2nd Thread: friend wants to move in for a 'few months'

[islandhoppin]

As continued from my previous thread.

You haven’t really responded to her arguments though which is potentially why she doesn’t understand.

this is a classic problem actually.
If I say no, and give you a reason, that does not mean that you can solve my reason and then it will be a yes.
I see this a lot on mn, in both directions.

either - you didn't give a clear NO, you just gave reasons, so they thought that if they could solve the issues, then it would be fine.
or - like here, you haven't explained yourself, so they haven't heard NO.

We do need to learn that when someone says no, they mean no. They will give you a reason, which is a courtesy/politeness thing, it is not a list of obstacles that you then need to break down.
It is not unreasonable to ask - eg - no because of your dog; you ask - if I found somewhere else for dog would that make a difference? But once you have been told no, you should assume it means no.

And as the person saying no, it is fine to stick to your guns.

It sounds like you're finally seeing what your friend is really like. FWIW, decent friends respect your boundaries and your needs. They do not insist that their needs are more important and then employ emotional blackmail. I think the depth of your emotional reaction is because, deep down, you know this and you are feeling the pain of being so undervalued.

I think you're going to have to let this friendship go. I honestly believe the more your clear out this kind of toxic clutter from your life, the more you open up space for good things to happen. Good luck!

A PP suggested that you haven't explained the reason for saying No, and that's why CF is still asking

I completely disagree

(1) you don't have to give a reason

(2) if you explain, she'll have an answer to every obstacle

Don't engage

Morning OP! What are you up to today? Are you working? If not and you have an empty day I think it might help you to get out and about somewhere,possibly with another friend or your dh maybe and leave your phones at home go out get some fresh air or do something fun. I think some space from here too will do wonders for your mental health after such a day yesterday. If you can go out and do something to keep occupied , It will make you feel stronger I promise!

Hopefully she’s finally got the message and will realise how unreasonable she has been and the upset she has caused you! Hope today is a better day

I suggest you block all her means of communication immediately!
You have done amazingly well so far but it really is time to put a stop to her nonsense.

We have been taught at work to respond with an answer, that doesn't contain any excuse, and repeat if necessary.

Can I live at your house for a few months?
Sorry that doesn't work for me. (Keep repeating if you need to)

Can I live at your house for a few months?
Sorry that doesn't work for me because we both have dogs.
What if I find somewhere for the dog to go...?

Then they have 'sorted' your problem and you then have to think of another excuse.

Stand firm OP, you're doing a good job. I hope today is less stressful.

So this so called friend wants to move in with you for a few months with her dog and will not accept NO for an answer.
Then she has the cheek to say she would NOT be contributing to the rent & bills, so you and your DP will be putting a roof over her head, feeding her and her dog and possibly her boyfriend a few times a week. No wonder her family will not take her in. She is one entitled CF.

I don't believe it would be a few months either from the tone of her messages to you. I think once she had got her feet under the table she would have played every trick under the sun to stay for god knows how long!!!!!!

She doesn't care how much she is upsetting you, so now return the favour and end the friendship. You will feel as if a weight has been lifted once you have done this.

Morning @islandhoppin just checking in to see how you're doing...and you're doing great .

Hopefully you won't hear any more from CF on the subject, and she can move on to wailing about how heartless you've been...keep walking blithely on and each day you'll get further away from her.

Really glad you have the support of a strong DP soon-to-be DH - look forward to that instead of wasting energy worrying over this madam!

The fact that she did not accept your 1st, 2nd or 3rd no is absolutely spoilt, selfish and pushy behaviour. I would be considering binning this “friendship”. Friends don’t behave like that. Also I think you have dodged a bullet. Moving takes ages and she could have stayed a year!!

She's used to trampling on your boundaries - the fact she wasn't bothered about her DP smoking in your house is evidence of that. I don't know any smoker who would think that was acceptable. If he actually wants to facilitate the house move so they can move in together, then he needs to be resolving the fact his parents (understandably) won't have the dog in the house.

She's trying to make you feel as if she's been tossed out on to the streets and you're refusing to let her in. But the simple fact is she has a house to live in. I assume she is at least partly motivated by not wanting the hassle of keeping the house tidy whilst it's on the market, although I suspect the co-owner knows the house will be harder to sell with an uncontrolled dog living in it. All of that is her problem. And she wants to move in rent-free! What a bloody cheek.

I suspect if you think back, you will find other examples of when she has ridden roughshod over your boundaries for something she wants.

