To feel I have utterly let down my children by sending then to a state school?

[hibbledibble]

I went to a private school, and achieved very well academically.

My children go to a state school, as I can't afford private school. I will never be able to afford it sadly. They go to the local community school, which has a reputation for not being academic.

My eldest is extremely bright, and tested many years ahead of her age on entering the local primary. Now, she has failed to even get to the second round of the 11+. She has really just coasted at school, as they have not set any appropriate work for her, despite multiple requests. They say they can't offer 'gifted and talented' provision, due to funding.

Her sibling is very behind on learning, as she missed loads of school due to lockdowns, and the school offered very little remote provision throughout most of the time. I have asked for support for her, but am told that nothing is available, again, due to funding. Meanwhile, she is struggling with even the basics.

I do think that both of my children would have done better, had they gone to a school where their individual abilities and learning stage was catered for, and they were helped to achieve their potential. I feel I have let them down by not providing them with a good education, which they could have had if I had the money.

Now it's looking likely my eldest will have to go to the terrible, and rough, local secondary, and the underachieving will continue.

I think the most important thing you can instill in your children is the good work ethic regarding schoolwork and a thirst for knowledge. Encourage them with reading, trips to museums, theatre and other places that will help them with their learning and other interests and they will excel at life. Sometimes sending children to private school only instills in them a sense of entitlement that they deserve better because they paid more for it. It's far better to instill a sense of pride in working hard for what they want, they'll get further in life.

If you don't have the money it's what you have to do, there's no way round it.
One of my boys had a disastrous time at the local comprehensive, got awful GCSE's but did a Btec and re-took the essential GCSE subjects. Once he'd decided what he wanted to do he picked himself up, got more qualifications and ended up with a good degree.

It is really hard with boys, they have to attain enough maturity to take education seriously - but there are always opportunities to catch up later.

Whatever the local schools are like, if your daughter is bright and is prepared to work hard she should be fine. If there is an all girl school she may do better there.
Not everybody from a grotty comprehensive fails, you need to do a lot at home to help: doing homework properly, making sure that they're reading a lot, understanding maths and science. Private school parents are paying others to do this, in many cases.
It's also VERY important that she doesn't see herself as a failure.

@Jangle33 Yes. Sorry. From the original post I’d assumed financial hardship not a doctors salary!

I’m just outside London. I have three friends with extremely bright kids who did zero tutoring and passed the 11+ with excellent scores. If the child is a candidate for a gifted and talented programme, I’d be surprised at a child not getting close to the score so they could appeal.

4 of my 5 children went to state schools. 3 left having not taken any GCSEs and 1 managed 3 low grades.
My oldest son who was the highest ever achiever at his primary schools, won a scholarship to a public (private) school which had everything on offer including CCF, swimming pools, rowing clubs blah blah.
He achieved 11 A GCSCs and 5 A level awards then left before 6th form to go into a managerial role with a national retail chain for whom he'd worked at weekends.
Suffice to say his 3 sisters and 1 brother have highly paid careers and own their own homes, 3 are mortgage free and in home county areas.
The privately educated son is in rented accommodation in a very low paid job.
The difference is ambition. He lacks it whereas his siblings are grafters and savers, eager to do well for their families and enjoy the fruits of their labours. None benefited from a parental helping hand financially.

Having children is very expensive and I’m really sorry to say this but it’s a discussion you really ought to have had with yourself before having any children especially if you wanted to get the best education money can buy.

Try to get them extra tuition etc, that’s dear but might be a soother.

Now, she has failed to even get to the second round of the 11+.

Now I know what school she tested for, I don’t think you should be too worried! The school is hugely competitive and loads of very bright children won’t make the second round. The first round is a weeding out based on maths and VR. A child could be exceptional at English and produce outstanding written work but this won’t even be considered if they aren’t through the first round.

YANBU at all. I am in a similar situation and feel the same way. Its nothing to do with snobbery and everything to do with actually getting a decent education, which in the UK sadly, you usually need to pay for, one way or another. Rage, rage.

OP, unlike a PP said you don't need a PGCE to teach in an independent school so it's not always the case you're getting top notch teaching. Far from it. I supervise teachers from that sector when they do stints in state schools and I'm often quite surprised at how weak they are, mainly in terms of subject knowledge and behaviour management.

The issue of your children not being stretched is nothing to do with funding and everything to do with differentiation. Any teacher knows how to reach the top, middle and bottom achievers in their lessons.

If they went to private school you would still need the time to help them after school or pay someone to… my sister spends an hour w each child daily helping with reading and giving them extra work as the private school doesn’t give homework! But all the parents give extra work to advance and spend time w the kids…

I think spending time w kids that are in state school can have good results. But you need to make the time. All kids are tired after school; but you can find a way. I usually do work with them during weekends in between activities. And after they have had dinner and I’ve put the baby to bed. My kids attend state school and I do see the difference between private school and state. But you can work with them and still achieve good results. My friends daughter went to state school and got into a top secondary private school with hard work and tutoring. Most kids to do well start tutoring for 11+ one year before.

If your child has the aptitude, attitude, work ethic and support at home they will do well at most state schools.

