To not want to be primary caregiver?

[ttcissoboring]

Not got kids yet but planning to. I don't know any woman that's not the primary caregiver IRL and it's starting to panic me. I don't want to be primary caregiver. Is this going to be enivitable?

Is it impossible to go back to work as soon as I am feeling physically able to and split the parenting at that point? A year off work seems the default but there is no way I want and could do that. Men go back after a week and there is no judgement as to 'how could he leave the child so young' woman does it and the judgement is like she has committed child abuse, I find it very sad and frustrating. And the judgement seems to come from other women as much as it does men.

Does anyone who has children consider themselves not the primary caregiver and completely equal with how they parent with their partner?

The idea of parenting doesn't appeal to me unless it's 50/50 ( of course I understand anything could happen tragically to DH where I'd have to be full caregiver and I'd have no choice)

Is primary caregiver inevitable because I'm a woman? And am I being somewhat naive to this experience?!

Please tell me your experiences of switching this narrative if you have kids, are a woman and not the default parent but share the duties equally from very early on.

@Pinklioness

It's not just 'diehard Earth mothers' as you patronisingly put it that belittle. As I said earlier @ChequerBoard* you were just as belittling with your comments about having 'no ambition'.

It's not just misogynistic to say that women should say at home. It's misogynistic to criticise any woman's choices. Your posts are littered with judgmental comments and belittling.

This. The super ambitious 'working mums' can't see at ALL how rude they are being to women who prefer to be with their children.

@MyPatronusIsACat I can't think of anything ruder than telling a woman that has said is TTC that she shouldn't have children or should get a dog instead which is what the anti working mother brigade has come out with in this thread.

What I said is factually correct. You can choose not to work, that's fine I have no issue with that. But you are making that choice over having the ambition to progress your career. It's not a slight it's fact.

It's interesting that you take such issue with not being seen as ambitious. Perhaps you aren't as happy with your choices as you profess?

[quote MyPatronusIsACat]@Pinklioness

It's not just 'diehard Earth mothers' as you patronisingly put it that belittle. As I said earlier @ChequerBoard* you were just as belittling with your comments about having 'no ambition'.

It's not just misogynistic to say that women should say at home. It's misogynistic to criticise any woman's choices. Your posts are littered with judgmental comments and belittling.

This. The super ambitious 'working mums' can't see at ALL how rude they are being to women who prefer to be with their children.[/quote]
Your posts are dripping with contempt at working mothers and their choices? The disappointment at parents dressed up as faux concern for kids. Have you just recently arrived from Gilead? Is it a sense of superiority or envy?

Another one for re-thinking having children.

A newborn / young baby needs its mum.
Also - the sleep deprivation when you have young babies would make working FT very hard.

If you do want a baby, you need to be open to your whole mindset changing. You may not want to go back to work. You may be too tired. Mix feeding might not work out.

It sort of sounds like having a child would be an inconvenience if you're focused on going back to work full time once you've recovered from the birth.

@Dandy0911

Another one for re-thinking having children.

A newborn / young baby needs its mum.
Also - the sleep deprivation when you have young babies would make working FT very hard.

If you do want a baby, you need to be open to your whole mindset changing. You may not want to go back to work. You may be too tired. Mix feeding might not work out.

It sort of sounds like having a child would be an inconvenience if you're focused on going back to work full time once you've recovered from the birth.

Would you say that to a man?

A man doesn't need to recover from the birth whilst working full time.

@ChequerBoard I mean a man can't breastfeed so I'd skip that

There is a reason why men get 2 weeks paternity and women get longer.

I would say most of the above, yes.

But babies shouldn't be born just to go into nursery from 2 weeks old. So if a man was having this same conversation, I would say the same points that were valid to a man too, yes.

(I've just read that the OP didn't state whether she wanted to go back full or part time) and I understand some women have no choice if they don't have maternity leave. In other countries etc. But this OP is posting like having a child is an inconvenience. Wants total 50/50 caregiving.
There's no such things as 50/50 all the time. When one parent gets ill, when one parent has work commitments, when one parent has family problems to sort etc etc.

So yes, I'd say the majority of my point to a man.

@WTF475878237NC

A man doesn't need to recover from the birth whilst working full time.

Exactly!

I know two couples who split caregiver responsibilities. One where the mum went back to work and the dad took the first year off, and now they both juggle their time plus they used to have a nanny to come daily when they’re working (kids are school age now) . The second couple I know both switched to part time work and did different days so they’d each be with the kids during that time…
I think it depends on who is earning more for many people as to who goes back to work sooner too

[quote Dandy0911]@ChequerBoard I mean a man can't breastfeed so I'd skip that

There is a reason why men get 2 weeks paternity and women get longer.

