To argue that this should is not a suitable topic for the Girl Guides

[MovedByFanciesThatAreCurled]

Girlguiding is for girls, aged 10-14. So why then do they feel the need to promote this on their social media?

This week is #AceWeek - a time to raise awareness and understanding of the asexual community. So here’s a shout-out to all of our asexual volunteers and members – thank you for everything you do in Girlguiding.

The reference to ‘members’ is quite clear. What on earth were they thinking in making reference to young girls’ sex lives (or lack of them according to the focus of the Tweet). How, as an organisation, have they strayed so far? I have two boys in the Scouts/Beavers and if this came up on either of their social media pages I would pull them out. Why is it seen to be an acceptable for Girlguiding?!!

The comparison with the relationship with my DW now is apples and oranges, and I have always been attracted sexually to her, and remain it regardless of how her appearance has changed over time. The idea that I could have settled in my miserable non-sex-attracted marriage for ever and not met her is upsetting. And I - in my own bias - feel bad for anyone who makes do with an "everything else" relationship without giving themselves to find that "full" relationship

Asexual people will never find that "full" relationship though (unless demi) and I'm sure my friends would feel offended that you believe that they are settling.

Its all just going too far in my opinion... be/do what you want... but stop making it fashionable to be 'different'

Sometimes people like to give themselves a label as a shortcut to what they mean and to easily communicate it.

i wouldn't use Stonewall, Aven is a dedicated asexual space, there are even forums. This is their page on grey www.asexuality.org/?q=grayarea

Its all just going too far in my opinion... be/do what you want... but stop making it fashionable to be 'different'

I have been ase since the very early 1990s, it's not being fashionable.

Please can someone at MNHQ explain to me exactly why my previous comment was deleted? There are far more offensive posts on this thread which have NOT been deleted. Sometimes I have sympathy for those extreme religious groups who withdraw their children from society so that they are not exposed to bonkers views such as some of those expressed here. Conventional values are just as valid as modern ones. And possibly more conducive to building a balanced society. Children should be allowed to be children for as long as they want to.

[quote slashlover]Sometimes people like to give themselves a label as a shortcut to what they mean and to easily communicate it.

i wouldn't use Stonewall, Aven is a dedicated asexual space, there are even forums. This is their page on grey www.asexuality.org/?q=grayarea[/quote]
Thanks I’ll take a look!

nolongersuprised that’s not what poster says at p24. The child raised it - not Guides. The leader’s response sounds sensible (it’s fine to feel like that at your age speak to a trusted adult) and child’s Auntie who knows ins and outs was happy with response.
We are now on p37 and no one has said yes i’m teaching my Brownies or Guides about sex/asexuality.
What is put on Twitter and Facebook is not what is being covered in group. It’s offensive to suggest we’d just see a tweet and think hey yes let’s talk about sex this week. All the planning for this term was done months ago. We are volunteers planning, volunteering, safeguarding training, first aid courses are all done in own time unpaid.
I didn’t even know girl guides had Twitter or Facebook until this thread. None of our girls are on Twitter or Facebook (we discussed social media recently as part of a quiz). Chances of a 13+ Guide seeing and raising it in group is virtually nil. Other recent girl guiding twitter topics - Black Lives Matter, Diwali and the Budget certainly haven’t been mentioned by the girls (or us leaders)

@slashlover

Exactly... be who you are/want or whatever... but why post it all over Twitter on a girl guides account.. why make uo all these names and labels for different ideas of attraction ot lack of... some teenagers are using it as a fashion statement..

@BeyondShrinks

I feel I need to clarify my question. When I ask how you "decide" who to have sex with, as an 'asexual who has sex', are they male or female?

As in, are you hetero-asexual, homo-asexual or bi-asexual?
This is why I'm confused (in the case of those who have sex - the 'no sex at all' group I understand completely) - how can it be an orientation rather than a preference, when it must be (in the case of asexuals-who-have-sex) occurring concurrently with the more "usual" orientations? Iyswim?

Disclaimer before I start as I know someone will say it: this is only in reply to a specific question asked by this poster, I’m not saying this is what should be taught to children at guides.

