Breastfeeding in public

[Allthingsfloralandpatterned88]

So I'm sitting in the corner of a reasonably busy cafe with DS (3 months) and he starts wailing. I realise I am wearing a dress that isn't amazing for nursing as I have to hike my boob over the top as opposed to opening it at the side. But I do this and latch him on.

However DM who I am with starts shrieking "darling you can't do that" and trys to stop me. She then keeps trying to drape things over my boob and DS's head which means he then loses his latch and I get flustered.

She is great with DS and a big help but she has done this a few times before/ suggested I find a quiet room etc. Is this a generational thing? I've been quite happy feeding in public but she makes me feel like a kind of mad hippy! I now am starting to feel self conscious for feeding in public around her and its making me more anxious about feeding in public in general. I kind of feel as though I should stick to my guns because I don't feel like I should always have to leave the room/ try and find somewhere in private when I'm out and about. Early motherhood is hard enough as it is!

My problem with expectations that BFing be 'discreet' is that it sends a terrible message to mothers who don't find BFing as simple as 'pop baby up their jumper, job done'.

As already outlined, that could be because of poor latches, fast let downs, inquisitive babies, large breasts, etc.

The expectation can put these women off feeding in public and perhaps altogether. Given our woeful BFing rates we would be doing everything we can to prevent that happening.

And yes, I know people will say 'oh we aren't talking about those mothers', but that's not how it comes across to them. As already discussed, if not those mothers who are you talking about?

I also take issue with it because we live in a world where breasts are everywhere. Yet it's only when they're being used for their intended purpose rather than men's sexual pleasure that we need to be 'discreet' about them. 🙄

@hotmeatymilk

Back on track- yes, even dealing with a fussing baby, your priority is not being discreet. However, it's not so hard to pull your child Close to you and get the boob from underneath the if possible Sorry, you want me to use my baby as a breast shield and pull my boob out from underneath them? Are you OK?

I thought it's normal to pull your baby close. Do you take your ready out, then go and get your baby from the pram after?

@hotmeatymilk

Why do some of you have an issue with others wanting BFing mums to be discreet? Is it a feminist thing? Is it genuinely that difficult for you? To answer your questions in order: My issue is that breastfeeding is for the benefit of babies and children, and anyone who has a problem with seeing it can solve that issue easily by looking away, versus the difficulties many of us have described on this thread. Breasts are for feeding, babies need to be fed (it’s pretty much vital), “discreet” doesn’t need to come into it.

Is it a feminist thing? Yes. But you can also not be a feminist and breastfeed! Or be a feminist ally and breastfeed! Feminism and breastfeeding are great, but you don’t have to do both or either. You can look away! (Though looking away from feminism is weird imo.)

Is it genuinely that difficult? Yes. But crucially, even if it were easy, I don’t think “being discreet” should be on any breastfeeding parent’s mind: they’re feeding a kid! Why not also let them chat to a friend, eat some cake, read a book, scroll on MN, fucking HYDRATE, instead of one-handedly faffing with muslins and buttons and covers and fussy babies?

My question back to you: why do you think women should prioritise your comfort (a want, easily resolved by not looking) over their breastfeeding (a need, not easily resolved by not doing it)?

Feeding baby is a priority but most times you can feed baby and also be mindful at the same time, they're not mutually exclusive. I know I don't have wear a shroud when I'm feeding, but I wouldn't want anyone to feel awkward - even if it's "their" issue, if it can be avoided

I BF, my son had a tongue tie, I have blockages, a fussy child. I don't think I'm more important than anyone else though

That's great for you.

What about the mothers who found it really difficult, worried they weren't being 'discreet' enough and gave up breast feeding altogether? Because they 'weren't more important than anyone else' like you say.

Is that the kind of outcome you're looking for? Because don't kid yourself it doesn't happen.

I thought it's normal to pull your baby close. Do you take your ready out, then go and get your baby from the pram after?
Yes, I prance around tit out to collect the baby – sometimes I even forget the baby or why I’m exposed.

Or… stuffing a comically small DD up against boobs that were 32E before milk then trying to wangle one out discreetly would be a laughable endeavour – that’s a lot of mammary.