I would say most of the above, yes.

But babies shouldn't be born just to go into nursery from 2 weeks old. So if a man was having this same conversation, I would say the same points that were valid to a man too, yes.

(I've just read that the OP didn't state whether she wanted to go back full or part time) and I understand some women have no choice if they don't have maternity leave. In other countries etc. But this OP is posting like having a child is an inconvenience. Wants total 50/50 caregiving.
There's no such things as 50/50 all the time. When one parent gets ill, when one parent has work commitments, when one parent has family problems to sort etc etc.

So yes, I'd say the majority of my point to a man. [/quote]

OP has never said she wants to back to work after 2 weeks so that's just an invented phallacy.

As is saying 50:50 caregiving won't work because one partner might get ill or have family issues. What are you saying here? That being a primary caregiver means you never get sick or have family issues? In actual fact being 50:50 makes those things much easier to deal with because the DC are happy to be cared for by either parent.

It is certainly possible to equally split parenting. It does, however, require a LOT of serious, and honest, discussions with your DP, and well in advance of actually becoming pregnant. If he is the least bit hesitant, I'll almost guarantee that you will end up the primary caregiver over time. Little by little, the responsibilities will shift to you, and you will NOT get much support or commiseration over it. Because we, as women, are still expected to be primary caregivers, regardless of the fact that we may be equal or primary wage earners.

I agree with others and rethink having children.

As long as you are upfront it seems fine. DH was primary caregiver the over 20 years ago as his job was more flexible And I had the sort of job where I had no idea when I would get home on a given day. The longest maternity leave I took was 6 weeks. Even then (in NW London) it wasn’t too unusual. We outsourced all the domestic stuff and had a PT nanny for when DH needed to work.

@Pinkicegem

You can definitely do 50/50 but check your maternity policy at work if you have one as they don’t always allow husbands / partners shared maternity leave. I was paid for 9 months maternity leave (not full but a percentage) but my partner would have had to do it unpaid so we didn’t split it. I wish it was common place so we both had good bonding time but it isn’t. Now I have 60 days holiday to use so doing 3 days a week until the end if the year… I want to use it up as it would be crazy not to (work to live and all that..) and I love being a mum HOWEVER having such a long time off plus being “part time” now will affect my career. I’m taking it on the chin thinking in 5 years time I’d rather have my family than be a step higher career wise (but it’s sad this day and age we still feel like we have to make this choice). Plus I know I’ll graft my ass off to get where I wanna be when I’m ready. It’s tough but unlike some European countries who want new dads to bond - we aren’t there yet. Breastfeeding is great but means that it isn’t 50/50 as you get up and do all the night feeds etc. I don’t regret breastfeeding but it was a shock to see how tired and worn out I became…no family nearby. I needed the maternity leave in the end as I was a zombie! Hopefully if you do decide to have kids you’ll have a better sleeper than I did.

Ignore anyone saying not to have kids - you can’t control everything and you and your partner could split up, get ill, a million other bad things could happen… for most couples though it’s about communication with your partner all the way through so you share as much as is possible. We don’t have to be the housekeeper and mum of the 60s - we will forge our own path - so be the mum that shows the others what a modern loving family relationship looks like :-)

I seem to recall reading that it’s the statutory maternity leave that can be split so the father can claim it from the government and it’s paid through his employment. It wouldn’t have anything to do with the mother’s employer.

@ttcissoboring

You really do need to consider if children are right for you though, because it comes across like you would view them as an inconvenience. That's not s nice way to grow up.

See - this is the judgement I am referring to! I have already decided I would like children.

This statement is completely unnecessary and judgemental.

Agree, OP. A man would never get this comment.

I don't know how old you are but I'm guessing you are just not in the right place mentally for kids yet. Longer term you can plan to be 50/50 but you need to be in a mental place where you could parent 100% if needed, whether that's due to relationship breakdown, accident or sickness it unfortunately happens.

when the time came that i wanted to return to work, we discussed who would be best as primary. i worked further away, so chose to be primary as the thought of cooking that baby for 9 months then leaving to travel 2 counties away didnt fit with me. i found local part time work for a while. and as the years have passed, the role has changed between us depending on work, etc.
these things arent set in stone, if both partners are willing. it worked v well with us.

@Gilly12345

I agree with others and rethink having children.

She should rethink having children because she wants to share childcare responsibilities with her husband? How ridiculous

Would you say that to a man?

Men don't give birth, men just aren't the same as a baby's mother in the early months. I promise you, not everyone is an attack on women.