You can be het/homo/bi and still be under the asexual umbrella term.
I suppose that can be confusing as Asexual id used as the umbrella, but within that asexual means not feeling sexual attraction, whilst the term aromantic is used to describe those who don’t feel romantic love or attraction. Some people are both asexual and aromantic, some are one but not the other.
So, if you only fall in love/feel romantic love towards men (as a woman) then you are straight, but also asexual.
I am completely asexual in thst I never ever have felt sexual attraction to anyone, I have however been in love, I loved my husband, we chose to make a life together and we had sex because we wanted children.
I have only felt romantic love toward men. I’ve only had sex with men. So I’d consider myself straight.

@slashlover

Its all just going too far in my opinion... be/do what you want... but stop making it fashionable to be 'different'

I have been ase since the very early 1990s, it's not being fashionable.

I knew I was ‘different’ in that way by the time I was 14, so also the early 90s. We’ve always existed.

Sorry if settling came across as offensive, not my intention. I was responding specifically to "Would being sexually attracted to your partner be the only reason you were with them? All the other reasons you want to be with someone are still there with demi people"

Exactly... be who you are/want or whatever... but why post it all over Twitter on a girl guides account.. why make uo all these names and labels for different ideas of attraction ot lack of... some teenagers are using it as a fashion statement..

It was one post on the GG twitter, they seem to post about a range of things, not sure why this one got all the outrage.

People want to describe themselves and need the language to be able to, "asexual" is a quick way to do that. It also allows me to find other people similar to myself and talk about shared experiences and offer advice.

So because teenagers ae using it then it shouldn't be allowed? Is there an age limit on how we should describe ourselves. If a teen says they are straight, should we tell then they're not?

@TheOriginalEmu

No, i know you have always existed! Thats what im saying... people can be who they are/ who they want to be or however you'd like to put it.. but i feel like these days children and teens strive to pretend they are who they aren't really as it seems cool to them to not be straight (even though they really are) as it is seen as being 'differnt' to the majority. I also feel that there are too many labels for different sexualities and that people should just be people and like who/what they want without having to shout everywhere that they like what they like... does it matter really... do people actually care? Unfortunately there are people who still do though and i understand that. Job forms etc shouldn't even ask for a sexuality bevause its irrelevant

[quote BloodinGutters]@TheOriginalEmu

Oh so you are explaining this to young kids then? Because you said it doesn’t come up in class then you say saying not being attracted to people is valid is how you’d explain to young kids. That you’d save the ‘nuance’ for older kids.

So which is it? Does this come up in classes or not? Because @Ozanj gave an account of how it came up in her daughter/nieces class -can’t recall which - and you’ve conviniently skipped that one[/quote]
I think you have a comprehension problem, either that or you are deliberately trying to be obtuse.

Firstly, I am not teaching anything in any class, I’m not a teacher, or in any position to be teaching groups of children anything. I said IF I was to be teaching children about sexuality at 10 I would make it as simple as ‘some people fancy boys, some fancy girls and some don’t fancy anyone. You might not ever fancy anyone and that’s ok. It’s normal’.
That’s it.

I also did not say ‘young kids’ I said young PEOPLE. young people are teenagers, not small children.

I didn’t skip what Ozanj said, I just didn’t see the post as I was too busy trying to answer your questions that are designed to nit pick and pull apart everything I say for some reason.
I only replied to this thread as I felt able to try and explain somethings from an ace perspective, and because my lived experience makes me wish I’d known I wasn’t the only person who feels like I do.
I didn’t reply to be told I’m one step away from a groomer and that I just want a flag and to be special…I have no interest in a flag and I would LOVE to just be like everyone else on this.

@Slashlover

At the age of ten .. maybe its nit appropriate to be discussing if they like willies vaginas or none or both?... thats my opinion...

But my other point is because th subject receives sooo nuch media attention, it forces the nees to choose a sexuality onto children and teens... why cant they just be whoever? Why do they need a label? And my other point is that i personally feel that children and teenagers want to choose the less popular option so they seem 'cool'and 'different ' to the majority meaning thay Some might pretent they are someome they're not which is a bit unfortunate...