Do none of you anti-normal-breastfeeding posters remember having to learn breastfeeding and teach the baby? No one had to do the thing of squeezing down their boob into a “sandwich” and then flipping it up into the baby’s mouth? Readjusting latch because you got it wrong and staying latched would risk nipple blisters? Baby pulling away because of aggressive letdown – or a blister bursting and the backed-up milk spraying out? Needing to massage a lump? Having to feed rugby ball style for a bit because of a lump? Getting an angry hungry baby out of the sling too late (never did master feeding in the sling) so it won’t do the close maternal nestle/convenient boob cover-up thing? Went to feed from one side before realising you’re completely lopsided and your neglected tit is either going to soak the place or needs feeding from, stat?

I generally nestled DD in the crook of my arm but sometimes, SHOCKINGLY, some 25% of boob was exposed for up to 15 seconds. In a cafe! With people! With their eyes!

I don’t feed my 26 month old in public, because I know it makes more people uncomfortable than a smaller baby, but when she’s asking after having hurt herself or something, and I know she’d find it a huge comfort, I resent bowing to pressure. It’s not actually shameful or wrong in any way and the feelings of strangers should be irrelevant.

@TheKeatingFive

In my NCT was a mother with enormous breasts who had to wear nipple shields. Trying to put them on discreetly whilst her baby was screaming for milk and everyone stared is a large part of why she gave up early and felt extremely unhappy about having done so. It’s so cruel to heap pressure on women to cover up in the beginning when it’s already so fraught and stressful, particularly as it’s not something which really needs to be hidden!

@SparrowNest

I know that feeling very well

That's so sad Justheretoaskaquestion91

We're not anything like as supportive of BFing as we need to be, which is a huge societal failure. And 'I don't see why mothers can't be discreet' is part of that.

@Justheretoaskaquestion91 I’ve got another one coming soon, and if she wants to feed at the same time as the newborn I’ve decided I’m not going to deny it and create unnecessary friction and jealousy, so anyone who has a problem is just going to have to mind their own business and deal with it.

I imagine I might end up with a defiant sort of expression on my face, because I’ll be dreading comments and judgement. If that’s ‘performance breastfeeding’ to some posters than so be it.

@Ponoka7

It's interesting that the subject of penises has come up. We never had a page three erection, just tits. Men's lower halves couldn't be shown on television, but breasts could. Yet when they are slightly publicly in view being used for what they are designed for, some people have issues. My DD breastfed 2015-2018, two babies, publicly and I was pleased that she had nothing but positive comments, especially from older to elderly people.

Laughing my head off at the idea of a "page 3 erection".

@SparrowNest

I did tandem feeding (not in public but at bedtime and nighttime) and i credit it for the reason my eldest has never been jealous. Good luck xx

Agree fully @TheKeatingFive

My mum did this a bit. Astonishingly my dad was much, much more supportive. I think he was breastfed, and my uncle. But my mum wasn't and she didn't feed me.

Anyway I told her that this is what I was doing and she was going to have to keep her opinions to herself as it was her job to support me in whichever way I needed. It put an end to it.

I personally found wearing a tank/vest top and a looser tee or top over, and doing the one-up one-down method, by far the easiest and most discreet for out and about.

Is this a generational thing?

It's a certain type of woman thing rather than more than a generational thing.

I'm 72 and had my first child in 1980 and the last in 1987. I breast fed all of them in public. Yes, I did get some funny looks at times but nobody ever said anything to me.

Women being subject to unpleasant comments and odd looks when bf in public happens all the time and it isn't just coming from older people.

It's only very recently that staff in places such as cafés, shops and restaurants have not been allow to ask bfing women to leave or cover themselves up.

Men have nipples, but for some reason they are OK to be seen but because women’s nipples are usually larger and on a small mound they must be hidden because they might offend? 🤦‍♀️

Views like this make me want to walk down my local high street in just my knickers! Unfortunately it’s rather chilly.

We have boobs, you can see the outline of them through our clothes. Uncovered, they are flesh coloured. And the offensive aspect of this is... ?

I grew up in a place where women whipped out their breast everywhere to feed their babies and no one batted an eyelid because we all understood it’s functional.

When I had my own, I fed them in such a way that my breasts were never exposed ( unless someone wanted to sit closely and look under the vest or something).

I’m however uncomfortable watching women whip out their breasts from the top and feeding their babies. Whenever I’m with friends who feed this way, I find ways to make myself look occupied.

I’m however uncomfortable watching women whip out their breasts from the top and feeding their babies

But why does it make you uncomfortable? It’s so much easier

@Justheretoaskaquestion91 thank you!

