DH is shocked by the reality of having a newborn

[WheelieBinPrincess]

I’m not being very sympathetic.

We are both shattered, like all new parents I guess.

When we first got the baby home a couple of weeks ago, he was quite chilled (the baby was, and to an extent DH was too) he thought things were easy! Unfortunately DS hasn’t slept well at night, he’s a bit nocturnal- he’ll do 90 min stretches just 3x throughout the night so you can’t get a proper sleep. During the day he was fabulous at napping initially but he’s not great at the moment, he gets bad wind after a feed, gets uncomfortable and needs about an hour of comforting/winding.

‘I didn’t think it would be like this’ said DH yesterday

I think I cope better on the back of a night of no sleep so I’ve been doing the night shift, in the spare room with the baby, and trying to grab a few hours nap in the day, DH still has another week off work, but last night I’d had enough, I was dead on my feet, so I expressed some milk and handed over to DH.

I’ve just been into the bedroom to find DS sleeping peacefully, and DH practically rocking in a corner, ashen faced, like he has experienced a terrible and traumatic event.

I asked how he got on. ‘Not good’, he replied in shaky voice. I’ve got the baby now and he’s gone back to bed, in a strop, because I reminded him that it sounded like an entirely normal night to me.

AIBU (and possibly a bit of a martyr ?!)
But I wonder if DH pictured having a tiny baby as like having an agreeable little cat curled up in a corner, waking up for the odd feed and cuddle, letting us watch a box set of an evening and share a bottle of chianti.

Yep, we have all been there. It IS a shock. The 24/7ness, the reposponsibility, the sleeplessness, everything! Just acknowledge it, remind him that you are currently both in survival mode and tjat you WILL both get into the swing of things.

Have a conversation about what actually needs to be done/what standards can be lowered but for the love of god, don't let him make you feel any of this is easier or more natural for you or let him slack off. You will regret it.

Definitely work as a team and don't just do things because (He says) you're better at it
.
I wouldn't get caught up with time scales for example, you mentioned to him the lack of sleep being a phase, a couple of posters in someone said they remembered things got better at 6 weeks etc. That may be the case for you and many other babies, but, honestly,it isn't the case for all.

@WheelieBinPrincess

Personally I’d ignore anyone who tells you your marriage is clearly doomed. I think a new baby is a massive strain on even the healthiest marriage. My DH and I had a pretty solid marriage pre-baby but I basically hated him for about 6 months after our son was born. But our marriage is much stronger now we’re out the other side of that patch.

All of my group of NCT friends experienced similar.

All the stuff about contemptuousness and whatnot aside.

The way I see it:

• You've both had a bomb go off on your lives and are sitting scrambling around the mess wondering how TF you created this
• You both need to "enjoy the baby" (LMAO) (maybe she means lick the baby's arm or something? with salt and a wedge of lime?)
• You're both going to have moments where you're stroppy, snarky, resentful, martyr-ish, and less than ideal partners/parents
• He won't ever be able to put himself in your shoes fully, because he's not you. He won't ever give birth, either.
• You won't be able to put yourself in his shoes fully, because you're not him. You won't ever know what it's like to be on the male/father end of things.

I just say be kind to each other.

DO validate him and hear him. Humans need care. He's not a child for wanting to be understood and to feel loved.

Do communicate when YOU are struggling. "Baby, I fucking love you, but I'm struggling to hear you talking about being so tired when you have slept twice as long as I have and I'm also recovering from an invasive operation. So if I don't seem sympathetic, please know that I do REALLY appreciate you."

You'll figure it out.
Lean to each other's strengths - like, let him do the things he's good at, and you do the things he's good at.
But of course, both of you need to be doing the feeds and settling and interaction and whatnot.
Just figure out a system that works for both of you, without shutting him out and taking over.
Also recognise that you're a lot more experienced than he is, because of your job. Meaning, he might actually be finding the adjustment more overwhelming in a different way to you!

Lastly, I'd just say don't fall into the trap of wanting to take over everything because you think of him as useless/childish/pathetic in any way...
He'll just withdraw, which will cause you to take over more, and it's a vicious cycle.
If you need him to step up, ask him.
Just tell him what you need/feel and listen to what he needs/feels.

Sorry I hadn't finished. My 2yo obviously no longer sleeps like a newborn, but equally has never slept through either. I'm late twenties and have never slept through. Many people can't. Of course it would be very unusual to continue waking up like newborns do though! Just don't put too much pressure on yourself!

Have a chat with your husband. Going back to work doesn't mean he can't help either. Some dads think working outside of the home only counts as work. If yours claims you haven't been working when you look after the baby then that's perfect as you can hand him the baby on his days off and he can relax with the baby whilst you sleep/do whatever you like.

Personally I’d ignore anyone who tells you your marriage is clearly doomed. I think a new baby is a massive strain on even the healthiest marriage.

