To think this is weird after a 3rd date?

[cocavino]

We kissed heavily on date 2. On date 3, he had plans at midnight, thus necessitating ending the date at 12pm???

He followed up with a text about what a great time he had.

I'm a bit put off.

@5catsonthedesk

‘I’m mid forties but reading these posts make me feel really old. Or else maybe I’m lucky that people in my circle just wouldn’t do this and if they did, it would be the first and last time they did!’

Yes, my sentiments exactly.

This is just basic manners. The most basic of basics. No man I know (in his 40s) would behave like this. Maybe an inexperienced 20-something who is all over the place yes, but even that would be bad enough.

If he’d been clear before the date that he had to be somewhere else at midnight (but this was the only night the OP was free), then absolutely fair enough. But otherwise, no. It is extremely rude. The only reason I could think of for someone doing that is if they wanted an excuse to get away. Which is his prerogative, but god only knows why people are putting this onto the OP and encouraging her to text him!

Date 2 - went on to the early hours and lots of snogging.

Date 3 - no snogging and an unexpectedly premature end

I mean, read the room people!

Who in their right mind would think, “Oh yes. Lovely! I’ll text him now and ask him in another date...”

How thick-skinned / oblivious must you be to want to do that?

I'd feel bruised if I'd been excited for a date, spent time getting ready for the evening and then found out I was just a part of the evening's plan and was left with a quick goodbye and a peck. I would def feel he wasn't that in to me and move on.

Exactly this.

Exactly.

Could have been going to a party to watch the boxing match late at night last night?

Well no, if the evening wound up at 11pm and they headed home, that's one thing. The issue here is that he'd got other social plans that he'd not mentioned until the last minute and just flitted off, which would kind of diminish the date for me and leave me feeling not like someone he might have a potential romantic interest in, but more like just one in a string of social engagements that night. Again, not saying it's wrong to have plans, but it was flighty to just breezily mention them and leave the way he did. A Saturday night date with drinks and music is something you expect to come to a natural close not suddenly be told theres a cutoff (unless there's a babysitter in which case it would also be usual to mention it before).

" A Saturday night date with drinks and music is something you expect to come to a natural close not suddenly be told theres a cutoff (unless there's a babysitter in which case it would also be usual to mention it before)."

But isn't there always a cutoff rather than a 'natural close'. The pub closes, the last bus goes, etc.?

"If I arranged to meet a friend for dinner and music, I wouldn’t dream of not saying I had to leave by X time BEFORE meeting her. Doing otherwise is beyond bad manners. It is rude."

It's not rude if the leaving time is 11pm FFS! The end of the evening anyway!
Yes, if you meet someone at 7 and have to leave at 8 you should let them know. But 11??

But isn't there always a cutoff rather than a 'natural close'. The pub closes, the last bus goes, etc.?

The pub closing and the last bus going is a natural close and presumably someone would tell the other person that they intended to get the last bus home because there was no other way home etc.
Dashing off because you'd arranged to meet other people is a cut off.

It's not rude if the leaving time is 11pm FFS! The end of the evening anyway!

Date 2 - went on to the early hours and lots of snogging.

Why would the OP assume that on Date 3 she'd find herself alone at 11pm?

"‘I’m mid forties but reading these posts make me feel really old. Or else maybe I’m lucky that people in my circle just wouldn’t do this and if they did, it would be the first and last time they did!’"

I'm mid-forties as have a totally different view point because for my friends and me, 11pm is more or less the end of the night anyway. I don't go clubbing and take public transport so can't stay out later than around midnight anyway.
All these people going on about the date being cut short and OP not being given the chance to make plans herself (starting at midnight!) are really weird for me. You must all be wild party animals.

I thought the date they'd planned had ended and it was then the OP who suggested they go on to do something else? That's when he said "sorry I can't. I have to go to a friend's leaving do." I really don't get the issue. They did what they planned. What happens before or after that isn't relevant. He didn't ditch her or bail on her or rush their date or cut it short.

@SleepingBunnies21

There's no rule about having to tell your date what you're doing after the date

It is however basic good manners to tell your date what time you are ending it, if that differs from reasonable expectations. Which this date did.

How did it differ from reasonable expectations?

