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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

Being gay and "Straight Passing"

171 replies

doublecleansing · 24/10/2021 16:13

One of my friends is gay and in his 20s, I'm trying to word this in the right way because I don't want to offend anyone but my friend is someone who is what you could call "straight passing" in that people don't think he is gay unless he tells you he is. It annoys him that people assume he is straight and he has to come out to people. AIBU to think that it is pretty crap of society in assuming people's sexuality if they don't fit a stereotype. Why does society presume you are straight if you don't fit certain stereotypes of what society perceives what a gay man is normally?

OP posts:
asteroommatus · 24/10/2021 20:14

@Kanaloa totally agree.

I really can't fathom why he would expect a relative, of any age, to presume he may be gay.

PlausibleSuit · 24/10/2021 20:16

@BigYellowHat

I have a medical condition which affects around 1 in 350 people. Should I be offended because people assume I don’t have it? (It’s an invisible disability)

Where does this madness end 🤷‍♀️ He sounds like an attention seeking snowflake. Is he vegan?

As if you just equated being gay to a medical condition or a disability!
Ledition · 24/10/2021 20:16

YABU it's just a numbers game. Probability states he's straight because the majority of society is so if he's not obviously gay it's reasonable to assume he's straight. Mostly you can tell when someone's gay, I've only ever been "surprised" once with an old boss who I assumed was straight. Then we were on a work night out and he was a completely different person - as camp as Christmas - so there was no need to "come out" to me as it was as obvious as can be. Friends of mine from childhood that came out as gay as adults came as no surprise. It's very clear usually from quite young.

Leafygreen1 · 24/10/2021 20:16

@SoniaFouler gosh.. this is going in circles. the whole point is the world wouldn't end if 50% of people weren't 100% straight. gay and bi people can / will have kids too. that's all

Gwenhwyfar · 24/10/2021 20:17

"As if you just equated being gay to a medical condition or a disability!"

No, she equated it to being part of a minority.

toconclude · 24/10/2021 20:19

No1 son is a straight passing bisexual ( married to a man) - does not bother him in the slightest, in fact he rather likes surprising people with it😁

3scape · 24/10/2021 20:19

Some people need to check in on their social skills! I know plenty of straight people who manage not to assume everyone is and have managed to have an open conversation. Think before speaking. It would probably help in a lot of scenarios

Gwenhwyfar · 24/10/2021 20:20

"gay and bi people can / will have kids too. that's all"

Well to carry on the circle, they cannot conceive naturally in their gay relationship so yes, there would be fewer children if that was the case for 50% of the population (even if they can sometimes procreate with the opposite sex or conceive artificially).

SoniaFouler · 24/10/2021 20:24

[quote Leafygreen1]@SoniaFouler gosh.. this is going in circles. the whole point is the world wouldn't end if 50% of people weren't 100% straight. gay and bi people can / will have kids too. that's all[/quote]
I already said I disagreed with that. And you were the one that said gay people have been having children forever, even when it was pointed out that having children together in out and committed relationships is a very new and recent thing in the history of our world. (And that’s not even touching upon the fact that in the majority of the world, this STILL isn’t legal).

Leafygreen1 · 24/10/2021 20:26

@Gwenhwyfar I don't know how you could assume there would be less. . if I think of me, and my 8 closest friends (lesbians) , 6 of us have children.
if I think of my 8 closest straight friends 5 of them happen to have children.

I know that's only me but I know of plenty of other gay people having children too and plenty of straight people who don't. which I'm sure plays out across the world.

I am lucky that I can have my children and raise them in a gay relationship, however if I was in a country where that wasn't allowed I would probably be forced to have them with a man. it would however not change my actual sexuality - which would just remain hidden lesbian.

Leafygreen1 · 24/10/2021 20:30

@SoniaFouler I think you are confusing the fact that a gay person is still gay even when they have had to pretend to be in a straight relationship . Gay people have existed forever.. and HAVE been having children forever just raising them in " fake "relationships.

SoniaFouler · 24/10/2021 20:35

[quote Leafygreen1]@SoniaFouler I think you are confusing the fact that a gay person is still gay even when they have had to pretend to be in a straight relationship . Gay people have existed forever.. and HAVE been having children forever just raising them in " fake "relationships.[/quote]
I’m not confusing anything, I think you’ve lost sight of where the topic of conversation stemmed from and are now moving the goalposts to fit an argument.

Gay people have existed forever.. and HAVE been having children forever just raising them in " fake "relationships.

…Which was the entire point raised in the first place but you initially disagreed with Hmm Seriously, read the conversation back and it’s exactly what was said.

Thehop · 24/10/2021 20:35

Never heard anything so daft.

