Page 9 | AIBU princess parties is this what we are inspiring our girls to be ?

saraclara · 21/08/2021 23:36

I don't think there's been a simpering heroine in a Disney film since the Little Mermaid. And even she had her feisty moments. Kids aren't growing up with Snow White waiting on seven men any more.

Kids should have access to dolls, lego, toy cars and everything in between, whatever their sex. And if a little girl wants a princess party, FFS let her have one. It's not going to turn her into a vacuous simpering wimp.

purplebatbear · 22/08/2021 01:26

@smmanf12

Whilst you're absolutely right about the fact that there are lots of princesses on those films that are lore feisty, the bottom line is that at these parties it's mainly all about little girls looking pretty, dressing in flouncy dresses, making their hair look pretty etc etc etc. They often put on affected, simpering Americanised accents (I've suffered through many of these horrendous parties) and they really do make my skin crawl. It's all very affected, very much about appearances and just (in my opinion) cringey.

I'd much rather my daughter have a muddy, forest party or an art party or something less trite and cliched.

Polkadots2021 · 22/08/2021 07:01

@bottleitsellit

Just been to a Princess birthday party, my first one. So a women acts as your princess of choice with the wig and outfit and runs the party games instead of the parents. I just feel so sad about how all the girls were gushing over it. I suppose I wasn't brought up with princesses as my mum was very much a tomboy and I have lots of older brothers. My girls have fairies, witches amongst their toys just as my DS has dragons, Harry Potter, but we have really haven't gone with princesses as it's a bit old fashioned, a knight on a horse saving you. Maybe it's just me, they will prob now want princess everything 😬

Every little girl has the right to be a princess or wish they were Action Man or anything in between. Doesn't matter if they shatter or completely conform to gender norms, sparkly things, boxing, princesses, trucks, dancing or hard-nosed legal careers. It's all good as long as they're expressing who they really are. Just let them enjoy expressing themselves.

Lessthanaballpark · 22/08/2021 07:29

As long as the child is allowed to pick the opposite gendered toy if they choose it's no big deal

I just don’t think most kids have the capacity to do that. Most kids just go along with stereotypes and expectations, especially gendered ones. There was a BBC documentary a while back that really showed that by primary school kids have very clear ideas of what men and women can or cannot do.

Lots of our behaviours are nurtured, doesn't mean it's wrong or has to be changed

That’s true so then let’s drop the pretence that girls are innately drawn to sparkle, nail polish etc and accept that what they are drawn to is girlhood, the specific trappings of which vary according to time and cultures.

In other words, as long as the kid is happy, does it matter if society has influenced them

Absolutely but I would add to that “as long as the kid is happy, free and encouraged to choose their own interests”

I am not knocking Princess culture. Yes I personally hate the plastic aesthetic of it but there is nothing inherently wrong with pink and a lot of the modern princesses have really adapted to the times.

Lessthanaballpark · 22/08/2021 07:36

It's all good as long as they're expressing who they really are. Just let them enjoy expressing themselves.

I think it’s interesting that both sides of the argument both want this for their girls but differ with regards to whether that is what is currently what is happening.

One side think princess culture is allowing girls to express themselves whilst the other side thinks it stifles their freedom to express themselves by being the only thing on offer.

saraclara · 22/08/2021 07:45

I'd much rather my daughter have a muddy, forest party or an art party or something less trite and cliched.

But what does SHE want?

saraclara · 22/08/2021 07:51

it's mainly all about little girls looking pretty, dressing in flouncy dresses, making their hair look pretty etc etc etc

Those same little girls see cosmetic and hair products advertised on the TV every day using beautiful models. They see their mothers choose and try on new clothes to look nice, put on make up and make their hair look good in order to look attractive. Yet you think it's a one off princess party that makes them want to look pretty?

DelphineMarineaux · 22/08/2021 07:57

@bottleitsellit

Just been to a Princess birthday party, my first one. So a women acts as your princess of choice with the wig and outfit and runs the party games instead of the parents. I just feel so sad about how all the girls were gushing over it. I suppose I wasn't brought up with princesses as my mum was very much a tomboy and I have lots of older brothers. My girls have fairies, witches amongst their toys just as my DS has dragons, Harry Potter, but we have really haven't gone with princesses as it's a bit old fashioned, a knight on a horse saving you. Maybe it's just me, they will prob now want princess everything 😬

Why would you teach your daughter that there's something wrong with being girly, feminine and enjoying princessy things? Why should little girls aspire to be more like men, and enjoy more masculine things?

I'd rather teach my daughter to embrace her girliness and feminity, and teach her that there's nothing wrong with being a girl, and everything that comes with it. Whether we like it or not, boys and girls are generally biologically wired to be drawn to certain things. Instead, too many people classify this as "gender stereotypes" and try to change nature and biology. Shame on you. Let your girls be girls and your boys be boys. There's nothing to be proud of in being a tomboy or a boy that "enjoys dolls". It is what it is if that's the case, but it's not better than girls that enjoy dolls and boys that enjoy trucks.

DelphineMarineaux · 22/08/2021 07:57

*femininity
*something wrong

SchrodingersImmigrant · 22/08/2021 08:36

I had barbies. I also had car toys and garages and Merkur toy collection to be envied. I had princess dress, but refused long hair and spent most time in mud covered overalls. I had glittery pencil case in primary, which was usually just used to hit annoying classmates with. Obsession with horses so i got big encyclopedia to flick through and dream about the pretty Palomino, while also reading knowledge magazines for kids and learning how to use axe etc in a forest and thoroughly enjoying it.