@BadNomad

I thought the date they'd planned had ended and it was then the OP who suggested they go on to do something else? That's when he said "sorry I can't. I have to go to a friend's leaving do." I really don't get the issue. They did what they planned. What happens before or after that isn't relevant. He didn't ditch her or bail on her or rush their date or cut it short.

This!

"and presumably someone would tell the other person that they intended to get the last bus home because there was no other way home etc."

Yes, but you say it at the time. It's not something you have to give advance warning for and I don't see why you have to say it's the only way home either. You just say 'my bus is going now'.

@Dancingonmoonlight

It's not rude if the leaving time is 11pm FFS! The end of the evening anyway!

Date 2 - went on to the early hours and lots of snogging.

Why would the OP assume that on Date 3 she'd find herself alone at 11pm?

because it's quite common for an evening to end at 11pm. Just because it was 2am once doesn't have to mean it's 2am every time.

I thought they were already at the music venue and OP suggested seeing the next act, when he mentioned he had another thing to go to.

So she didn't suggest doing something different, just staying where they were

@BadNomad

I thought the date they'd planned had ended and it was then the OP who suggested they go on to do something else? That's when he said "sorry I can't. I have to go to a friend's leaving do." I really don't get the issue. They did what they planned. What happens before or after that isn't relevant. He didn't ditch her or bail on her or rush their date or cut it short.

It did.

That doesn’t suit the folks determined that he someone committed a heinous faux pas of not assuming that the OP would want to do more than they had planned (and you can imagine the comments had the thread been about him being huffy if the OP had gone home at the end of their planned evening…)

@Dancingonmoonlight

It's not rude if the leaving time is 11pm FFS! The end of the evening anyway!

Date 2 - went on to the early hours and lots of snogging.

Why would the OP assume that on Date 3 she'd find herself alone at 11pm?

Because she wouldn't assume that she was entitled to his company.

Do you think she should assume that she was entitled to his company?

What if OP was the one who had to leave at 11pm? Would you say that was wrong of her, and that he was right to assume he'd have her company late into the night?

I wonder if this guy realises the sheer drama he’s caused on MN!

Well according to some folks on here you go on a date ladies at seven and want to end it at 11 and not snog the guy again or shag him that night thn you’re well out of line.

You OWE him

Oh wait is it just blokes that owe women.

It's not a heinous faux pas. A 40 something man just saying 'I'm off clubbing with my mates, bye!' would not be terrible or anything like that, it would just be unusual at that time to have not mentioned it, and not leave me feeling great about seeing him again. Kind of though he didn't see the date as a big deal.

He is free to leave a date whenever he wants, go clubbing as often as he likes, but flitting off to go clubbing at midnight is the kind of thing I might have done at 20. And yes, if the previous date lingered into the early hours and ended up getting quite passionate then it would feel like a there had been a change. You don't have to be an entitled sex pest to think that.

What if OP was the one who had to leave at 11pm? Would you say that was wrong of her, and that he was right to assume he'd have her company late into the night?

If she had set a precedent of staying out later than 11am then it would be perfectly reasonable to expect the subsequent weekend date to be the same.
If she didn't tell him that she had plans to meet someone else at a certain time prior to meeting up, it would be rude. I would not expect him to agree to meeting up again.

This is supposed to be a new friend/a potential relationship not a business lunch date! The OP is entitled to common courtesy.
As the date treated her like that, it was because the date had no romantic interest in her and/or lacked basic social skills and manners.

If she had set a precedent of staying out later than 11am then it would be perfectly reasonable to expect the subsequent weekend date to be the same

Why? Does he just need to assume that he's set the precedent now for all future dates, and he'll have to explain himself if he needs to leave before 2am? Or is it just for the next date, until a new precedent is set?

Where are you getting the rules from? If it was just common sense, most people on the thread would agree, but they don't. It's a matter of preference.

If she had set a precedent of staying out later than 11am then it would be perfectly reasonable to expect the subsequent weekend date to be the same.

What precendent? On the first date SHE made plans for after. Second date they snogged. Third date he had plans for after. The OP is just annoyed because she wanted him to want to jump her bones which she now says she would have rejected anyway. TWO dates is nothing. That's not a relationship. No one owes anyone anything after two dates.

"Why? Does he just need to assume that he's set the precedent now for all future dates, and he'll have to explain himself if he needs to leave before 2am? Or is it just for the next date, until a new precedent is set?"

Yes, it's bollocks.