Arachnophobics - I want to understand. DSis is leaving holiday.

[Dollywilde]

Ok first off I hate spiders. I really do. Once got a randomer off my local FB to remove one.

But we are on holiday. First family holiday since baby was born. My sister has left after one night because she can’t cope with the spiders.

I paid for and organised it. They’re not huge (nothing bigger than a 5p piece). She’s severely arachnaphobic, I get that. But I’m cross, we have activities planned and she wanted to come and I can’t believe she’s letting this ruin the holiday.

It’s her thing, she’s going, I get it doesn’t affect me aside from the fact we all wanted a lovely holiday together. And I know it’s a real phobia.

Basically, can people shake some sense into me to stop me being cross? I don’t want to be cross with her. But walking out half way through a holiday I paid for is making me sad. We were having such a lovely time and this has basically made the entire break a waste of time and ££££.

@Hardbackwriter - there's an easy way to see the difference, if someone won't do anything at all unpleasant but is happy for you to do it they're taking the piss. Someone with a phobia though knows there's no actual danger but can't get past the panic regardless, so they can happily let someone who doesn't have that panic deal with it because they know they're not asking them to do something they find horrendous. But they'll happily do something else unpleasant that they don't have a phobia about.

I have genuine phobias about spiders and moths. DH also has a phobia about spiders but couldn't care less about moths. So if a spider comes we'll both muddle through it (not well!!) but if a moth comes I'll happily let him deal with it alone. If an incredibly dusty job needs doing (he has allergies and asthma) I will happily roll up my sleeves and do it because it's not the 'muck' I'm trying to get out of, it's the phobia.

@Tlollj

If it’s irrational, and if it’s a phobia then it must be irrational by definition, and you know it’s irrational then stop being scared of something that’s irrational to be scared of. I know you’re all going to shout at me. But I genuinely don’t get it.

You're acknowledging it's irrational but then trying to fix it rationally, which doesn't work. It's like trying to tell your body to stop hiccuping because it doesn't need to - it might work for someone but be useless for most people because you can't always control your reactions rationally.

@Tlollj

If it’s irrational, and if it’s a phobia then it must be irrational by definition, and you know it’s irrational then stop being scared of something that’s irrational to be scared of. I know you’re all going to shout at me. But I genuinely don’t get it.

I think many phobias are caused by something that happened in childhood too, so can be deeply psychological. Also people with high levels of anxiety tend to suffer from severe phobias too, so I don't think it's always as cut and dry as just an irrational fear. Often there's a reason for such an extreme fear, which the person may or may not remember/be aware of.

It’s not a rational thing, if there are lots I’d ask the management if they could move you or fumigate the property while you are out. Also sprays such as raid could be used before you go out for the day? Might reassure her. If there is a real problem with them as opposed to the time of year or location then I’d probably have to go sorry 🙈

That’s a lot.. and she knows there’s more, she probably can’t sleep.
Sometimes, being in a ‘spider zone’ without big ones is much much worse than being in a clear space with just the one tarantula.
That’s probably why the oh hoovered - ‘to clean’ the space. If my husband gets rid of a spider with a mug, I secretly throw away the mug..

I was severely phobic all the way up until I had my child in my late 20s and had to grab a spider out of his moses basket. I used to freeze on the spot and literally be unable to move. I would scream until my mum or sister came and removed the spider. I would also regularly throw up and/or pass out.
My mum tried exposure therapy by having me watch Arachnophobia and I managed 10 minutes with me stood in the hall watching it through the crack in the door before I started throwing up.
Now I can cope with them to an extent but my partner is how I used to be. Phobias aren't fears and are totally irrational.
You're allowed to be annoyed but please don't get angry with her as its not something she has control over x

Also- a lodge is an outside space made inside= lots of spiders thinking it’s a great home.
If camping I could cope, bc the spiders are meant to be there, I would have prepared myself, etc.
But I once stayed in a cabin, and it was horrific. Just lots and lots of wood/type spiders that I would have been fine with in a garden. But in an inside space, I was just on high alert the whole time. And if there is nowhere safe and spider-free that she can recover her anxiety levels, then I absolutely think she probably views leaving as the only possible solution!

@Libraryghost

I was cured overnight of my arachnophobia about 25 years ago. I was in my flat and a massive spider was in the bedroom. I was sweating, hyperventilating- the lot. I was that desperate I asked my neighbour who was 8 months pregnant at the time to get it for me. She eventually gets it after much sweating, climbing on furniture etc, looked at me with narrowed eyes and told me in a withering tone ‘‘to fucking grow up’ Weirdly this cured me. My fear of spiders was replaced by a fear of being made to feel that small again by a heavily pregnant woman. I am thinking this could be a kind of therapy, I am still scared of a pregnant woman with little patience to this day.

My three year olds withering scorn was the kick up the bum I needed to work on the phobia too..
Weirdly, my husbands sympathy just seemed to make it worse 🤷‍♀️

@XenoBitch- you can manage it yourself. There are lots of techniques - I use ‘the triangle of fear’, and use my toddler as an excuse to make myself stay in manageable situations with a spider. It does work- although it doesn’t ‘cure’ completely.
And as pps, if I’m stressed about something else, then I loose ground and often have to start at the bottom.
It’s a constant battle though- and I think it’s important to note that being in a room with a spider doesn’t make me uncomfortable or stressed. My body just aims itself at the exit. Instead, actively managing the phobia makes me stressed! But worth it not to show fear in front of kids -!

