To feel I have utterly let down my children by sending then to a state school?

[hibbledibble]

I went to a private school, and achieved very well academically.

My children go to a state school, as I can't afford private school. I will never be able to afford it sadly. They go to the local community school, which has a reputation for not being academic.

My eldest is extremely bright, and tested many years ahead of her age on entering the local primary. Now, she has failed to even get to the second round of the 11+. She has really just coasted at school, as they have not set any appropriate work for her, despite multiple requests. They say they can't offer 'gifted and talented' provision, due to funding.

Her sibling is very behind on learning, as she missed loads of school due to lockdowns, and the school offered very little remote provision throughout most of the time. I have asked for support for her, but am told that nothing is available, again, due to funding. Meanwhile, she is struggling with even the basics.

I do think that both of my children would have done better, had they gone to a school where their individual abilities and learning stage was catered for, and they were helped to achieve their potential. I feel I have let them down by not providing them with a good education, which they could have had if I had the money.

Now it's looking likely my eldest will have to go to the terrible, and rough, local secondary, and the underachieving will continue.

Can't you move.
Schools are under funded and trying to do the best they can.
It's not the end of the world if your children are ambitious then they will be successful.

I haven't read the full thread but if your DC was at age 12-13 level at the age of 7 how could they not have got through the 11+ 3 years after this?

DD1 failed the 11+. And didn't even come close to passing. She went to a state comp and got 4A* in her A Levels and is at one of the world's best unis studying for a masters in a STEM subject.

Ironically also you are demonstrating here a drawback of private education. You are bitterly disappointed that you can not give your child private school education!. If your daughter goes to a normal state school, it's unlikely she'll face the same pressure as a grown up that you do to provide her children with a private, exclusive education. She might not be a doctor but she might still earn well and also have a less pressured, happier life.

OP, do you have Oxbridge and Russell Groups in mind for your DCs? I think as a society we obsess of the university culture which is quite damaging.

You know your child could be equally successful in a career without 11 plus, without private education or university? The pressures on kids to have to achieve high grades from day one of Y1 is not positive for our society. AT ALL!

Happiness comes first.

My children go to a non selective grammar.
A grammar school is by definition selective?

To answer a few questions:

Yes, a bright child can not pass the 11+. Also, while she was very ahead academically prior, she had made little progress since then. Passing the 11+ relies a lot on practice and exam technique. I struggled to find tutors due to the pandemic.

I don't have a specific university in mind for her. I just want her to be able to achieve to her potential.

I have done a lot of work with her at home, but it's been difficult with the next no learning she has done at school.

I certainly haven't told either of my children they are failing.

Again, moving to a better area isn't an option, and not necessarily a certainty regarding better schools. I live in London, so housing is very expensive. My work is tied to London currently.

Sorry but if she was really age 12/13 standard at age 7 and you've also done a lot of work at home with her but she still didn't pass the 11+ I don't think you can blame the school. Sorry if that's harsh but I think perhaps you need to rethink your expectations here. Also, private school doesn't guarantee 11+ results. My DS got into a super selective and I would say only about 20% of the intake went to private school.

If you have the money what about having private tutor at home.to supliment the education .

Also, DS did one 10 minute test a day to prepare for the 11+. You don't need hours of tutoring or to pay for a private school in order to pass the 11+ if your DC is already bright and ahead of their peers.

*Hibbledibble - I haven't read the whole thread but glanced through and leave without commenting. I was a junior doctor in an acute medical speciality when I had my 2 DD's. This is before the new junior doctor contract. We worked more hours that the current junior doctors do but i admit that the current junior doctor rota and the shift system is worse than ours. Flexible working time in acute fields were frowned upon then!
My husband was a junior doctor as well. We had no family support.
I honestly can't remember how my eldest grew up. I did not realise that book bands existed and only found out about them when one of the mums mentioned that my daughter was getting the top band books ( no idea how she knew it 🤷‍♀️). Most of her primary schooling is like a haze to me. All our main concerns were focused on making sure that we have proper childcare sorted for on calls. There were periods ( research ) when I had to my entire salary to childcare and budget tightly to run a family.
You can't change deanery easily for posters suggesting to change job/ house etc.,
Why should a doctor delay having child till 30. They should have children when they want to. Period.
I would say take a deep breath, look at your priorities and see what is within your reach to change and make things better. Having young children, working shifts, running a house , doing exams , making sure that your assessments and portfolio is up to date can be overwhelming at times. You are definitely not a failure if you are working as a junior doctor , have children, and involved in what they are doing.

