Not to allow ex to take dc on this holiday?

[MrsBede]

They are 12 &14 and in the 7 years since we split he has never taken them on holiday alone, though they've been twice in the UK when his dm organised it. Now he's inherited a substantial sum and messaged me tonight asking if he could take them away in October half-term. I asked which dates (they have 2 weeks off) and he said all of it as he wants to go abroad.

Ds1 was sitting next to me at the time and immediately said no as he really doesn't want to miss any school if he had to isolate on return. I messaged back to that effect but I'm livid he would take them for the full two weeks. I have never taken them so that he hasn't had them at all in any one holiday and I think it's unacceptable. He has them one night a week and eow, but often cancels if he has a gig. Term time is full on and we need the holiday time to reconnect (I'm a teacher). Just why should he think he should have the full holiday?

The other thing that really annoys me is he goes to Italy to visit friends every autumn and many a time when they were younger this has put me in the shit with child care as he does it at short notice. He obviously just wants to take them there and it's two weeks as that's how long he wants to go for, It's not a touristy place, there's not a lot there and they don't know his friends. I just think it's an utterly selfish idea and he's not replied to my text, which has put me on edge and I know ds is also worried about having said no. Ds2 doesn't see why they couldn't go. AIBU to think he's a selfish prick?

We renewed DSSs passport for him when his Mum wanted to take him away as his Mum is very disorganised and he wouldn't have been able to go on holiday with her. You sound very hard work.

But there's plenty of people who work just as hard or harder than teachers, have much less holidays and don't need 'reconnection' time every school holiday.

Exactly. And I'm a (retired) teacher. As a profession, we're very lucky to have so much family time with our own kids.
It's spectacularly tactless to say that you need this reconnection time when most people get less than half the holiday time that you do. Most parents are panicking about how to find childcare for their kids in that two weeks. Pretty much the opposite of 'reconnecting'.

It's a one off. They're teenagers, they aren't going to want to spend the full week of half term with you anyway. You're putting your bitterness above their chance to experience a holiday. Take yourself out of the equation and let your kids have a holiday with their father.

@MimosaFields

You sound so incredibly bitter! You are denying your children the opportunity to go to a nice place with their father just because you can't stand the man. You are coming up with ridiculous excuses. Your children will eventually realise and hate you for denying them the opportunity of getting closer to their dad. They will not remember the times he cancelled, or whatever else you are bitter about.

They will remember the times he cancelled. Mine do. To the extent they no longer care if he does because its expected.

Let the kids decide. It sounds like they won't want to go anyway. And tell him that you will do what the kids want but he will need to renew passport and pay for everything including spending money for them, any extra clothes, suitcases etc they might need, and covid tests etc including when they are back.

If he has them two weeks at half term could you negotiate more time at Christmas or next year?

I honestly can’t believe all these posters would want their children travelling without them in a pandemic for 2 weeks (the full school holidays) and risk isolation, after already losing out on their education. Especially as one child doesn’t want to go. The Nrp should be taking them a week as a good compromise and the op should be encouraging this one week holiday to both children if possible.

Oh wow.

I loved time away with my dad. Those are some of the best memories of my life. I’d of been so sad if my father couldn’t of taken me

Though my mum and dad had a really really amicable split. So she’d never of taken that away from me especially. Nor my dad.

You can't stand your ex can you OP - this is evident. But do NOT use your kids like this!
I thought under 18s didn't have to self isolate now unless positive (with a PCR test they're going to discontinue using btw - which can't come bloody soon enough !!!!!)
Your hate for your ex is getting in the way of your children's lives. That's selfish.
What has you being a teacher got to do with your OP?
What has him coming into money got to do with anything if he is going to Italy as he does every Autumn?
You've just spent 6 weeks with them OP.
Put. Them. First.
Tell your DS1 that his life does NOT and should NOT revolve around a bloody SARs virus FFS!!!! Live life. You've only got one.

I think it might be a good idea to sit down with your DC (am a bit confused as you seem to call both DS1) and chat through what your ex is suggesting. See what might be worrying / exciting them and whether any concerns can be addressed. Try not to let your own evident bitterness (no matter how well founded) get in the way. Make this about them and what they might want / not want. And then respond to your ex.

