To argue that this should is not a suitable topic for the Girl Guides

[MovedByFanciesThatAreCurled]

Girlguiding is for girls, aged 10-14. So why then do they feel the need to promote this on their social media?

This week is #AceWeek - a time to raise awareness and understanding of the asexual community. So here’s a shout-out to all of our asexual volunteers and members – thank you for everything you do in Girlguiding.

The reference to ‘members’ is quite clear. What on earth were they thinking in making reference to young girls’ sex lives (or lack of them according to the focus of the Tweet). How, as an organisation, have they strayed so far? I have two boys in the Scouts/Beavers and if this came up on either of their social media pages I would pull them out. Why is it seen to be an acceptable for Girlguiding?!!

And children showing any strong reaction to sex are investigated for abuse. Either too much knowledge or a very strongly worded aversion would be looked at.

Both are potential issues if children are told about asexuality in any way described above (by non education staff).

But I doubt schools can agree on a definition anyway, as posters can't seem to come up with a child friendly definition other than the one we already use.(some people choose to be single and are not interested in a relationship)

I don't know at what point if any, asexuality is described in those terms at school. Certainly not ks2 the starting age of guides. But I would have thought like the rest of gender ideology it is meant to be taught from a belief system point of view.

It simply couldn't be taught as 'if you have an absence of any sexual feelings at any age, that's normal' because of the possibility of missing medical issues causing it. The word may be used, but I would imagine like not starting your periods by your mid to late teens, pupils are advised on to the gp.

Schools should be very wary on teaching this, seeing as how abuse interacts with non typical ideas and responses to sex. If any secondary teacher knows what happens in detail when we pass the baton I would be interested to know.

because of all sorts of issues that can be brought up by girls in a ‘girls only’ space

You mean like having to share tents, toilets and the like with those girls who have penises?

@Franca123

The only bit I truly understood is that an asexual never fancies a celebrity or male stripper groups from the 90s. That was clear as crystal.

You seem determined to have bad faith arguments on here. You understand NOTHING, I have to assume deliberately at this point

Did we ever work out if asexuals can feel sexual attraction or not?

Asexuals do not feel attraction, as has been stated many, many times. They may love their partners, they may become aroused, they may enjoy sex with their partners.

Under the ase umbrella is demisexuality, where someone may be attracted to another person once they get to know them better, once there is already an established relationship there.

If you really want to understand (and I doubt it after your wide eyes posts) then try AVEN.

And at present, happy to be corrected, the orientations protected I'm law are lesbian, gay and bisexual.
I do know that the ks3/4 curriculum goes on to expect children to have a firm grasp of sex and gender in the law.
The only gender identity defined and protected in law is trans sexual and that is dealt in a separate section to orientation.

I can't see how you'd include the numerous preferences without confusing the children.
Those that are teachers know that adding unnecessary confusion into content often creates misconceptions.

If you are asexual and you believe it's an orientation and you are discriminated against for that characteristic purely(not how varying other characteristics like single etc interact) then the obvious course if having it added to the equality act.

You will have to come up with a definition though.

But many prepubertal children will think that means them. And it won’t. So then you need to clarify it. If a prepubertal child then says, “I don’t like anyone, I must be asexual then” what’s your follow up?

That's okay for the moment, that may be the same when you're older or that may change, either of those is ok.

Under the ase umbrella is demisexuality, where someone may be attracted to another person once they get to know them better, once there is already an established relationship there

How is all this not just made up?

Someone is asexual because they don’t feel sexual attraction and then they meet someone they’re really into and find them a) sexually attractive, b) enjoy sex but they are still asexual?

Is there a separate demisexual flag?

Actually - yes, there is a demisexual flag. For a sexuality in which you feel sexual attraction for someone you love.

That's okay for the moment, that may be the same when you're older or that may change, either of those is ok.
Except if there's a medical issue. It's at this point you would send them to a go to reassure them.

So we shouldn't teach it because it's not part of the discrimination act in the UK?

