To say there are some decent men

[Poppyscone]

I know there are many threads about how shit men are. It may be a shit partner not helping, abused by a stranger, sexism etc etc etc.

But to say some men are decent. My DH said this morning re the policemen just sentenced “we men are mostly basically shit aren’t we”
I told him he was one of the good ones and the good ones need to carry on trying to challenging these men who basically hate women
My DH had challenged many men over their behaviour towards women including dropping friendships.

I have epilepsy and DH had always had my back and supported me. Done more then his fare share with kids including most night feeds as well as working full time which I can do. Letting me sleep and recover after a seizure and taking charge without complaining.

He always make me feel good about myself, never pesters for sex and is a good dad.

Yep sure he had his faults he is a bit disorganised and he seems to think dirty clothes belong on the bedroom floor (but does pick them up when asked)
He snores like a machine gun and I have to wear earplug but on the whole he is a decent bloke and I am sure there are many more out there. I would just like to here about them

Frankly the use of woke as a putdown in a post,invalidates the post @TheReluctantPhoenix

This feels really faux naive and goady.

"Am I totally beyond the pale for saying not all men are evil the way everyone else is?" blinks innocently

No, NAMALT. But the ones who ALT cause a major systemic problem that threatens the lives of women.

An article that the journalist writes a surprising link between poverty and violence

Well I’m stunned

Next you shall be telling me there is higher rates of mental health issues and poor physical health

What drives male violence towards women and girls is misogyny

@EspressoDoubleShot,

Well I think ‘Espresso’ in a user name shows precisely the demographic you wish to be associated with….

most are

@OhWhyNot

An article that the journalist writes a surprising link between poverty and violence

Well I’m stunned

Next you shall be telling me there is higher rates of mental health issues and poor physical health

What drives male violence towards women and girls is misogyny

And there are as many poor females as there are poor males.

Yet violent crime (in the case of murder, 93%) is still overwhelmingly committed by men.

Addressing other factors aside from sex doesn't change the fact that it is predominantly men who commit violent crime.

@OhWhyNot,

And what is the cause of the misogyny?

And please don’t bash out that tired old trope ‘the patriarchy’, because I don’t see much evidence of misogyny in my well educated, kind, considerate male friends and family.

Woke it’s a tired trope used to close down and diminish a valid opinion. Demonising legitimate opinions as try too hard, lefty liberal etc
Woke is a put down much loved by Piers Morgan.Daily Mail and the hard of thinking

[quote TheReluctantPhoenix]@OhWhyNot,

And what is the cause of the misogyny?

And please don’t bash out that tired old trope ‘the patriarchy’, because I don’t see much evidence of misogyny in my well educated, kind, considerate male friends and family.[/quote]
What do YOU think is the cause of the misogyny? Honest question.

Why do you think that when all things are equal in circumstance other than sex - so poor men and poor women, rich men and rich women, any particular race of man and the same race of woman - what are your thoughts on why when all else is equal, violent crime against women is still overwhelmingly committed by males?

@TheReluctantPhoenix I commented on your post,not your user name
Specifically the use of woke as a put down

Really

So no abuse and violence is happening in the homes of wealthy, intelligent and educated families ?

It is

@EspressoDoubleShot,

Virtually this whole thread is an attempt to close down discussion.

‘Oh, the MRAs are here’, ‘read the room’, ‘ I am not going to give that headspace’ etc etc

‘Woke’ is a useful code for a set of opinions held by a certain set of people. Some of the opinions may well be valid, but others not so much. The thing ‘woke’ culture does have, though, is virtue signalling and a feeling that any other views are not even worthy of discussion.

It is word much used these days. I do take your point but think it has its uses.

Woke is a lazy tired trope,use it as you wish. Expect to be challenged on its use

@youvegottenminuteslynn,

I posted a long post about it above.

Testosterone plus a bad upbringing is a major cause of violent crime perpetrated by young males.

I also think that feeling excluded from opportunities and main stream society leads to men looking for ‘others’ to blame and hating women is one way this goes. That is amplified by the echo chamber of the internet.

Look at this thread among, primarily, well educated women. It does not take long for the misandry to come out. In another chamber, occupied by ill educated young men, you get horrible misogyny.

(I also think all violent porn should be banned, as I think it’s harm cannot be overestimated).