You sound miserable and bitter (and petty). Feel sorry for your ex who no doubt was excited to finally be able to take the kids abroad. Still don’t understand why the schooling would suffer - it’s their holiday isn’t it?
You are a teacher and have tons of holidays with the kids, they won’t lose out on their connection with you if they go away with their DF once. Are you worried you will be lonely without them?
I don’t think DS will be happy if you sabotage their holiday (deliberately not renewing passport for example). Can you not jump over your shadow and let them have a holiday together?

I wonder how much the bitterness and resentment have affected your children over the years. No matter what you say, I'd put money on it that your child saying he didn't want to go has more to do with not upsetting you. No way can you hide this much anger from them.
You're not going to let them go, own it rather than trying to justify an unreasonable stance.
My children and I don't gather round and read texts their father sends me. Best that they don't usually. Weird that your child did.

And yes, the children will remember everything he has or hasn't done. Just as they will come to understand any emotional manipulation, whether intentional or not, by OP

They will remember the times he cancelled.
Mine do. To the extent they no longer care if he does because its expected.

Well then the poor kids don't need BOTH parents acting like selfish dicks!

Kids under 18 don't need to self isolate unless they test positive themselves.

OP should be encouraging them to LIVE LIFE and go! This Covid shit with children has GOT to bloody STOP!
We're raising little hypochondriacs. It's disgusting!

I would just shrug your shoulders and let him get on with it.

He needs to organise everything and the kids need to want to go. If it turns into you being asked to sort X,Y and Z then you have every right to tell him to jog on, but only at that point. I think just saying no from the get go sounds very bitter and miserable.

You sound really controlling and as though you believe you own the children

I’m sure you wouldn’t have thought twice about his feelings or visitation if you had been given some money

Allow the children to have a relationship with their father not soured by your experience of him.

OP I think you're getting quite a hard time of it on here.

Personally, overall I agree with you but probably for different priorities.

My main concern is that at your children's ages, spending 2 weeks somewhere where there's not much for them to do is likely to be pretty frustrating and boring for them.

It's not a situation where he's splashing the cash on a great holiday for the children, he's simply taking them along with him for a holiday of his choosing that isn't actually that appealing (DS2 might like the idea in principle but possibly doesn't understand the reality).

My second concern is COVID. We still don't know how this is going to pan out and international travel is still a gamble re: being expected to quarantine/isolate.

I assume he isn't going to be making any plans for such a contingency and in that regard his holiday comes at a potential cost to you.

The problem is that your children feel differently. If both wanted to go/not go it would be easier.

As such I actually think it is a reasonable compromise to suggest going for a week as that would seem to be an appropriate response to how the children feel about it.

All that said I do think you need to take a bit of a step back here. From what you've posted it's understandable why you are pissed off with him, but fundamentally the idea of him taking the kids on holiday for the full 2 weeks isn't in itself a shitty thing - it's really an issue of where he's going and the current uncertainty.

You're angry that he didn't spend enough time or money on them before, and now you're angry that he wants to spend too much time and money on them? It sounds like you've had the entirety of every two-week holiday with them since forever. Is there some other two-week period that would work better for you? If not, it's hardly fair to complain about him choosing the time that works best for himself. He has his own adult responsibilities just like you do, and he's working around those and the children's school schedule. If your access to the children doesn't depend on his schedule, his access to them shouldn't depend on yours.

They get plenty of time with you, and it's better for them to spend some rare quality time with their father than to spend yet more time with you. That's true even if it means they have to isolate after coming back.

a holiday of his choosing that isn't actually that appealing (DS2 might like the idea in principle but possibly doesn't understand the reality).
You've no idea what the "reality" of the holiday would be. I'm not sure op's view is strictly impartial.

Are you always this arsey with people who don’t agree with you?

YABU, this isn’t about you and what you want / how you feel.

Don’t think for one minute your kids don’t pick up on the clear bitterness you feel towards your ex!