GP not a go.

@BelleOfTheProvince

That's okay for the moment, that may be the same when you're older or that may change, either of those is ok. Except if there's a medical issue. It's at this point you would send them to a go to reassure them.

Is this the part where you ask me if I've had my hormones checked?

What illnesses mean that you are not attracted to anyone?

Let's remember that homosexuality was in the DSM and considered a disorder until 1973.

@slashlover

So we shouldn't teach it because it's not part of the discrimination act in the UK?

No, I was pointing out it would have to be very carefully planned because it doesn't fit in well with national curriculum content.

I expect it is taught as part of a belief system with gender ideology (non statutory) but would like to have a secondary colleague confirm.

My point is it doesn't really fit well in either stated aims of any of the subjects that tackle this. The DfE guidance is too wooly to let you know how or if to teach it.

But anything related to sex is carefully planned in an age expected way, so it may not be even a ks4 content. I wouldn't know. Don't teach big UN's.

I do know that stated aims and expectations are the things you need children to know or Ofsted are not impressed. So I would have thought schools would not confuse legal and non legal content if expected to know without misconceptions.

No. That's the point. I'm not a go.
But some medical issues do cause alack of desire. A teacher would not commit to it being 'always normal'. It'd be passed on to a professional who could make sure nothing else is wrong.
And I am sure they would reassure. But a teacher or guider with very little medical knowledge would pass it on.
Just as we pass on early periods, UTIs and incontinence. All can be normal but we are not qualified to say so.
Two are potential abuse signs.

I'm not a go.
I'm not a go either

GP! Arrhhhhgghh!

We’ve established that asexuals can be attached/attracted to their partners, feel sexual desire (get “horny” as someone described it), be in a serious relationship, enjoy sex and have children.

So not asexual then?

@slashlover

But many prepubertal children will think that means them. And it won’t. So then you need to clarify it. If a prepubertal child then says, “I don’t like anyone, I must be asexual then” what’s your follow up?

That's okay for the moment, that may be the same when you're older or that may change, either of those is ok.

So asexuality is inexplicable to young children then? Can only be explained to older children who have better understanding? So shouldn’t be brought up as a discussion point in GG if the children aren’t at an age to understand otherwise it’s just conflating normal childhood with sexuality?

I remember in the Keira Bell case, when there was a discussion about how very early hormonal manipulation in children could affect sexual desire and function later on - essentially that children who had never had sexual urges and orgasms before transition would be unlikely to have them thereafter

The response was “well, some adults are asexual”.

But I think even that shows a la k or understanding of asexuality, given that they can feel desire, enjoy sex etc

I mean, I don't even have to teach law beyond the age of responsibility and a few child protection based things.

But I can see the possible misconception between the law and the stonewall law. If I had to get kids through an exam or unit on it I'd be aware of that as a possible misconception, and plan accordingly.

Off tangent, but an explanation perhaps for those of you that found your own sex ed lacking. Mostly, the content taught is that prioritised by the scheme, exam etc.

But as I say, I'd like a secondary input because thankfully law is not on my radar. Or calculus. Thank goodness.

@JES2

Do not underestimate the level of safeguarding training that is now expected of all adult members of Girlguiding because of all sorts of issues that can be brought up by girls in a ‘girls only’ space.

Judging by some of the posts in this thread from people who purport to be guide leader and d their social media, they have a poor understanding of it.

@Imissmoominmama

We’ve established that asexuals can be attached/attracted to their partners, feel sexual desire (get “horny” as someone described it), be in a serious relationship, enjoy sex and have children.

So not asexual then?

Asexuality is not about having sex, it is about sexual attraction.

Would you say a heterosexual person was not heterosexual if they fancied other people but had no libido, didn't want to be in a serious relationship or enjoy sex?

Anyway asexuality.org if people are actually interested

Asexuality is not about having sex, it is about sexual attraction

A demisexual will fancy their partners but they will be still be asexual, somehow. Not just heterosexual