Testosterone plus a bad upbringing is a major cause of violent crime perpetrated by young males.* I also think that feeling excluded from opportunities and main stream society leads to men looking for ‘others’ to blame and hating women is one way this goes.*

Wait do you mean to say you believe that when all else is equal (race / finances / family set up etc), males are more excluded from 'main stream society' or 'opportunities' than females?

@youvegottenminuteslynn

Testosterone plus a bad upbringing is a major cause of violent crime perpetrated by young males.* I also think that feeling excluded from opportunities and main stream society leads to men looking for ‘others’ to blame and hating women is one way this goes.*

Wait do you mean to say you believe that when all else is equal (race / finances / family set up etc), males are more excluded from 'main stream society' or 'opportunities' than females?

To be clear as I don't want anyone to think PP's words are mine!! It was a bold fail and should have read:

Start quote: Testosterone plus a bad upbringing is a major cause of violent crime perpetrated by young males

I also think that feeling excluded from opportunities and main stream society leads to men looking for ‘others’ to blame and hating women is one way this goes. End quote

Wait do you mean to say you believe that when all else is equal (race / finances / family set up etc), males are more excluded from 'main stream society' or 'opportunities' than females?

Testosterone plus a bad upbringing is a major cause of violent crime perpetrated by young males. ⬅️ No

There was a flurry of interest in 00s regarded the hypothesis that testerone caused violence. Upon subsequent metareview it’s an incorrect hypothesis

I hope my brown immigrant son doesn't grow up with the idea that he has been excluded from opportunities because of his gender, but if he exhibits any of that thinking, I will be sure to use my misandry to kick it out of him sharpish.

Not to burst your little bubble OP, but wasn’t Wayne Couzens a loving family man too?

Yes Wayne Couzens had the ✅ box veneer of respectability
House
FB
Photos of him wife,kids online

Also he had
Dating profile online
Nickname the rapist
Flashed his genitalia at fast food outlet drive thru

Rape and murder is the worst possible outcome of male violence and misogyny. Focusing on just these issues ignores the vast amount of 'low level' harassment women receive at the hands of men. Focussing on rape and murder ignores cat calling, intimidation, stalking, unwanted attention and work place discrimination that goes on frequently under the radar.

Most of us will have experienced cat calling, or a persistent stranger on the train telling us we'd be prettier if we smiled. But how do we report this? It's not a crime and so we just have to accept it, quite often we can't argue back as we'd put ourselves in danger of being harmed. We're conditioned to live in fear and brush it off as "boys will be boys" or the fact that men just have more testosterone. Men are conditioned to believe they are entitled to women. I just want to be able to travel to and from work in peace, not have to clutch my keys in my pocket or cross the street to get home safe.

We've set the bar so fucking low for 'decent men' that apparently all it takes these days is not to rape and murder. Sorry I'm not having it. Putting your boxers in the washing bin doesn't make you a decent man FFS, they're your fucking pants you shouldn't need a pat on the back to clear up your own shite. The fact that men still refer to looking after their own kids as "baby sitting" speaks volumes about the level of unrecognised misogyny they have.

Wether the violence is against men or women, men as a group need to sort their shit out. Stop enabling misogynistic pals and rapey comments disguised as bants.

I feel strongly about MVAWG because I am a woman. I'm more likely to experience MVAWG than I am to experience male violence against males because I'm not a male FFS. If men were campaigning against knife crime I'd be happy to lend my voice, much like I'm happy to lend my voice to the BLM movement. Men don't want to campaign for themselves though, they just want to derail women pointing out they're victims of male crime and they've got a whole host of useful idiots suffering from extreme internalised misogyny to go along with them. I fucking despair sometimes!

I've also noticed the same people that spout NAMALT are usually the same ones declaring all lives matter. Neither statement is untrue but that doesn't help solve the problem.

You wouldn't tell someone who's wife was dying "everyone dies though" as it's tone deaf. Saying NAMALT is similarly tone deaf.

Men don't want to campaign for themselves though, they just want to derail women pointing out they're victims of male crime and they've got a whole host of useful idiots suffering from extreme internalised misogyny to go along with them. I fucking despair sometimes!

The above is absolutely true.

What drives male violence towards women and girls is misogyny

Exactly...and the 'poor' and 'uneducated' don't have the monopoly on that!! Just read the numerous articles and reports about sexism, sexual violence and sexual harassment on university campuses.

@ColorMagicBarbie

Mainly male victims and male perpetrators. What I'm saying is why does the conversation have to be 99% about women? It's like shoehorning white people into black gang violence.

This can't be a serious comment surely?