Thank god we don’t live in Sweden. AIBU?

[sw1v]

I was just reading in another thread that in Sweden, you are basically forced to send your babies into day care settings at the age of 1. Apparently 50% of 1 year olds are in full- time nurseries (very long days inc. parents’ commutes) and 95% by the time they are 2! Plus (unlike in the U.K.) there is apparently no minimum ratio for staff to children.

But what if you are a mother who simply doesn’t want to do this (or father)? I personally, would hate this. So how is it acceptable for ‘the state’ to be interfering in people’s personal spheres and family lives by making this ‘the societal norm.’ Is it because they are a high tax society and want more tax? Is this it? Well, it seems like an infringement on personal liberties to me (without wanting to sound too dramatic).

AIBU?

@sw1v

“Sweden doesn't force children into childcare but not working is frowned upon. Moving here I decided to take a couple of years off (able to support myself not claiming) to learn the language and settle the children (non Swedish speaking at the time). I have lost count at the amount of time I have been asked 'so what do you do all day' including the children's teacher and a Surgeon prior to surgery and not in a jokey way. As a society, in general it's very judgemental and suspicious.”

Also this ^. It’s subtle, but insidious and annoying. Nobody has ever asked me this type of question. It’s nobody’s business!

I also live in rural Sweden and was also a SAHM for several years and this was not my experience. But you don't wish to hear about anything that doesn't reinforce your preconceptions

@sw1v

Parker231 - I respect your question, but I think ultimately, people are complicated, life is complicated and there’s no such thing as “one size fits all.”

You don’t seem very positive about the opportunities in Sweden for equality in the workplace and home. The U.K. is appalling at this. The Swedish system is to be envied.

@sw1v

But the ‘forced’ statement was discussed, explained and dealt with many, many pages ago and, in any case, I was hardly implying children are dragged off the streets! It’s obvious what I meant fgs.

The only thing that obvious from all your posts is that you don’t want to live in an environment where your choice not to work is seen as unusual, and you seem deeply hostile to the idea that, given access to inexpensive, high-quality childcare, most women opt to use it.

I’m not ‘hostile’ to anyone or anything. I’m just saying thanks god I don’t live in Sweden because it doesn’t sound as if it would suit me particularly. I asked AIBU. Many people said YABU. Fair enough. I accept that type of society would suit many people. I hear that. I still wouldn’t want to live there personally though. I don’t believe in ‘one size fits’ all as I said, and this would not ‘fit’ me. That’s it really.

I lived in Sweden. It's bloody marvellous.
The amount of bullshit hyperbole, downright lies peddled on this thread is staggering. FFS.

Actually go and live there then spout this shit. Except you wouldn't.

@Alonelonelylonersbadidea

I lived in Sweden. It's bloody marvellous. The amount of bullshit hyperbole, downright lies peddled on this thread is staggering. FFS.

Actually go and live there then spout this shit. Except you wouldn't.

You are right. OP won't.

OP lives in SW London, UK with 4 dcs and a Big Man dh who earns enough to pay top rate 45% tax which absolves him from getting involved on the domestic front and is enough to send 4 dcs to private prep school dominated by equally sheltered SAHMs who are untroubled by the inconvenience of having to earn a living to help support a family. She views the world through her own lens and prejudices so thick that hardly any light or critical thinking gets through.

She is also tone deaf and anti-feminist. She probably cannot see that because it is apparently more reasonable for entire societies which facilitate (not force, let's be clear) 2 working parents to change so as to avoid hurting her feelings and invalidating her insular choices.

Would you like salt with that bag of chips?

Give over and stop taking everything so literally and extrapolating nonsense. You don’t have to agree with me, but you can attempt to be civil. Other people manage it. Asking ‘entire societies’ to change - what utter bollocks. As if.

@sw1v

Would you like salt with that bag of chips?

Give over and stop taking everything so literally and extrapolating nonsense. You don’t have to agree with me, but you can attempt to be civil. Other people manage it. Asking ‘entire societies’ to change - what utter bollocks. As if.