Contrary to popular belief, girls can actually manage to have a wide range of things they like.
And one of them can be oprincesses
I hope you all against liking princesses also have your "skin crawl" when boys lay with cars or pretend to be the Hulk🤷🏻 or is it just fluffy and sparkly which isn't ok

SchrodingersImmigrant · 22/08/2021 08:37

The only reason at certain age, why i wasn't living in the pr8ncess dress my mum made, was because it's difficult to climb trees in them.

gobackanddoitproperly · 22/08/2021 08:38

Meh. They grow out of it.

Lessthanaballpark · 22/08/2021 08:48

Why should little girls aspire to be more like men, and enjoy more masculine things?

Define masculine things

smmanf12 · 22/08/2021 08:58

Many women have both elements to their personality don’t they? Sometimes I like to wear a dress, make up, spend a bit longer on my hair. I might do my nails. Sometimes I like jeans and minimal make up. I like going to spas and being pampered, but I also love going to B&Q and choosing paint and wallpaper.

AICM · 22/08/2021 09:12

I've been to one Princess Party. I helped out at a friend's daughter's.

The girls loved it!

One observation. It was so, so ,so important to tell the girls they were pretty. Pretty dress, pretty hair, pretty smile, pretty make up, pretty shoes, pretty nails. Clearly being pretty is an important quality for a girl. These girls desperately needed to be told they were pretty.

I certain the women on Love Island went to a lot of Princess Parties.

If you like them, have them the world won't end. Many girls that went to these are now airline pilots. I'm just stunned that so many women can't see that maybe there is a small connection between the unreasonable beauty standards that grown women are held up to and the vast number of things that influence girls when they are young. Princess Parties are a small cog in a big mechanism.

5128gap · 22/08/2021 09:22

@lazylinguist

Maybe we should be asking why we feel the need to socially condition our children to think that liking such things is wrong.

Who's doing that? Who's saying we should do that? I'm saying we shouldn't deliberately or unthinkingly push our girls towards princessiness, not that we should tell them it's wrong to like it. That we should encourage all kinds of activities abd interests. That we should be aware of our possible inclinations to praise our daughters for being pretty, kind and quiet and our boys for being brave, and assertive. And that we should challenge sexist stereotyping of our children when it occurs in schools etc.

You surely can't think that society is socially conditioning girls to think sparkles, unicorns and princesses are wrong? You only have to go into the girls' clothes dept to see that's not the case!

No, I don't think society is conditioning girls away from these things, I was referring to boys. In your earlier post you state that girls are not biologically predisposed to like princesses and unicorns, its social conditioning. I am suggesting that most children would be predisposed to like these things without any conditioning, as they have appealing characteristics. As boys don't typically like them, and children's preferences according to you, are socially constructed, it would be just as reasonable to assume society had turned boys away from these things that they would otherwise also like, on the basis they are 'for girls' and therefore not worthy of male attention. One is just as reasonable to assume as the other, yet the latter is not seen as a problem because we have internalised the idea that 'feminine' qualities, as embodied by the princess, are inferior. Equalities does not need to be focused on withdrawing the stereotypically feminine and pushing children towards the stereotypically masculine, which in your post above you agree. However, many people are taking a harder line and forbidding their girls the princesses altogether.

grey12 · 22/08/2021 09:23

@AICM tbf if DD1 picks up a rock from the floor and shows me DD2 also wants to do the same. So if someone says one child's hair is pretty, the others want the same treatment.....

There's nothing wrong with saying a child is pretty but it is important not to forget to mention other qualities: that's very clever/kind/careful/attentive/funny......

Wheretoeattweenandteen · 22/08/2021 09:25

Exactly Sara Clara.. It's not 1950s cinderella

MiloAndEddie · 22/08/2021 09:27

Oh god, they are kids! I know very very few (if any!) women who spent their time waiting for a man to ‘rescue’ them even if they did love Cinderella as a kid.

I wouldn’t be handwringing about a 5 year old wanting to be a princess when she grows up.

Wheretoeattweenandteen · 22/08/2021 09:28

Mulan, extremely brave and assertive, a warrior first female warrior.

Merida.. Again brave assertive.. Fighting as well but in many ways.

Frozen.
Brave assertive. Kicks rotten prince's ass.

Moana brave assertive goes on adventure overcomes stuff..

Belle.. Bookish, clever... Brave..

Wheretoeattweenandteen · 22/08/2021 09:33

I've let my dc be free... They have their own interestS and due to how I got toys.. Basically for free in free cycle... We got trains and stuff also..

I brought both girls baby dolls and prams and aside from the pushing element neither would ever get into dolls.

I can lay stuff beforehand them but they find their own way. They went to an extremely Catholic primary school and from age 7 both for different reasons said they don't believe in God.

DrSbaitso · 22/08/2021 09:35

In Snow White's defence, too....she's only 14, an orphan, and she gets taken by a trusted figure to a forest only to discover she's there to be killed. As she's lucky enough that the hired killer can't bring himself to do it (because she is such a sweet person), what can she do but run away?

And then she essentially becomes a SAHM for the dwarves. She's not idle, she contributes.

She was stupid to eat the apple, but again, she was 14...and the witch was using magic anyway so it probably wasn't a free choice.

She's good with her makeup though. www.cosmopolitan.com/uk/entertainment/news/a37936/disney-princesses-without-makeup/

SchrodingersImmigrant · 22/08/2021 09:36

If you want girls to stop liking princess stuff, start giving them the original princess stories.👀

AICM · 22/08/2021 09:36

[quote grey12]@AICM tbf if DD1 picks up a rock from the floor and shows me DD2 also wants to do the same. So if someone says one child's hair is pretty, the others want the same treatment.....

There's nothing wrong with saying a child is pretty but it is important not to forget to mention other qualities: that's very clever/kind/careful/attentive/funny......[/quote]
And if those qualities do get forgotten?

SchrodingersImmigrant · 22/08/2021 09:37

@DrSbaitso 😂