AIBU princess parties is this what we are inspiring our girls to be ?

[bottleitsellit]

Just been to a Princess birthday party, my first one. So a women acts as your princess of choice with the wig and outfit and runs the party games instead of the parents. I just feel so sad about how all the girls were gushing over it. I suppose I wasn't brought up with princesses as my mum was very much a tomboy and I have lots of older brothers. My girls have fairies, witches amongst their toys just as my DS has dragons, Harry Potter, but we have really haven't gone with princesses as it's a bit old fashioned, a knight on a horse saving you. Maybe it's just me, they will prob now want princess everything 😬

I don't like princessy stuff but I dislike sanctimonious, pretentious hand wringers even more. Why is pretending to be a princess bad but Harry Potter good?

I even saw a meme once with some little girls sat dressed as princesses and one girl was dressed as Spider-Man. The caption said ‘in a room full of Elsas, be Spider-Man.’

BOTH ARE FINE

I wish parents would let their children enjoy what they enjoy. My son likes playing with dolls, trains, dinosaurs, princesses etc and guess what? So does my daughter! If never be concerned if she favoured princesses one year or he favoured trains one year.

Honestly it is getting to the stage girls are looked down on for liking princesses but it is so encouraged for boys that some are almost forced. Just let children play with what they like.

My DD had a princess party recently with an Elsa entertainer and the children absolutely loved it, they were so excited. One of the mums has always voiced very strong opinions on princesses - hates them, won’t allow her DDs to dress up as them. They came to the party and looked so happy, and whenever they come round to play the first thing they do is ask to dress up in my DDs princess dresses. I feel quite sad for them that it’s the only time they’re allowed to enjoy playing princesses when they love it so much.

Absolutely not. I didn't like princess stuff, I played with "boys toys" more and "boys games" thankfully we now allow our kids to play with toys....just toys, not girls or boys toys....just toys. I didn't have a boys soul nor did I ever question it.

Of course not. But that was then and this is now. Things have changed. Gender stereotypes have gotten stricter at the same time that children are being taught that they can identify with the opposite sex.

I don’t think it’s healthy to teach your kids that girls like X and boys like Y. Let them discover it for themselves.

I took DS to my friend’s DD’s 4th birthday party a couple of years ago. I went to place our gift on the table with the others and it struck me how every single gift on the table (loads on there - 30+ kids invited and we were one of the last to arrive) was wrapped in princess or fairy-themed wrapping paper. Our wrapping paper had colourful balloons on it and it stood out like a sore thumb. While kids generally like what they like, I do think society, parents and the media do often reinforce stereotypes of girls liking princess things and boys pirates, superheroes etc.

Maybe we should be asking why we feel the need to socially condition our children to think that liking such things is wrong.

Who's doing that? Who's saying we should do that? I'm saying we shouldn't deliberately or unthinkingly push our girls towards princessiness, not that we should tell them it's wrong to like it. That we should encourage all kinds of activities abd interests. That we should be aware of our possible inclinations to praise our daughters for being pretty, kind and quiet and our boys for being brave, and assertive. And that we should challenge sexist stereotyping of our children when it occurs in schools etc.

You surely can't think that society is socially conditioning girls to think sparkles, unicorns and princesses are wrong? You only have to go into the girls' clothes dept to see that's not the case!

Yabu. My DDs have been to and enjoyed princess parties. Neither of them want to be a princess or play princesses or even mention princesses. If you can't enjoy a princess party when you are a child what can you do ffs?

My girls have fairies, witches amongst their toys

Neither of these have a more positive representation of women than princesses to be honest. Fairies tend to be kind, gentle spirits which could encourage girls to buy into the idea they just be kind. Fairies are also portrayed as airheads, ditzy. Witches have historically been portrayed as cruel, ugly, old women. They don’t fit the stereotypical view of a kind hearted, beautiful woman and therefore they must be evil. More recently, I would argue the image of a witch is that of a studious girl who can break the rules (quietly) when the ends justify the means. That’s the bulk of Harry Potter, while the men get to stumble around generally being useless and get praised for saving the day (I’m a Harry Potter fan by the way but aware of the limitations of the book). The other option is the witch gets to be a bit ditzy, a bit clumsy but still generally loveable because she’s trying, means well and is kind (the worst witch and Luna Lovegood spring to mind here).