This. Anyone should be warned everything is going to be so different for at least a year that you shouldn't make any rash decisions (unless there's abuse or something, obviously) because you are basically in an emotional and psychological fog for a year.

*I admit I find it hard to be sympathetic and NOT contemptuous towards someone that is aware that

I had a c-section
I was feeling ill from an infection and on antibiotics until yesterday
I’ve done 13/14 night wakings
I’ve survived on a two hour nap a day
I’m pumping milk multiple times a day like a dairy cow*

Equally, I had most of that (c section, baby waking up that much, bf and pumping) and had that level of waking for about 15m, whilst simultaneously looking after a toddler that also woke at night, and working.

And I have sympathy for you even though you likely don't have it as 'bad' as that and are only a couple of weeks in. I mostly did enjoy it, though found the long term tiredness hard

My reality is something I've become used to (and thankfully its better these days), and belittling someone else's struggle is crappy, even if it doesn't seem as bad in comparison.

You may well be dealing with the disruption better than him. You may be coping with bad sleep better than him, and your job probably helps. But supporting eachother, rather then belittling each others feelings is the kinder way to approach things (though not letting him off his share!)

having a tiny baby as like having an agreeable little cat curled up in a corner, waking up for the odd feed and cuddle,

That’s what my first was like. He slept six hours at a stretch at night after six weeks. Oh how smug I was. What a shock the next one was.

I had a c-section
*I was feeling ill from an infection and on antibiotics until yesterday
I’ve done 13/14 night wakings
I’ve survived on a two hour nap a day
I’m pumping milk multiple times a day like a dairy cow

And still says that I ‘don’t understand’ how exhausted he felt this morning.

Ah yes, the 'poor me' argument. What about the menz and all that. I hope for your sake OP you never get proper flu and he gets a cold four weeks later.

It's time to let rip with all of the above, don't just take it that he 'knows'. Out of interest, if he's on parental leave what does he do all day? Why can't he take your baby while you sleep? Or is the daytime your job too?

Sorry OP, but I did chuckle to myself when I read that he’d ordered himself a new computer game to fill up his spare one with his newborn. The blissful naivety of that says it all!

[quote WheelieBinPrincess]@ChickPeaSalad I can only think you are possibly projecting. I’m sorry about your marriage [/quote]
My marriage is wonderful thanks, hence why I can't imagine responding to my new-to-fatherhood DH with the kind of attitude you have towards yours. I can't imagine how I'd feel if DH came to find me after a night shift, I was clearly exhausted and expressed that having a baby wasn't how I thought it'd be, and he responded with such disdain and likened any kind of empathy or sympathy to placating a toddler over an ice cream.

It's not a competition. Tiredness affects everyone differently. It's okay if he feels exhausted, it isn't a slight on you. Try to avoid getting into the 'well I have it worse' pissing matches if the other person shows they're tired or expresses that they're finding it hard. It helps neither of you and chips away at the team you're supposed to be.

@SpicyTomatos

He could easily be suffering from post natal depression. It's an idea that doesn't exist on mumsnet, but a lot of new dads do get it.

You could ask if he thinks talking to someone about it would help or even just try to talk to him about it without trying to make it a competition about who is suffering more which invariably happens when everyone is exhausted.

I think it'd be wise if OP suggested to him he try talk to his friends or relatives when he's struggling, about the adjustment of new parenthood or how hard he's finding it. OP isn't in the place to be able to hear that without anger and resentment so it'll only damage the relationship. But both of them deserve support.

He does take the baby during the day while I get my head down- (not today as he’s done his night shift) but it’s only temporary like two hours- I get sore and need to pump, i want to eat, shower etc, the health visitor came, I feel like we need to get out in the fresh air, there’s laundry, etc etc. Whereas the night is for sleep (DH, not me) IYSWIM.

To be fair I’m chilling on the sofa currently watching a documentary about Jeremy Bamber, as the baby is pretty reliable at sleeping at this time.

@WhatAShilohPitt

Sorry OP, but I did chuckle to myself when I read that he’d ordered himself a new computer game to fill up his spare one with his newborn. The blissful naivety of that says it all!

I chuckled at a PP saying she'd ordered a sewing machine... with twins on the way!

It's true that in a culture where we don't really get involved in raising other people's babies that you haven't a clue what it's going to be like until it happens. Even if you expect relentlessly broken insufficient sleep it's impossible to understand what that physically feels like until you experience it. I certainly didn't expect at three months PP I'd still be hallucinating body bags in the corner of the bedroom and monsters climbing out of the bin from sheer utter bone crushing exhaustion.

I don't think many mums or dads bring a newborn home and don't experience some element of surprise or shock at how gruelling it is... unless I suppose they have super chilled babies who sleep well.

DH once agreed to have dtws once until 3am while I slept.
He woke me up early because he couldn't cope.
I can still feel the rage 13 years later.