Ds is at a very poor performing school with a high intake (>70%) from deprived areas. He has had some outstanding teachers and a few who should hang up their school bag and go home for good. He is above average ability in his cohort, but the problem with that is you get ignored by the teachers as, relatively, you are doing ok. It is his great attitude and work ethic to put in the extra work with self study which got him his 5 x Scottish Highers As.

OP if you believe your dc have the aptitude, nurturing the attitude and work ethic needs to come from home from the very beginning of their education, all the way through - do not underestimate the influence your engagement in their learning will have on them or the amount of effort you need to put into consistently guiding them. It is very easy and much more fun for them to get positive feedback from their peers by playing up at school and not putting in the work outside of it and once they fall behind much harder to catch back up.

The mind boggles. I'd break out the Diazepam if I were you, Doc.

My kids go to private school and most also get an 11plus tutor as well! You are very naive for not getting a tutor. Very rate to pass 11plus with no tutor as most state schools do not prep children for it. I didn’t go private but did go to grammar as i passed the 11plus. I’ve been relatively successful (50k a year). My husband went to awful state schools. He is incredibly successfully.

Urghh so many typos as feeding the baby. Very rare to pass 11 plus with no tutor.

Sent ours to private school, and wish we had gone state.Its left us broke
we had not really considered the social side of being with super rich kids its no picnic !
TBH the most important thing we have found has been reading, its had a huge impact .
Its the one single thing that's made a difference .But that was down to us making books a part of life early on nurturing a love of learning .
In our experience private schools are places where no one is held accountable and much of what goes on would never be allowed in the
state system

Every child would benefit from an excellent education, small classes, great facilities and brilliant teachers as these things increase the chances children will meet their potential. That's why there is such an uneven playing field for bright children in terms of life chances.

Few children are privately educated so your dcs are just joining the masses, except within that they are still very privileged. They have a dm who values education, probably their own spaces to study, you actively following their education and you also showing demonstrating that a professional career is well within reach.

Perhaps you should get more involved in their education - presumably you could help them with homework etc - and maybe even see if you could contribute in some way to the well being of other children at their schools.

State schools are underfunded. They don't have funding for extra support for children who are falling behind and they have just had their remedial budgets cut for children with special needs, so children in genuinely hopeless situations are very likely to leave school a long way from fulfilling their potential.

Your dcs are not in hopeless situations. At they very least they have you. Get involved in their schooling.

The cream will always rise to the top. I'm other words kids will achieve their potential. It will help if you speak to and engage with their schools as well as giving the support you can muster thanks to your own very good education .encourage them without hovering over them. There is no need to feel guilty and I know most teachers don't want to just coast along,but you need to engage with them

In my experience the biggest difference in state vs private (apart from the obvious inequality) is that regardless of how academic a child is they still come out of a private school with far more confidence (and often arrogance) than those from state schools. Unfortunately this makes a huge difference in the world of work.

If you're a doctor OP presumably you can move out of London quite easily?

It really doesn't have to be this hard. Up north there are great state and private schools and houses don't cost the earth

Yes my state school let me down terribly getting me into Oxford ....

You're being a complete SNOB

Leaveitalone: This is really insulting to all those teachers who work really hard to get the best results from your children ( and no-one claps for them). The vast majority of children in this country get a 'decent education'. Academic success has a lot to do with attitude. Children who have been told how 'gifted' they are frequently don't think they need to try very hard. The ones who do really well have parents with a positive attitude and are encouraged to meet challenges and overcome any difficulties that present without being educated in an elitist establishment. Surely our present government indicates the myriad failings of private education?

It occurred to me when I was at school that there are two groups of kids who are let down in state schools. The ones near the top but not at the very top, and the ones at the bottom. The ones near the top could do well if they were pushed, and the ones at the very bottom don’t get nearly enough support. I see the same now, although the ones at the bottom get more support than they used to.

Oh, and add in kids with SEN, they are let down too.

I would say if you couldn’t afford a private school you haven’t let the down as the alternative would be that they would go without food and shelter.

What would have been letting them down would be if you had spent what could have been private school fees on shoes and handbags.

Hmm.

Private doesn't mean better in my books, the proof is in the blonde pudding running the Country. What a complete idiot! Ok yeah De Pfluffy might have money, but thats about it really, morals, class, integrity, hah! My lads have that by the cheapy school bucket-loads!

@hibbledibble

Tilly I didn't sit and do nothing. I had multiple meetings with school, and engaged a tutor. Unfortunately the tutor couldn't continue due to pandemic related issues. I found another tutor, but the provision has been less than ideal again, due to pandemic reasons. Because of my job/covid, I couldn't find anyone willing to tutor my daughter in person (as I was too high risk, and my family as an extension). The whole situation has been less than ideal. I did daily work with her, but it's been difficult when she's tired from a day of school, and also learns very little. Due to boredom at school, she decided to become the class clown. Hindsight is a great thing, but honestly I tried my best given the situation and limitations.

Well you haven't looked hard for a tutor- I and many others have been tutoring on zoom etc throughout. And how is she so tired from school if she's not learning anything. THis screams 'la la la not listening as nobody is agreeing with me'

My kids both went to the local 'rough' schools (deprived area). Son got 8s and 9s in his GCSEs and is doing very well for himself. Daughter admits she could have done a lot better (Bs and Cs) if she'd tried. By saying you've failed your children, you're saying that the majority of us not fortunate/rich enough to privately educate our children have also failed ours