@Yogaandcocoa

"I think it's mostly unnecessary to show your full breast for long periods while feeding. That's my opinion"

But why? Who is it hurting? Why should women always be the ones making their lives harder on the off chance someone might be uncomfortable?

I mentioned it a few pages ago, but what would have been your point of view when hemlines started rising? That the women showing off full ankle for long periods should have made efforts to cover themselves lest some random stranger feel uncomfortable at the sight? Or should they have been free to go about their lives as they chose?

Is this just another instance of society telling women that their bodies should be hidden as much as possible? Gods forbid you get labelled indiscreet.

@Yogaandcocoa

I think it is a generational thing and also maybe people who haven't BF in public or seen others do so don't know how to handle it. My DH can be awkward about me feeding in public and often suggests going somewhere private. I am mostly comfortable feeding him out and about.

However I also agree with this:

You breast feed your baby, you know the chances of your baby needing a feed is high, so why wear a dress rather than something with easy access that allows the job to be done with the minimum of fuss.

I don't think it's necessary to show everything when you are feeding and I tend to wear a vest under t shirts so that I can feed discreetly.

In a way I am not surprised your DM was embarrassed if you had your breast out over your dress and often wonder why women don't wear BF friendly clothing!

Yes I kind of agree with this. Of course you should be able to breastfeed your baby in public but my mum would be equally horrified if I got my whole breast out in public. I could only breastfeed my second and if I wasn't wearing something where I could discreetly feed I'd go somewhere private.

We went on a trip to the zoo with PIL once when dd was about 4 months old, we went into the restaurant to get some food and our table was next to the queue to order food....MIL was mortified when I said I was going to feed the baby and she suggested I went and sat over the other side of the room in the middle of a load of chairs that had been all stacked up and sectioned off (cos of covid) 😂 I would have looked like a right idiot and would have stood out more for doing that rather than discreetly feeding dd at our table.

It was our first full day out with her and I was nervous about feeding her in public to start with! That comment made me a bit angry but made me feel like I'm feeding my baby whether you like it or not and I will not go and shove myself in a pile of chairs to do it!

Keep feeding your baby in public OP it's the most natural thing in the world and when other breastfeeding mums see you it makes them feel more comfortable too. Your doing a good job!

@Rosebel - Discretion is not required. The issue is that there is no need to be discreet. Mums are not doing anything untoward, just feeding a baby, not having a wee in the woods.

I could only breastfeed my second and if I wasn't wearing something where I could discreetly feed I'd go somewhere private.
The right to breastfeed publicly is enshrined in law. Fair enough if you or any individual prefers to feed privately, but legally no one has to go somewhere private or feed discreetly.

I’m sure I’ll be accused of strawmanning with this one but fuck it: in my NCT class there was a woman with disabilities who had very low milk production, but whose baby would only accept the breast. The baby would take formula, but from the breast: a workaround reached by midwives and lactation consultants to tape tubes from a bottle to her nipple where the baby could suckle.

Due to her disabilities the only way she could prepare to feed was to put the baby down, arrange herself, then pick the baby up. Arranging in her case was not simply “discreetly exposing a tiny sliver of breast”, but taping on a contraption while her baby cried and drew attention to the commotion.

Obviously that’s an extreme situation but it is incredibly ableist and disregarding to those with disabilities or who are neurodiverse or who have any number of issues that might make it difficult to “feed discreetly” or go elsewhere to feed privately, to come on threads like this and start talking about performance feeding, flopping and whapping breasts, exposing whole breasts, and so on. Not talking about the pp I quoted here but about everyone on this thread who is shaming women for not feeding as they see fit.

I never knew so many people were against getting a boob out over a top rather than under one!
I tend to do one up one down in cold weather but in summer I basically live in vest tops so popping a boob over the top is the only way to feed!

Once DD is latched you can’t see any more than when the top is worn normally as her head is in the way. Until reading this I always thought this was a lot more discreet than faffing about with layers and clips as then it’s obvious what you’re doing whereas when I feed DD it’s less than a second to get her popped on.

FWIW I think telling other women they must be discreet to bf in public is quite damaging and likely to reduce our already absolutely shockingly low bf rates even further. If I notice someone feeding in public I offer a quick smile and then go back to whatever I’m doing.

IMO any public feeding normalises breastfeeding and I view that as a good thing.