Just because your children like less mainstream things, doesn’t mean they’re any better for breaking stereotypes.

@lazylinguist

My new thoughts are that kids like what they like

Kids can only like what they're exposed to though. And things that they're encouraged to think are for people like them. Anyone who thinks that the majority of parents are offering princess parties equally to their sons and daughters is kidding themselves. As is anyone who thinks that there's no inequality or further consequences in the fact that boys generally do physical activity-based parties and girls are dressing up as princesses and playing at putting make-up on. I'm not saying the kids don't like these things. I just believe those preferences are largely down to nurture not nature.

Couldn't agree more

Another thing to remember OP is it is one party. If you believe one party lasting at most a few hours, will influence your child more than their upbringing, then you seriously need to evaluate the way you parent and bring them up. I'm assuming you don't genuinely think it is an issue though.

My son wanted to be a carrot aged 2. Should I be worried?

Another thing that is annoying is that boys dressing as princesses is viewed as something to be praised. However girls dressing as princesses is something to be viewed as negative. Equally boys dressing as male superheroes is viewed as something positive. Whereas girls dressing in this way are viewed as neutral at best.

YABU. I think all kids go through a princess phase.

I deliberately raised my girls to be (for want of a better word!) gender neutral. I steered clear of the pink sparkly toys, dressed them in red and blue, bought them toy cars and meccano sets. I was horrified when my DMIL bought them toy ironing boards and dolls!

I remember when my eldest was only a toddler and she saw a picture of Snow-white on a restaurant menu - Pwincess! she declared. I was horrified! Who taught her that word?

Anyway, despite my intervention they loved all things pink, sparkly and sequinned! As did my son when he came along - a pair of fairy wings and he was delighted!

It didn’t last. One of my daughters chopped her hair into a pixie cut and the other only wore clothes from the boys’ section until she was 14.

It’s really not a big deal.

Let little girls have their fun whilst they can. It won't be long before they are bogged down by wifework, screaming babies and selfish men. Give them ALL the sequins!

Meh, no harm in some little girls wanting to pretend to be a princess. Princesses are the star of their story, they get the best clothes, they're special. I wouldn't push princesses on girls as an interest, but if they like it, it's not a problem.

Being a tomboy isn't better than being a "princess girl". Why not leave it up to the child? And if someone does steer their daughter toward princesses rather than something else, so what? As long as they ultimately allow their child to herself with her own interests, there's nothing wrong with choosing some early toys, clothes, and decor on the theme that the parent likes. No parent is completely neutral, anyway, however well-intentioned or enlightened they think they are.

@InTheNightWeWillWish

My girls have fairies, witches amongst their toys

Neither of these have a more positive representation of women than princesses to be honest. Fairies tend to be kind, gentle spirits which could encourage girls to buy into the idea they just be kind. Fairies are also portrayed as airheads, ditzy. Witches have historically been portrayed as cruel, ugly, old women. They don’t fit the stereotypical view of a kind hearted, beautiful woman and therefore they must be evil. More recently, I would argue the image of a witch is that of a studious girl who can break the rules (quietly) when the ends justify the means. That’s the bulk of Harry Potter, while the men get to stumble around generally being useless and get praised for saving the day (I’m a Harry Potter fan by the way but aware of the limitations of the book). The other option is the witch gets to be a bit ditzy, a bit clumsy but still generally loveable because she’s trying, means well and is kind (the worst witch and Luna Lovegood spring to mind here).

Just because your children like less mainstream things, doesn’t mean they’re any better for breaking stereotypes.

Be fair. All the characters in Harry Potter had flaws and limitations. That's one reason why the books are so good. Luna clearly got her loopiness from her father, if anything he was ditzier than she was. The most stereotypical female character was Mrs Weasley, and she ruled her family and killed Bellatrix. And Hermione got loads of praise for being so able.

Why not leave it up to the child? And if someone does steer their daughter toward princesses rather than something else, so what? As long as they ultimately allow their child to herself with her own interests, there's nothing wrong with choosing some early toys, clothes, and decor on the theme that the parent likes.

This post is full of contradictions. Let the child choose what they want? Steer them to what the parents like?