But that's exactly what you implied - that Sweden is wrong for making SAHMs feel out of place and should change its so as not to burden them with the pressure of this particular social norm.

Change its ways*

I also live in rural Sweden and was also a SAHM for several years and this was not my experience. But you don't wish to hear about anything that doesn't reinforce your preconceptions

Same here. I've lived in rural Sweden for 15 years and have never worked and nobody has ever so much as raised an eyebrow about it.

I’m not asking Sweden to change anything . Where did I say or imply that? What I said was, I personally wouldn’t fit in there, by the sound of it, so lucky I don’t live there. That was the AIBU and I was happy for people to tell me I am BU or to change my mind. That’s why you post on here, isn’t it?

It’s like people take 1+1 and make 3 on here sometimes.

“I also live in rural Sweden and was also a SAHM for several years and this was not my experience. But you don't wish to hear about anything that doesn't reinforce your preconceptions

Same here. I've lived in rural Sweden for 15 years and have never worked and nobody has ever so much as raised an eyebrow about it.”

No I do wish to hear that and I’m glad to hear it.

You said 'we' in your post title. It would have been helpful to put 'my family and I' instead. Because as you have noticed, 'we' do not agree with you for the most part.

@sw1v

I’m not asking Sweden to change anything . Where did I say or imply that? What I said was, I personally wouldn’t fit in there, by the sound of it, so lucky I don’t live there. That was the AIBU and I was happy for people to tell me I am BU or to change my mind. That’s why you post on here, isn’t it?

It’s like people take 1+1 and make 3 on here sometimes.

From your original post:

So how is it acceptable for ‘the state’ to be interfering in people’s personal spheres and family lives by making this ‘the societal norm.’

You're questioning if it's acceptable. Not a big leap at all to assume you would like it to change.

No one is 'forced' to send children.

However, they do have high quality, state funded childcare. It's not surprising that the majority of parents take advantage of this, and become economically active as a result.

@pointythings

You said 'we' in your post title. It would have been helpful to put 'my family and I' instead. Because as you have noticed, 'we' do not agree with you for the most part.

True maybe ‘tg I don’t live in Sweden’ is more apt title

But really out of all the countries in the world to be relieved about Sweden is pushing it, plus it’s not as if it’s likely

It’s a question. Somebody could ask, “So how is it acceptable for the state to insist children in the U.K. are in school at 4 and make this a societal norm?’ Questions provoke discussion and this is a discussion forum on the internet.

Sorry, that last post was to the JudgementalCactus

Children in the U.K. go to school age four to receive an education. Other countries have different starting ages. My DT’s were more than ready for school at age four so a later start would have meant additional time in nursery wasting learning time. You can always home educate if you want a different method of schooling.
@sw1v - you seem so negative of the benefits to the wider society of equality in the workplace and home.

OP, I heard that the Swedish state forces kids from the age of 9 into ‘Eurovision Camps’ where they only study europop and ABBA songs, wearing a uniform of tight fitting satin jumpsuits in a cruel attempt to relive the Eurovision glory days. Thank God we don’t live there!

By ‘we’ I actually meant my family. But again, I don’t expect people to agree with me. If that’s what I was looking for, I wouldn’t post on here, I can tell you that for nothing.

I feel the way I do, but I don’t mind being challenged on that. You never know, you might learn something!

There's so much backpeddling on this thread it's causing my phone to smoke.

I’m really not saying I want to home educate Parker. Are you joking? It was just an offhand illustration of posing a question.

I also have it on good authority that no Swede is naturally blonde, the government provides free peroxide and anyone who refuses to use it is taxed another 20% in top of the 90% tax everyone already pays.
Honestly, you couldn’t make it up.

I’m not back-pedalling at all. I still genuinely think, ‘thank god we don’t live in Sweden’ because, by the found of it overall, I don’t think it would suit me or my husband in this specific area. That’s my stance. Other people seem to think it’s wonderful and I can see why and that’s fine.