Our society just doesn’t work for women

[Ozanj]

Not really an aibu but I am horrified by the Sabina Nessa murder. She was killed by a random stranger during a 5 min walk to meet a friend at 8 fucking 30 in the evening. What the fuck is this? Do we as women now need to hide ourselves away from 5pm to be safe?

So the choices are

Do something about it (not possible)

Get on the internet and wind each other up into a state of terror

Accept that risk is there and live your life the best way you can

I'm not seeing either of these to be honest

@LukeEvansWife

So the choices are

Do something about it (not possible)

Get on the internet and wind each other up into a state of terror

Accept that risk is there and live your life the best way you can

I'm not seeing either of these to be honest

If you don’t have anything to add to the discussion, why bother to engage with it? Nobody needs to be wound up to a state of terror by the Internet, the world we live in does the job quite well enough.

Not possible? Not possible? Open your mouth and scream! Rage! Find your righteous indignation, instead of accepting 'That's just the way it is!'

Not rousing each other to terror, but to fury! To the anger that won't be calmed down, to the outrage that burns like fires of hell until women can walk freely, unmolested; until we know that any oppression will be met with the full force of the law. Until the law is fair and there is genuine justice for women snd girls. Don't lay there and accept it - fight!

[quote Shmithecat2]@x2boys

What about shift workers,men picking their kids up etc

I believe that @TonyThreePies was being facetious to make a point. And your response confirmed that. Women will be told to alter their behaviour because of male violence, and somehow that's acceptable, but if men were, all the whataboutery/reasons why they possibly can't kicks in. Can you not see how wrong that is?[/quote]
What about shift workers,men picking their kids up etc

What about women who are shift workers or picking their kids up etc?

Shouldn't they be allowed to be safely out and about?

Sabina Nessa might well have been going to meet a friend, but she could well have been on her way home from work, like Sarah Everard was, or taking her DC to the park, like Rachel Nickel or home from school like Lin Russell, or doing constituency work like Jo Cox or going to work like Claudia Lawrence.

Every single one of those women should have been able to safely go about their business, we all should. And sadly it seems that, yet again, it's not the case.

Don't lay there and accept it - fight!

I’ve been fighting all my adult life and after 50 years of fighting I’m bloody tired. And I’ve done my share. If anyone wants to organise a Reclaim the Night march I’ll join in.

I think what annoys me most about these situations at the moment is how they are positioned as bad luck or whatever. The woman and three children from earlier in the week - the news reports are all being coy but it's clear that he was a current and/or ex boyfriend. But it's framed as "an isolated and tragic" incident. Bollocks. I bet you what you like he'd been involved in all kinds of things prior to this.

Its great people are getting worked up. But after all the outrage about Sarah's murder, everything just went back to how it was. People did the appropriate amount of virtue signalling and then went back to their lives.

And that is what will happen after this too. Its depressingly predictable.

Not rousing each other to terror, but to fury! To the anger that won't be calmed down, to the outrage that burns like fires of hell until women can walk freely, unmolested; until we know that any oppression will be met with the full force of the law. Until the law is fair and there is genuine justice for women snd girls. Don't lay there and accept it - fight!

What do you suggest?

Cressida Dick said after Sarah Everard that it was 'vanishingly rare'. It's not though is it...it's happening every day.

I was really upset by the murder of the woman and the three children...one of whom was a friend. Can you imaging sending your child off to a sleepover and them not coming home? Those poor parents.

I don't know why anyone would accept anything Cressida Dick said as being at all representative of the truth. A bit like pretty much every representative in the whole bloody government.

@Movingsoon21

Not extreme at all. We urgently need to look at ways to curb male violence (against both men and women).

Wholeheartedly agree.

This week has seen the murder of Sabina Nessa and the murder of a woman and three children. They all deserved better and something needs to be done.

I suggest writing to your MP today.
I suggest that every time you are present with men you state clearly what is not acceptable, so that they hear it every way they turn.

@beguilingeyes

Cressida Dick said after Sarah Everard that it was 'vanishingly rare'. It's not though is it...it's happening every day.

I was really upset by the murder of the woman and the three children...one of whom was a friend. Can you imaging sending your child off to a sleepover and them not coming home? Those poor parents.

Soon after Sarah Everard was murdered, there was also the lady who was killed while walking her dog, the Plymouth shootings and I'm sure there was another family killing before the Derbyshire one this week, plus probably countless others.

I don't know if rates are increasing, but these sorts of events seem quite common at the moment .

Then go start a thread about men murdering men. Why do people feel the need to make threads like this about men?!?!

Because it affect's men too. Teenage boys stabbed to death. A lone man leaving a pub and looks at another man by mistake etc. Most deaths in city centres at night are against men.

Yes male on male violence does exist and is an issue and female on male violence exists too but this a thread about male on female violence it doesn’t need this whataboutery derailing it.