It’s all very well to say the child will ultimately choose what they like, but how do they know what they like if it’s not a real option for them? Besides children sense what their parents want them to like and act accordingly.

What we should want for our kids is real choice. Not the fake choice to choose between a limited number of options.

The most stereotypical female character was Mrs Weasley, and she ruled her family and killed Bellatrix. And Hermione got loads of praise for being so able.

It would be nice if girls didn’t have to be so able all the time.

I think you need to update your idea of princesses. They do a lot more than be rescued these days..

@Lessthanaballpark

The most stereotypical female character was Mrs Weasley, and she ruled her family and killed Bellatrix. And Hermione got loads of praise for being so able.

It would be nice if girls didn’t have to be so able all the time.

So we complain when they're passive and the boys do everything, and we complain when they're heroic and save the day. How exactly are we supposed to write women?

@Lessthanaballpark

Why not leave it up to the child? And if someone does steer their daughter toward princesses rather than something else, so what? As long as they ultimately allow their child to herself with her own interests, there's nothing wrong with choosing some early toys, clothes, and decor on the theme that the parent likes.

This post is full of contradictions. Let the child choose what they want? Steer them to what the parents like?

It’s all very well to say the child will ultimately choose what they like, but how do they know what they like if it’s not a real option for them? Besides children sense what their parents want them to like and act accordingly.

What we should want for our kids is real choice. Not the fake choice to choose between a limited number of options.

I don't think what they said is contradictory. Basically do what we can to avoid stereotypes but you can never avoid that influence 100%

If a parent buys princess dresses for their daughter at Christmas, what does it really matter? If the child likes the toy, it's not harming them in and of itself. Parents mostly do buy gendered toys. As long as the child is allowed to pick the opposite gendered toy if they choose it's no big deal

Lots of our behaviours are nurtured, doesn't mean it's wrong or has to be changed

In other words, as long as the kid is happy, does it matter if society has influenced them

I'm a feminist. My DD loved princesses, barbies and fairies and all that girlie stuff when she was young. She's now 21 and a bold and brave feminist. I couldn't suppress it shaker her tastes nor should I. She was infused by the cultural interests she was surrounded by but she made up her own mind in the end.

Let it be.

YANBU
I cannot stand Princess parties or, as they get a bit older, Pamper parties. I find the whole thing really quite sexist and I don't encourage them at all. My daughter has never had play makeup or any of that nonsense but has be bought god awful princess dresses by relatives that make my skin crawl. I'd much rather she dressed up as some kick-ass heroine who doesn't rely on any man that most of the sexist Disneyesque tripe!!!!

Isn't this just a way to sell you something? You extra pay for what would normally be just a birthday party. It seems that this the way to go now. Jacqueline Jossa has these very girly-themed parties with make-up and nail bar stuff around for the girls to play with. See Daily Mail for more info.

@purplebatbear

YANBU I cannot stand Princess parties or, as they get a bit older, Pamper parties. I find the whole thing really quite sexist and I don't encourage them at all. My daughter has never had play makeup or any of that nonsense but has be bought god awful princess dresses by relatives that make my skin crawl. I'd much rather she dressed up as some kick-ass heroine who doesn't rely on any man that most of the sexist Disneyesque tripe!!!!

Makes your skin crawl? Bit dramatic

Also Elsa, Merida and Moana don’t get romantically involved with anyone. Belle turned down Gaston and went to rescue her dad, and Tiana worked her butt off to afford her own restaurant. Not sure if Mulan is classed as a Disney princess but she literally ran away to fight a war by pretending to be a man. It’s just not true to say that they’re all sat about waiting to be rescued by a man.

I suspect that our girls are more affected by seeing the important adult women in their lives wear makeup and spend more time on beauty and fashion than their dads. (I'm not saying that all women spend more time on grooming than males or that children live with a mum and dad)

I understand that the standards for grooming is higher when you're a woman but the only people who can end that are grown up women. Men can just wear a suit where as women generally have work clothes in various colours and styles and have to spend extra time and effort doing hair and makeup to simply look what is considered professional. Look at the sort of clothes women wear to get married. A wedding dress is peak princess and I'd understand why little girls think that they want that too. (Luckily ime most girls move away from that pretty quickly )