Going back to work is fine, most people here probably work and have kids but babies [newborns] need time to bond with their mum before going to nursery

@gogohm

I don't know how old you are but I'm guessing you are just not in the right place mentally for kids yet. Longer term you can plan to be 50/50 but you need to be in a mental place where you could parent 100% if needed, whether that's due to relationship breakdown, accident or sickness it unfortunately happens.

It's a ridiculous statement - and one btw I have assessed, obviously I understand things happen out of control - what has that got to do with making a plan for 50/50 parenting? (and I even, just for the simple posters out there, I put a comment in my original post to say I acknowledge circumstances where DH may not be around) but conveniently that part gets omitted when posters just want to be unkind.

Whilst this thread has been helpful also frustrating how people make the silliest assumptions and lies to make the original post seem much worse than what it was.

You couldn't WAIT for your baby to be at the point where people could babysit your child? And you couldn't WAIT to get back to work?!

You sound very resentful of your own child here!

Also, why did YOU have to stay home, and be 'primary care giver' to your child, and be FORCED to have a year of mind numbingly BORING maternity leave, if your DH only earned slightly more than you?

Makes naff-all sense to me. Why did your DH not stay home, whilst you went out to your wonderful exciting job? Your DH would probably have been a lot more grateful and happy to spend the first year of his child's life with his child, than you were.

Do you really find it so hard to believe that some women don't particularly enjoy being on maternity leave? It doesn't mean they are resentful of their child or that they don't love them. How many men say they don't enjoy the baby stage? They don't get told the don't love their child. I'm afraid your response makes you sound like a very judgemental person.

I didn't enjoy maternity leave. I found it lonely and isolating. I very much looked forward to going back to work. Unfortunately shared parental leave wasn't a thing when I was off otherwise we would definitely have used it.

I also agree that you need to put your name down nursery as soon as you can - that's very practical advice as good ones do fill up and have waiting lists.

As for babysitting, again some people are happy to have people babysit from a young age. We certainly were and my mother in law was very keen too. It doesn't mean we don't love our child or resent them! We just also happen to still value and occasionally prioritise couple time - we feel that benefits our family as a whole.

[quote Dandy0911]@ChequerBoard I mean a man can't breastfeed so I'd skip that

There is a reason why men get 2 weeks paternity and women get longer.

I would say most of the above, yes.

But babies shouldn't be born just to go into nursery from 2 weeks old. So if a man was having this same conversation, I would say the same points that were valid to a man too, yes.

(I've just read that the OP didn't state whether she wanted to go back full or part time) and I understand some women have no choice if they don't have maternity leave. In other countries etc. But this OP is posting like having a child is an inconvenience. Wants total 50/50 caregiving.
There's no such things as 50/50 all the time. When one parent gets ill, when one parent has work commitments, when one parent has family problems to sort etc etc.

So yes, I'd say the majority of my point to a man. [/quote]
I am not sure OP means 5050 all the time even if one parent is ill. I would take a pretty good bet that she just means generally. We do 5050 parenting but we dont make eachother split everything exactly half even when ill. All 5050 means is that one person isn't overall doing an unequal share. That you both see yourselves as equally responsible and act like it too. It really isnt as black and white or tedious as "you made yesterday's dinner so I have to today even though you're vomiting your guts up"

You can definitely do 50/50 and it will be great for your child to have that model. But I would just counsel staying flexible and light on your feet as a parent. It's hard to predict how you will feel after the baby arrives. You may not want to rush back to work after all, for a variety of reasons. So I would get that 50/50 commitment from your partner now but wait to see what that looks like in practice when the time comes. A baby turns your life upside down emotionally as well as practically, and you may find you don't feel the way you think you will now.

@hifiive

Would you say that to a man?

Men don't give birth, men just aren't the same as a baby's mother in the early months. I promise you, not everyone is an attack on women.

Going back to work is fine, most people here probably work and have kids but babies [newborns] need time to bond with their mum before going to nursery

To be fair, OP has said she’ll be the primary carer initially and would like to breastfeed. It’s going forward after that that she’s talking about. I think it’s totally reasonable, once both parents are working, to expect a 50/50 split. I can’t believe it’s being seen as unreasonable or a sign of not really wanting children.

This. The super ambitious 'working mums' can't see at ALL how rude they are being to women who prefer to be with their children.

And you don't seem to be able to see how your posts just ooze misogynistic contempt for women who have chosen a different way of bringing up their children.

My choice to work and be ambitious is not a reflection on your choices. I fully support all women to make informed choices about what works best for them and their family. If that choice is to stay at home, then I fully support that choice. I don't see it as a personal attack on my choices that have been made to suit the needs of my family. I also don't believe that these choices are a reflection on how much we all love our kids....... to suggest that is the case is a low blow and I will judge you for making that comment!