If I started a thread about what are your favourite breakfasts you wouldn’t barge in and say what about lunches? Can we discuss favourite lunches. Or if we were discussing an environmental issues in say, Europe, you wouldn’t say what about Africa? It may be you would who knows.

Basically it’s not what us being discussed. I see this a lot on threads talking about violence against women, you get all the ‘what about the mens?!’ but I never see these posters caring enough to make a new thread about violence against men just happy to derail threads for women so 🤷🏻‍♀️

Basically it’s not what us being discussed. I see this a lot on threads talking about violence against women, you get all the ‘what about the mens?!’ but I never see these posters caring enough to make a new thread about violence against men just happy to derail threads for women so

To be honest these threads always follow EXACTLY the same script and don't really serve any purpose, other than to vent, I guess.

Seen one, seen them all. Must as well just let people rant rather than expecting anything to actually change by saying "let's make all men stay home at night!"

Sorry but any women that disagree with this are socially blind. Misogyny and sexism towards women in the UK in this day and age is "normal" sexual harassment is passed off as "boys being boys" it's literally not safe for a woman to be out alone after dark because of these preditors, yet people think that men get "too much hate" men just don't like being called out for their disgusting behaviour and their ego gets but hurt when they're upstaged by women. Tragic really.

There was a thread here a few days ago about two 11 years olds having an argument about nerf guns, the 11 year old boy told the girl if she didn't shut up he would shoot her (with a nerf hun presumably), he later apologised.

There were a handful of responses by the time I saw it and all posters thought it was a non issue, it struck me that an 11 year old boy had resorted to a threat of violence to silence a girl disagreeing with him, where did he learn that? And why did posters not see the dynamic at play in that situation?

Women seem to be conditioned accept male aggression and threats of violence as normal, probably because it's so common, so when it happens it's considered a non issue unless you actually get hurt.

@NewIdeasToday

This case is incredibly sad. But I’m afraid your post is a complete over reaction and that is the last thing that women should do.

Overreaction? What a stupid thing to say.

Imagine a world without male criminality and violence. Think how different it would be. When I’m outside my home almost everything I do is filtered through a fear of male criminal behaviour. For many women that fear doesn’t stop when they are home either. Something needs to change.

Isn't this the point though, why is it that women are asked to modify their behaviour in response to violent crimes committed by men. You/we should be free to walk our dogs in woods without having the fear of being some prick's target.

The onus is put on women to keep safe, change behaviour, not do things. Can't the onus be on men to not fucking kill!

@WeRTheOnesWeHaveBeenWaitingFor

Imagine a world without male criminality and violence. Think how different it would be. When I’m outside my home almost everything I do is filtered through a fear of male criminal behaviour. For many women that fear doesn’t stop when they are home either. Something needs to change.

Indeed. They'd also be able to close about 90% of prisons. The stark difference in male and female criminality is illustrated by the prison population.

There's about 140 prisons in England and Wales and less than 20 of them are for women and all the rest are for men.

@WeRTheOnesWeHaveBeenWaitingFor

Imagine a world without male criminality and violence. Think how different it would be. When I’m outside my home almost everything I do is filtered through a fear of male criminal behaviour. For many women that fear doesn’t stop when they are home either. Something needs to change.

I know this might be a trivial point but I use Strava to log my runs, I always stop my run once I’ve got in and locked the front door. DP asked me why I didn’t stop the door step before coming in, completely innocent question but as a man couldn’t understand why I didn’t want to be distracted and fiddling with my phone on the doorstep.

Another example, DP and I were walking through nearby woodland on the weekend. A lone male passed us and I said to DP once he’d passed, that this is why I wouldn’t walk in here on my own as I’d have been nervous just then. DP was of the opinion that men up to no good wouldn’t be just walking through woodland or would be waiting in woodland in the off chance a lone female walked by. Yes he might have a point, but I said I wouldn’t take that risk and I’d still be on high alert in that situation, where DP wouldn’t have even thought of it.

Minor things I know, but it just shows how differently women think and how we are always hyper vigilant, scanning our options, looking for a safe area/house, holding our keys etc.

I can’t even imagine living in a society where this didn’t go through my mind.

The fact I feel I (and other women) can’t just walk down to the coast at night and watch the waves without being in high alert makes me sad.

Hiding away at home isn’t going to help either. How many women are killed in the home by their partners? More than by random strangers.

I live on the edge of Epping Forest and I would love to run there. But I would never dream of running there alone, or at night alone.
These things are constantly automatically in the back of your mind.

I feel the same Brokenbiscuitsx.
I'm meeting a friend tomorrow and my entire night is planned around how I will get home. I won't get a taxi because part of the journey is very remote and there is no mobile signal.
I will be getting a train and then a taxi from somewhere closer meaning I will have to leave earlier. DH NEVER has to think about these things.