For your mental health, it's time to step back from this relationship. Don't engage with her, or present reasons, or try to argue against her reasons. You don't need to do any of that. You've said no, you've already said sorry more times than you should have done (not to mention left the door open by saying "I'm sure it would be lovely" to have her to stay when you know you perfectly well it would be godawful).

Keeping using your DP to field her nonsense. Unfortunately I think there will be more of it before you get to the end of this.

Get ready for a visit today, if she only lives 15 mins away I'm sure she will turn up announced to try and convince you.

Just keep reading through all the brilliant advice here, and ready to repeat the Mumsnet mantra;

"Sorry that does not work for me"

Good Luck

Just read your other thread and you have definitely done the right thing by saying no. The emotional manipulation came out to play well and truly from her replies. Any normal person would say okay no problem if they couldn't stay not her anyway...

I do wonder why she needs to leave her current home? Is there more to it than she is telling you?

I do agree that she is being selfish and not respecting your boundaries

Luckily I'm not at home today. I'm out at a works meeting away from home so I won't be back until late. DP is going to be home though. Hope she doesn't turn up..

The ‘friendship’ is already over. What an absolutely awful woman. You are well shot of her. She is showing her true colours. You are the last person she can think of to sponge off. Christ no rent or bills? Utter madness.

Would it be so bad if she did and if DP is home? She clearly isn't listening to you so a few home truths from him might hit the spot!

Wow, just wow. I've read both threads and I cannot fathom the level of CF. I'm so glad that you've said no, you'll never get rid of her if she moves in, or the dog, or the bf. she will ruin your home and then get the hump when you pull her up on it. She has trampled all over your boundaries and your friendship. She isn't a friend. A friend would never speak to you the way she has. The friendship would be over for me.
As others have said, as tempting as it is to find out the reason for her immediate housing need, when she has a perfectly good roof over her head, just don't. She will use it as an excuse to pester you more and get you to feel sorry for her.
Well done OP, your responses have been spot on and if she continues to badger you don't feel bad about blocking her from all aspects of your life

This woman is definitely not a friend

@MadameMonk

Much as we might all speculate on this thread about what’s being left out of your friend’s story, I’d strongly advise you (and your DP) not to look into that or ask further questions. Anything other than a firm repeat of the basic boundary you’ve now set can (and no doubt will) be taken as a new opportunity to harangue you or escalate the sob story.

Boundaries are walls. You set them up, alert anyone who needs to know that it’s there, then walk away from your side of the wall back to your life. Don’t hang around your wall, getting worn down hearing the toddler wailing happening on the other side.

And any flying monkeys who pop over the wall to slyly scope the gossip or pressure you? They get the same short shrift. I use the sentence ‘Actually I’ve decided that topic is closed, I won’t be discussing it any more.’ Said in a calm, casual tone. Then change the subject or end the conversation.

I’d also be quickly planning some urgent house repairs/renovations to strengthen my resolve. Not cos I had to, just to give my boundary extra ‘bricks’. If you stop thinking of your home as having ‘spare rooms’, maybe others will too. They aren’t spare, they are exactly as occupied and useful as you want and need them to be. Rename them, redecorate them. You could probably use a meditation area with your current issues? Paint one red and hang a sex swing in it? That’ll send a couple of different messages to anyone hoping to stay.

Gosh @MadameMonk this is just the best advice I've ever seen on boundaries, which I've struggled with for over half a century. I'm going to memorise this, which will be easy as you've used such clear imagery. Thank you!

...and good luck OP, hats off to you
I hope she leaves you in peace... for good. This is not someone you want as a "friend."

No means no.

That's all you and your DP say at this point: via text, via phone, at the front door where you don't let her come in.

I am agog at the cheeky fuckery of this woman! How dare she? After you have said you are not int he right headspace she has kept on pushing to have her needs met over yours.

She's caused homelessness on herself too. Bloody hell that would be the end for me. She is the opposite of a friend.

Stay Strong with help from your DP, islandhoppin.

You say "she would do it for me".
I bet she wouldn't if you were going to totally disrupt her life and not even contribute to bills or food.

She's accepting others' boundaries - when they've said she can't stay at theirs with the dog - but your boundaries are for trampling!!

Stay Strong.

I've been thinking about this notion of an open-ended house guest (paying nothing and bringing unruly dog and smelly partner).

We have some very much-loved, well-behaved friends who come to visit for 3 nights maximum a couple of times a year. We love their company but my, we're always relieved to have our own space back when they leave.

This so-called friend of the OP's has a lot going on that we know about and a considerable amount that we don't. She's not very nice.

Hope all goes well today OP, and that she’s finally got the message.