We left a holiday after one night because there were so many daddy long legs in the yurt that I couldn't sleep a wink. It was awful. That was a 'luxury' yurt in a field though! I've been to CP loads and never noticed a lot of spiders, one or two maybe but that's it.

I bet if your sister had paid for the holiday herself she would have managed to stay. I'd be annoyed too.

For me it would make a difference what size I think.

Small ones generally around the place, not ideal but fine. Large ones on or near my bed = start packing.

@DurhamDurham, if she really has arachnophobia - no she wouldn't, no matter how much it costs and no matter what the loss is. That is why it is a phobia and not just a fear - no rational argument/reasoning applies.

Yes, I was wondering if it would be at all possible for her to come back if something was done to take care of it?

I know some CP have some hotel style accomo or if you explained, they might be able to move you?

Spray some spider killing stuff around and/or get a plug-in repellant?

@DeepDown12 if her phobia is so severe why on earth did she agree to a Center Parcs holiday in the first place, they're advertised as forest holidays? That's madness but I suppose when it's someone else's money it's easy come easy go.

Treatment for spider phobia really works. I've seen it change someone's life.

You're acknowledging it's irrational but then trying to fix it rationally, which doesn't work. It's like trying to tell your body to stop hiccuping because it doesn't need to - it might work for someone but be useless for most people because you can't always control your reactions rationally.

Yes, @Drivingish. That is it exactly. Knowing it is irrational doesn't help at all. I am told that phobias affect the lymbic system of the brain, in the area that controls instinct and mood. You literally have no control over this.

[quote Porcupineintherough]@Mamanyt most of what you posted is nonsense. Any fear of spiders in the UK is irrational (they cant hurt you) and people draw all sorts of artibary boundaries around their arachnaphobia in order to allow them to function in everyday life. It's not true at all that it has to be this all encompassing obsession that excuses any irrationality.

Most people can't afford to move house, or leave their job or ditch a holiday because a spider or 6 appears. So they invent "rules", or rituals to keep themselves mentally safe or get treatment for their phobia so this doesnt happen.[/quote]
Phobias are, by definition, irrational fears. See my latest post regarding the limbic system's part in this. It arises there, and you can no more control than you can tell yourself all this breathing is unnecessary. The need to do so remains. There is a huge difference between a deep fear and a phobia. That you cannot see that speaks to the fact that you do not understand phobias. You literally have no control over it, or your reaction, Anyone who puts boundaries around their phobia is very possibly not truly phobic. They can be overcome, but it takes a LOT of work. I can now manage to kill a spider with a fly swatter, and dispose of the body, but I'm shaking like a leaf while I do it, and throw up after. Been this way for about 65 years.

I thought the only fears we are born with are the fear of falling. You know the thing that drs do to new born babies to make them reach out? Like a reflex? Or loud noises that make us jump. Ever other fear is learned behaviour. Again not being a dick just asking.

You absolutely can stop hiccuping. Just don’t do it. I do t know about those people you here about who have hiccups for months on end, but you can stop doing it.

@Tlollj

I thought the only fears we are born with are the fear of falling. You know the thing that drs do to new born babies to make them reach out? Like a reflex? Or loud noises that make us jump. Ever other fear is learned behaviour. Again not being a dick just asking.

That is the only fear we are born with, but phobias can be triggered at any time. I was not born phobic, I became so at 3 years old. I have a memory of an older girl, probably 7-8, telling me that I had been bitten by a black widow spider and was going to swell up and turn black and die in horrible pain. I do not know if that is a true memory, or my mind trying to make sense of an irrational fear.

And YOU may be able to stop hiccuping at will, but not everyone can. It is a spasm of the vagus nerve, and can be totally beyond conscious control...and IS, for most people. Not all, but most.

Sorry to bang on about it. But you weren’t bitten you didn’t turn black, swell up and die. So you don’t need to be scared. If it’s learned behaviour you can in learn it.
I sound such a dick but I really don’t understand. You must know it’s a baseless fear.

I understand her fear and feelings.

It doesn't sound as if centre parks do a lot of cleaning. You should ask them to come and deep clean the lodge for you as they charge enough.

@Tlollj

Sorry to bang on about it. But you weren’t bitten you didn’t turn black, swell up and die. So you don’t need to be scared. If it’s learned behaviour you can in learn it. I sound such a dick but I really don’t understand. You must know it’s a baseless fear.

You could say the same about lots of things, you're born with the instinct to hold your breath when you hit water suddenly, at some point you learn not to and you can't go back and 'unlearn' it. Even an Olympic swimmer who can hold their breath for ages is likely to take in at least a little water if caught off guard and that's exactly what happens with a phobia, you are always caught off guard. Even if you prepare to see a spider or whatever, your limbic system kicks in automatically, not everyone is capable of learning to override it.

I can’t tell you how to understand someone else’s phobia, I’m not phobic about anything and actively like spiders.
But I can respect someone else’s terror and try to make things easier for them by anticipating problems and planning round them.

You booked a holiday in a forest.
In spider season. The time of year when they are most active and visible. It’s been a good year for them.

And you invited an arachnophobe.