If you find that doing flexible working will give enough time to address the issues - do it.
Most consultants in acute specialities would be in their mid thirties when they finish. The average age would be nearer late 30s if it is a hands on field like surgery. I am not a fan of this shift system ( had to do them towards the tail end of my training) and there is no way I would have continued in my speciality doing shifts and having to sort out childcare. I believe it is one of main reason driving young female doctors who want to have family away from acute fields and it is a shame!*

Thank you professor Layton this post really resonated. It's so hard just managing work and childcare, and doing what's needed to pass ARCP each year. Childcare around shifts has been such a nightmare, I have wasted too much time on this, in big part because I can't afford a nanny, so have had to rely on a Hodge podge of other arrangements.

What is this next to no learning nonsense you keep on about? Teachers are professionals who are in a relatively low paid job because they want to help children. You're not in the room next to her, so can't see what is being taught. You honestly need to grow up and realise it's not the school's fault.

All the posts talking about work at home and tutors are really missing the point that children should be learning at school.

But they ARE learning at school. My DC are every day and did so throughout the pandemic. Like I've said, 2 high flyers in state comprehensive and one doing well on state primary. There are 100s on this thread telling you the same.

In

Passing the 11+ relies a lot on practice and exam technique. I struggled to find tutors due to the pandemic.
So this is the issue not the state school. You didn’t prepare her for the particular 11+ in your area. There is so much online and books that you can obtain that you could have done with her without the need for a face to face tutor.

I have done a lot of work with her at home, but it's been difficult with the next no learning she has done at school.
Next to no learning?! This does read as someone looking for someone/something to blame for their child not passing the 11+. I hope I am wrong.

@hibbledibble

All the posts talking about work at home and tutors are really missing the point that children should be learning at school.

I do agree with this, OP, and I never bothered with any tutoring for my dd. I wasn't interested in hothousing her. She clearly didn't miss out as a result.

It's slightly different if you want your dc to do the 11+ because state schools aren't set up to prepare kids for that. It's a stupid system which massively favours the children whose parents have the time and the resource to help prepare them, but in my view, the answer isn't for state schools to start cramming with them. I would far rather just get rid of the grammar schools and have all the kids go to comprehensive schools instead.

The bit I still don't understand is how you say you've done lots of work with your dc at home and yet your very bright child has made no progress. How has she not progressed as a result of the work that you've done with her? Is she resistant to your attempts to help or what?

hibbledibble
What SATS and progress scores does the school have (pre-covid that is)? That might give you a better indication of whether they are learning or not.

@hibbledibble

All the posts talking about work at home and tutors are really missing the point that children should be learning at school.

Children are learning at school. Following the National Curriculum. Not preparing children for a specific 11+ that is nothing to do with them. (The 11+ is done differently in many places so not a one size fits all)

All the posts talking about work at home and tutors are really missing the point that children should be learning at school.

It’s really not the other posters that are missing the point OP. You’ve already told us that the school isn’t up to scratch and you’ve also said you won’t move them. So what are you looking for from this thread?

If all state schools were fabulous there’d be no need for private schools and tutoring and work at home and all the many things educated middle class people do yo give their kids a leg up.

Within London, there are great non selective schools, you could move and still be in London.

Yes, they should be learning in school but you need to sort out your DC, rather than complaining about the reason they aren’t doing well.

@hibbledibble I completely understand where you're coming from. I went to a private school, did well educationally and wanted my children to go private.

However I'm a teacher and my now separated DH earns even less than I do so there's no hope in hell of affording a private education for one child, let alone two.

The state system isn't very good at all and I can see that both of my children are being taught the bare minimum to get to an ok SATs level. I've had to do so much extra tutoring at home plus pay for a tutor (as my DS won't always listen to me so a tutor works well for his very weak areas).

From experience of having worked in the private sector I can say that most private school operate educationally about a year ahead of the National Curriculum; can personalise and individualise the education more due to smaller classes and generally children make much more progress.

It sucks that it's just such an unaffordable luxury for me as I'd love to give my children the same opportunities.

I know that education should be classless but the reality is that it's not within the system we have.

My experience of my child, is that she has learnt little at school. The school's stance seems to have been that she is bright and will pass baseline testing, so why bother. It's great if other schools will cater for bright children, but mine doesn't, and many other posters have experienced similar.

In hindsight, I didn't focus the work for the 11+ enough, and struggled to get tutors. She also resisted working a lot. She was so used to coasting at school that she was not used to any remotely challenging work, so hadn't learnt resilience as a result.

Finally, for my child who is behind academically, surely I'm not unreasonable in expecting the school to offer support to catch up?

A lot of focus on the bright child and the 11+, but I'm not asking for much for her sibling to be supported to meet baseline standards.

I’m still confused by what the second round of the 11+ is? It’s just one round of testing?

@Roominmyhouse

I’m still confused by what the second round of the 11+ is? It’s just one round of testing?

Different areas have different 11+ testing procedures