I’m not sure - I think your views on this holiday are highly coloured by the fact that he’s been shit and unreliable in the past, which I get. It’s so annoying for him to cancel whenever he feels like it then whisk them away for the ‘fun’ bit. However, if they wanted to go I would allow them to. If you’re the barrier to them doing these things then it gives him an easy excuse to be even more shit in the future. Of course if the older boy doesn’t want to go then don’t force him.

@MrsBede YANBU

I’m livid he would take them for the full two weeks. I have never taken them so that he hasn't had them at all in any one holiday and I think it's unacceptable.

Sounds like you have an agreement to having the children for half the holidays each. So, I think it’s fair enough that he be willing to stick with the agreement. It is reasonable if you to expect him to respect the agreement. You have stuck to the agreement, it should go both ways.

It's not a touristy place, there's not a lot there and they don't know his friends

Doesn’t sound like much of a holiday then.

I don't agree. Going abroad is a risky decision in the current situation and I don't think a nrp, especially a flaky one like him, should get the final say in it. I'd be the one helping them catch up with schooling and reassuring ds1 etc, not him.

I agree with you. However, I don’t think the “men deserve the final say without having to take responsibility for the repercussions of their decisions” brigade will agree. And the “women have less value and should put up and shut up” brigade would disagree with you too. If you disagree or complain or get angry as a woman it must be because you’re bitter

Well ,that's total bullshit. Of course it's my business where they go . Especially as I will be dealing with the consequences if they have to isolate.

Exactly, because you are their parent all the time not just when you have the children with you. In Australia a parent can’t take their children abroad without the permission of the other parent. Even a resident parent needs permission from the non resident parent. That’s because both parents are responsible for their kids. How ridiculous that anyone would believe that it’s none of your business what the other parent does with your kids when they are with him. There are some decisions that actually do need both parents involvement.

I have put up with everything over the years and not badmouthed him at all, though he has me and he also refuses to communicate properly, putting ds1 in the middle, which he hates.

No wonder you feel angry. You should be able to have somewhere to vent without armchair psychologists who know absolutely nothing about you diagnosing you as bitter.

And just because you’ve vented your frustrations on an anonymous forum doesn’t mean you are showing your children contempt for their father. Or being angry or bitter towards him in front of them etc.

YANBU and it sounds like you have had to deal with a selfish prick for a while. That can get a bit tiresome after a while. Take care of yourself MrsBede. I hope you find some supportive and understanding people you can vent to and let off a little steam.

@GreyhoundG1rl

a holiday of his choosing that isn't actually that appealing (DS2 might like the idea in principle but possibly doesn't understand the reality). You've no idea what the "reality" of the holiday would be. I'm not sure op's view is strictly impartial.

No I'm sure it's not necessarily impartial, but we can't be sure it's untrue either.

I was clear that I'm not in agreement with all of the issues she's raised in objection (I think as a one off use of the whole holiday it's not an unreasonable request on his part).

That said from what she's posted this is a place he visits semi-frequently to see his friends.

It's not that he's using his windfall to fund a child centric holiday - rather he's (this time) offering to take them along for the his ride.

As ever with such threads it's impossible to accurately assess the validity of every claim.

So on the assumption that this is not a particularly teen friendly location then it's not a great place to take them for two weeks - unless you actually believe in karma for his "sins" in so far that my experience of "bored" teens on holiday results in a lack of holiday for the adults .

You sound bitter and angry, and are making your kids miss out because you’re so bitter. It’s a shame, but you won’t face it until you’re ready to, so this forum is a bit redundant currently

Selfish prick? YANBU

Not letting your kids go on holiday with their father? YABVU...and would be just as selfish a prick (to your kids)

OP I don't get the point in your thread......
You asked if your being unreasonable to stop this the majority of posters have said yes if you're children want to go and your blocking it then you are.

To which you respond no I'm not, I'm not renewing my child's passport (which tbh just comes across as spiteful) and go on a rant about he can have one week in the UK.....
Your children are old enough to decide who they wish to spend their holidays with you shouldn't be blocking the option but it seems no matter what people say you don't want to hear this and just thought people would go ohhhh no he's totally out of order.... 🙄