It became apparent DH actually couldn't function on low sleep levels that I could. The only positive was realizing my own strength.
Prior to that DH had always talked about how little sleep he needed and how he could burn the candle at both ends.

I hope it gets easier for you OP.

OP you’ve tickled me with your insane health visitor. Not the point of the thread I know but here we are. ‘Enjoy them’ lolololol. You can appreciate them as the beautiful, unique, temporary little bundles they are but has this lady ever actually looked after one after having one evacuated from her body? Enjoyable isn’t the word I’d use especially in the early days. It’s many positive and negative things but enjoyable wasn’t the first word I’d use.

Time, not one!

@WheelieBinPrincess

Yeah, we need to look at tag-teeming the nights I think, I’ll get used to going to bed really early then swap. I think I’m conscious of DH needing more rest when he’s back at work but he works with computers and not in air traffic control, and they have a really decent coffee machine, so maybe I’m overthinking that.

Yep. You’re in charge of a vulnerable human in the day, so you need sleep just as much as he does.

@WheelieBinPrincess

I admit I find it hard to be sympathetic and NOT contemptuous towards someone that is aware that

I had a c-section
I was feeling ill from an infection and on antibiotics until yesterday
I’ve done 13/14 night wakings
I’ve survived on a two hour nap a day
I’m pumping milk multiple times a day like a dairy cow

And still says that I ‘don’t understand’ how exhausted he felt this morning. Now, DH is usually a very lovely, reasonable and intelligent bloke, so I’ll give him a chance to catch himself on, but it was supremely difficult not to absolutely lose my shit when he woke up (after a four hour and a half hour nap) and said that.

Even before I read this post, I was thinking - you are "coping" while recovering from having your body changed by the process of growing a whole new human being inside you. which is not the case with your DP.

You've had major abdominal surgery, and everything you do has to be considered in the light of that. If your DP had had someone cut through all the layers of his abdomen, he would expect a bit of R&R, and to have someone look after him for a bit. This is not happening for you (or indeed any other woman I know who has had a c-section, including me).

@Daisyandroses just make sure yo u either get good baby each time or you alternate babies. How old are your twins? I mean mine still don't always sleep through at nearly 2 but 6+ weeks is just a painful teary blur

@ChickPeaSalad my marriage is great and I'd be beyond contemptuous of anyone claiming after one night of baby duty that I, recovering from the major abdominal surgery I had a few weeks ago, pumping milk at all hours of the day and night and having done l the previous nights, didn't UNDERSTAND how hard their night had been. It's so self absorbed to assume that you must have had the hardest night ever in two three weeks and your partner had just had an easy baby up until then.

*To the posters that mention validating DH’s feelings of shock and tiredness- I’m not sure. In my job I might do this with an upset toddler, as in ‘oh I get you’re so disappointed the ice cream van was all out of Mr Whippy!! I am too. Shall we get some ice cream from the shop instead?’

I’m not sure I can bring myself to use the same tactics on a 36 year old adult man.*

God, that's just so nasty! You said your husband is generally a good egg, so why can't you bring yourself just to be kind to him whilst he's struggling with the adjustment? Yes, you've had a shit time too, but you can communicate that and also make him feel heard at the same time.

Ok, so shocker, your DH underestimated how difficult he would find having a new born baby, I don't think you need to be so hard on him though.

You are ultimately a team and need to work out your strengths and weaknesses. You don't need him up through the night, just because he "should" if that then makes the day harder for both of you. If he's more use to you and the baby in the day for you to have time to sleep, rest, wash, bathe or for him do the practical things you talk of, do that.

My DH never got up through the night, I BF so there was zero point of us both being disturbed through the night, just pointless.
I could relax through the day if I wanted when baby slept, my DH took baby as soon as he got back in from work for an hour or so, so I could do whatever I needed.

It's about getting a system that works for you, him and the baby. You are a team. It does get easier if you work at it together.

@WheelieBinPrincess

To be fair to him, NCT was mostly complete bollocks, the practical element involved pretending to bathe a doll. Mainly it was a lot of shite about how ‘any woman can breastfeed if they want to enough’ and how drugs during birth would practically turn your newborn into a crack addict.

That made me laugh out loud on the train. You're not wrong!

DH made wonderful plans for my hospital discharge (post emcs) with our first. He'd had three nights of uninterrupted sleep at home while I'd experienced the joys of an emcs after 2.5 days of labour, catheter, and a busy post labour ward with fuck all in the way of sleep. He spent the morning as we awaited discharge planning our "day out" for a long walk, lunch in the west end and a spot of shopping. I remember thinking - let's see in the morning shall we..... and smiling and nodding. I couldn't read text messages by then my eyesight was so fucked from lack of sleep.

Funnily enough he didn't mention it at all the next day....

I'm 56 and I'm have had 3 kids. I didn't want any involvement from lilylivered husbands when it came to nightfeeds. Neither of them knew nightfeeds were even taking place! They were asleep beside me!