sounds like she's full of herself saying the other girl is just jealous, sorry op she sounds arrogant and annoying. Now is the time to have a frank chat with her about these things before she alienates herself from the other kids or they ditch her. You may think she's talented but not everyone else will, it's fine to be a proud parent and it's different when you're at home together, but not appropriate to dance around everywhere when you're in public and around other people, and practicing for a show is no excuse. Put it down to a bad experience and don't text the mum. Put some distance between you and maybe the girls don't even want to be friends, yes the other girl was wrong to throw your dd to the floor, let her mum deal with that and focus on your dd. She needs to tone down the dancing and learn that calling someone ugly, jealous etc is nasty and makes her look horrible. Please talk to her about female stereotypes from the dark ages and teach her that appearance doesn't define who you are or what you can do in life

Deal with your DD her irritating behaviour, her doing it more when asked not too and her misjudged beliefs that a level of prettiness is required to dance.

Let the other mother deal with the other child's discipline, you've got enough on your hands with your child.

@ancientgran I don't think I said that it was acceptable for a child to spit water at anyone! I merely said that both types of behaviour are annoying and need to be dealt with by the parents. Nobody wants their child to be unpopular and excluded by their peers, but if you carry on letting your child be a PITA, that is what will happen.

OP, you need to deal with your daughter's annoying behaviour and tell her to walk properly and sensibly so that she's not in other people's way when she's outside. The other girl's mother needs to deal with her daughter and, possibly, apologise to her for not helping her while this was all going on. Had the mother been a bit more pro-active, her daughter might not have had to resort to shoving. other mother will also need to resist the temptation to say that Dancer Girl got her just desserts

@ancientgran I never said she did. The OP tried to justify her DD pissing about because she was ‘practicing for a show’. I’m assuming her dance class will have appropriate rehearsals in the correct time/place/clothing. A young girl (I’d guess about 9/10) on my estate does this. Goes into the middle of the road doing pirouettes and the like, she goes to a local dance school. I had to wait for nearly five full minutes until she deigned to move once. Parents smile indulgently, as though they expect everyone trying to drive on the road to stop and throw flowers or something, rather than tell her in no uncertain terms that it’s dangerous and inappropriate 🙄.

Regardless of what the kids did, and who started it (I think the other girl started it btw), I couldn't be friends with someone who had been bitching about my child. So for that reason alone, regardless of rights, wrongs and who said what, I would distance myself from said friend and wouldn't actively let the girls spend any time together again as they don't seem to get on.

Calling her names and pushing her down, absolutely not on. And she should apologise.
However your daughter does sound very annoying, so I think you should focus on awareness of others, emotional intelligence etc. Anyone has a right to a hobby, but it is negatively impacting other people if she's literally dancing everywhere. She needs to respect other people's space. She sounds a bit attention seeking, sorry OP, probably annoys both children and adults.

@ancientgran the dancing nasty little madam who thinks only pretty girls dance needs bringing down a peg or two! Let her dance in her bedroom not deliberately in front of others to irritate them.

Over indulged and spoilt, especially as mummy obviously backs up her bad behaviour.

@SophieKaczynsky

Regardless of what the kids did, and who started it (I think the other girl started it btw), I couldn't be friends with someone who had been bitching about my child. So for that reason alone, regardless of rights, wrongs and who said what, I would distance myself from said friend and wouldn't actively let the girls spend any time together again as they don't seem to get on.

Rather than getting on my high horse, I'd wonder why my child was so annoying that another mother had been "bitching" about her...

Agreeing with your DD and saying it is annoying if another child is constantly dancing and why can't she walk properly is not bitching or slagging off the other girl.

[quote Offmyfence]@ancientgran the dancing nasty little madam who thinks only pretty girls dance needs bringing down a peg or two! Let her dance in her bedroom not deliberately in front of others to irritate them.

Over indulged and spoilt, especially as mummy obviously backs up her bad behaviour.

[/quote]
She wasn't the one who started the nasty comments, she wasn't the one who assaulted someone. In a few months when she is 10 the police might be the ones dealing with this and they won't give two hoots about a child dancing on the pavement, they will be interested in a violent child attacking people in the street.

I know which child needs to get some discipline before she gets herself into serious trouble.

@DameAlyson

Why can't she do what she wants,

Why can't the other girl do what she wants, which is to walk without having someone constantly twirling around her? Why is Dancer Girl more important?

No the other girl wants to dictate what other people do and if they don't comply with her demands she assaults them.

It isn't about who is more important it is about having laws about assaulting people plus the danger of a fall actually ending up with something serious. She is actually quite lucky the OPs DD didn't break her arm or get concussion.

She wants just not doing what she wanted though she was actively goading her, doing what was annoying her more deliberately

@ancientgran her mother told her to stop..... little madam decided she wouldn't.

So if the dancing little madam had done what she was told...... guess what.... it wouldn't have escalated?

[quote Stela40]@ancientgran
"Why can't she do what she wants, dancing, if it isn't harming anyone and it isn't illegal? I find lots of things annoying, people who swear constantly, people who sniff, people who use loads of perfume (makes me cough) I can't go round ordering people what to do and attacking them if they don't comply."

I would think constantly twirling around on a pavement in a potentially crowded area (I.e. the school run) and obviously not being able to watch where she is going, is maybe going to end up harming someone....not least of whom could be OP's DD.
As for the annoyances you describe, unless someone stuck their nose right up into your face to sniff, sprayed perfume actually around and onto you or put their mouth right up to your ear to swear into it, then the situations are hardly comparable are they? A BIG difference between learning to deal with those annoyances and having someone twirling and flapping around right in your face to intentionally annoy, goad and provoke.[/quote]
Did she harm someone? No. Did the other girl harm someone? Yes.

I'm not deaf so I can hear someone sniffing or swearing without them being in my face, heavy perfume can make someone with allergies seriously ill (my husband has COPD and it is much more serious for him that someone dancing)

Being violent because you find something annoying is never OK.

[quote Offmyfence]@ancientgran her mother told her to stop..... little madam decided she wouldn't.

So if the dancing little madam had done what she was told...... guess what.... it wouldn't have escalated?

[/quote]
Do you always do what random people tell you to do? As far as we know the OPs DD didn't hurt anyone but the other one did.

Do you seriously think it is OK for kids to be violent?