Most people think my brother is straight because it’s the default. He’s perfectly happy for them to assume that because it’s nobody’s bloody business. By the same token, if it comes up he’s fine with talking about his husband.

Chicchicchicchiclana · 24/10/2021 20:37

Yanbu. It is tiresome for gay people to have to keep "coming out" because people lazily assume they are straight.

Leafygreen1 · 24/10/2021 20:40

@soniafouler

" 50% of the world are probably not straight"

someone disagreed with that as they said the population would died out..

I said it wouldn't die out as none straight people can get pregnant no problem..

and you agree with me that indeed they can /do/have throughout history. so what on earth are u arguing against?

is to say..

doublemonkey · 24/10/2021 20:45

@doublecleansing

My friend doesn't want to be assumed gay but at the same time doesn't want to be assumed straight. When his nan passed away (this was before he had told people he was gay), his Uncle gave him his nan's engagement ring as a gift to give to his future wife when he gets married which according to my friend made him think people were assuming he is straight.
His Uncle giving him his Nan's ring for his future wife is actually very sweet but your pal is somehow offended by this?

He sounds like a sourpuss.

SoniaFouler · 24/10/2021 20:51

[quote Leafygreen1]@soniafouler

" 50% of the world are probably not straight"

someone disagreed with that as they said the population would died out..

I said it wouldn't die out as none straight people can get pregnant no problem..

and you agree with me that indeed they can /do/have throughout history. so what on earth are u arguing against?

is to say..[/quote]
I initially disagreed with that (can’t be bothered to look back, but I think I may have quoted you) and mentioned those figures are probably down to the “queer” trend rather than actually being “non heterosexual/bisexual and the results of that poll(?) show accordingly. Though I also agree that the population would die out (keeping in mind how it would alter society’s general heteronormative and family expectations - and considering that just because lesbians can get pregnant “no problem”, half of the worlds population of men wouldn’t “rise to the occasion” should that “50% of the population are gay” notion exist.

YOU were the one that kept insisting that out gay people have been having children [together] since “forever” and even when Gwen pointed out that the only reason gay people have been having children “forever” is because in the past they had children by procreating with the opposite sex, you were still insisting that that wasn’t true. Its only in your last few posts that you’ve changed your argument and are now agreeing with us. The question is, what on Earth are YOU arguing against?

Staffy1 · 24/10/2021 21:02

What did he expect his uncle to say? “Here’s your Nan’s wedding ring to give to your future wife, unless you are gay or asexual”.

DecadentlyDecisive · 24/10/2021 21:05

Love it or hate it, the default orientation in the UK is Heterosexual.

Unfortunately the media throw so many OTT Gay Men at us that many people genuinely don't realise that "being camp" isn't mandatory....

beatrice14 · 24/10/2021 21:16

Staffy, he could give the ring to his future husband!

PlausibleSuit · 24/10/2021 21:16

Correcting a misconception isn’t the same as ‘being offended’.

If someone assumes I’m straight I will correct them. I’m not offended, they’re just bloody wrong!

Gwenhwyfar · 24/10/2021 21:19

@beatrice14

Staffy, he could give the ring to his future husband!
Is it likely to fit a man's finger?
Gwenhwyfar · 24/10/2021 21:23

"@Gwenhwyfar I don't know how you could assume there would be less. . if I think of me, and my 8 closest friends (lesbians) , 6 of us have children.
if I think of my 8 closest straight friends 5 of them happen to have children."

Quite apart from anything else, if you have 16 of them, they aren't your closest friends!
No point discussing the other bit as you keep missing the point.

WeBuiltThisBuffetOnSausageRoll · 24/10/2021 21:25

I complained once in healthcare setting when I referenced my partner and the HCP kept referring to my husband. It is a simple basic courtesy to use the same language as the patient and not assume partner = husband. And I say this as a married straight woman!

Not wanting to derail this thread, but the opposite has happened across the board over the last 10-20 years, whereby the word 'partner' is now used as the default. To a great many of us who are married, we do not consider in any way that we have a 'partner' - we have a husband or a wife.

I realise people will claim that, semantically-speaking, a spouse IS a 'life partner' - but words matter, there are common 'understandings' (e.g. a 'boyfriend' is not just one of many friends who happen to be male) and it is not up to other people to decide how we should define our relationships.

I bear no malice or judgment at all against those who are partners (i.e. people in a romantic, unmarried relationship), and proudly define thesmelves as such; but the same courtesy is not normally extended to the rest of us who do want to define ourselves relationally as having a husband/wife/spouse.

WeBuiltThisBuffetOnSausageRoll · 24/10/2021 21:28

....To clarify, forms could very easily say 'spouse/partner' and thus include both groups, but they just about never do and just expect the one group to budge up along, shut up and join with the other, instead of acknowledging two distinct groups.