Im saying i think sexuality labels shouldnt be so forced in people faces and should be more fluid.. basically be who you are and stop labelling everything there doesnt need to be lables really

You like boys.. ok, you like girls, ok...both? Ok... you like boys dressed as girl's, girls dressed as boys, boys who used to be girls, boys who are in a girls body... teapots, chickens, nothing?... who cares you're a person

[quote Newbabynewhouse]@TheOriginalEmu

No, i know you have always existed! Thats what im saying... people can be who they are/ who they want to be or however you'd like to put it.. but i feel like these days children and teens strive to pretend they are who they aren't really as it seems cool to them to not be straight (even though they really are) as it is seen as being 'differnt' to the majority. I also feel that there are too many labels for different sexualities and that people should just be people and like who/what they want without having to shout everywhere that they like what they like... does it matter really... do people actually care? Unfortunately there are people who still do though and i understand that. Job forms etc shouldn't even ask for a sexuality bevause its irrelevant[/quote]
It’s easy to say it doesn’t matter and you should just be who you are, when who you are falls into the ‘norm’, but when how you feel doesn’t fit with that norm and you feel like you’re the only one, and you’re strange and there must be something wrong with you because you don’t feel things everyone else does….that label often brings with it a validity and legitimacy to who you are. It means you find out there are others like you and you’re not weird or broken.
The amount of grilling that I and other asexual people have had on this thread shows that we do need to talk about it, to try and understand. Or if you don’t understand, just accept what we are telling you.

Teenagers…well they are teenagers, being unsure about who you are is par for the course, some may decide they are ace now, and change their mind as they develop. That’s ok. It’s not like you have your sex card revoked if you say you’re ace.

What is put on Twitter and Facebook is not what is being covered in group

No, but it speaks for the wider culture of GG, in that it’s happily raising “awareness” of a sexuality in which people have sex but don’t feel sexual attraction.

Some people are happy about this and would have found it helpful but it’s happening in the context of a culture where very young children are internalising ever increasing messages about sexuality and gender expression.

Children are reliant on boundaries being set for them by adults, and some groups seem hell-bent on introducing sexually themed topics to young children.

As more and more “awareness” weeks for the 100 plus genders filter through, there’ll be posters who say, “If I’d known I was a Maverique (?sp) Demiboi at 12 my early adult life would have been much better” without looking at the wider picture of increased exposure to what should be adult themes

@nolongersurprised

This is exaxtly what im saying...

@TheOriginalEmu does make a point though of saying that some peoole need the label to feel normal which i also understand...

No, but it speaks for the wider culture of GG, in that it’s happily raising “awareness” of a sexuality in which people have sex but don’t feel sexual attraction.

People in loving relationships who show enthusiastic consent and enjoy the experience but happen to not be attracted sexually to their partner.

If they say they support heterosexuality then are they raising "awareness" of a sexuality in which people have ONS and have sex with multiple people in one night?

YABU. And rather homophobic too.

[quote Newbabynewhouse]@Slashlover

At the age of ten .. maybe its nit appropriate to be discussing if they like willies vaginas or none or both?... thats my opinion...

But my other point is because th subject receives sooo nuch media attention, it forces the nees to choose a sexuality onto children and teens... why cant they just be whoever? Why do they need a label? And my other point is that i personally feel that children and teenagers want to choose the less popular option so they seem 'cool'and 'different ' to the majority meaning thay Some might pretent they are someome they're not which is a bit unfortunate...

Im saying i think sexuality labels shouldnt be so forced in people faces and should be more fluid.. basically be who you are and stop labelling everything there doesnt need to be lables really[/quote]
At the age of ten people in my class had boyfriend and girlfriends, nobody mentioned penises or vaginas. If someone told you they had a boyfriend would you then say "Ah, so you like dick?"

If a teen chooses to identify as asexual then who are they hurting? I do think teens should be taught that just because they think they are straight/gay/bi/ase/whatever at 14, it does not have to define their entire life and they can change it if they feel differently later.

@Slashlover

No i wouldn't say ahh so you like dick?

Because just because theu have a boyfriend doesnt mean they are straight or gay .. they might like anyone... they might like people for their personality? Not caring about what body part they have...

If they say they support heterosexuality

How about they don’t support any sexuality? Just build camp fires?

It comes down to whether all of this awareness raising of sexuality/gender to children is inherently helpful or harmful. You obviously find it helpful becuase it would have helped you. I agree with a pp who described it as “dumbed down queer theory” and am concerned that intimately children’s boundaries around talking about sex and sexuality have shifted

@Slashlover

But i thought people were "born who they are... and its not a choice" thats what we get told isnt it..?