Is she spoilt or am I shit mum?

[ojss21]

I've NC for this but I'm a regular poster.

My teen dd(15) has started to be quite challenging recently, and I we usually have quite a good relationship, but I've been a single mum to her for most of her life and up until 5 months ago she was an only child, so I tend to be lenient with her at times and struggle to determine whether her behaviour is spoilt or if I'm a shit mum (if that makes sense).

Here's some examples of her recent gripes / reasons for being annoyed with me :

1. I "only" gave her £100 cash for her 15th birthday plus a few cheaper things to open like chocolates. The main present was the cash and I've always done this for the past few years given her age as it's easier for her to choose her own stuff, I find. She complained for two reasons- firstly, it's not as much as I spent on her 5 month old sister's new car seat which cost £250 (clearly the baby needed that and it's not really comparable), and secondly because she wanted more things to open on the day (despite £100 cash being her main present and also a stretch for me anyway at the moment with being on maternity leave).

1. We are going away for a few nights this weekend (in the U.K.) and we were originally due to come back on Tuesday. We have extended to Wednesday as we plan to make a detour on the drive back to stay overnight with my sister who is going through a really shitty and scary time at the moment (don't want to go into details but it's health related and potentially very serious). My DD's response at this unexpected detour to her aunty's was "great, that ruins my plans to see my friends on that day as I thought we were coming back the night before. Wish I'd never agreed to come with you now". And off she stropped to her bedroom. This is an aunty who she is very close to, by the way, and is aware of her health complications currently. Dd has also had several days out and sleepovers with her friends this summer hols and I admit it slipped my mind she had planned this outing with them when I arranged to stay away from home an extra night with my sister.

So.... is my DD spoilt, or am I a bad mum for "only" giving her £100 for her birthday and for inadvertently ruining her day out with her mates? This is a genuine question, by the way. I struggle to gain perspective with her sometimes and she makes me feel guilty for my decisions. It's been harder since the baby was born as I feel I'm ploughing so much time and energy into the little one that I'm almost neglecting the eldest, so I do need some outside perspectives!

Thank you.

Does it have isofix attached and is it suitable for pre teen age too?

🤣 please come back in 12 years time and let us know how you get on with putting your pre teen in this car seat!

*againreallyplase
What do you mean you can't afford it on maternity leave? What is your dp contributing?

It would feel shit for her to not have money spent so equally. $250 is available for baby but not for her.* 

You can’t be serious? Having to buy a necessity like a baby’s car seat and giving your other much older child a pretty large sum of money (at that age) for their birthday is not something that’s comparable at all.

She's 15. To her it is.

And op if you can't afford things because you're on maternity leave caring for the baby you and your dp have together then yes he should be contributing to her gifts.

One day I think I’ll do AIBU to buy a cheap car seat so my teenager can have £300 birthday money and see the reactions. You really can’t do right for doing wrong on here, sometimes!

OP. I would not worry. Yes, she’s being a teenager. I think a lot of the times with teens they can put heavy emphasis on actions without understanding nuance. When I was at university, I had friends who’s mums would regularly do food shops for them. My dad (mum had died by then) never did and I used to feel sad about that. The daft thing was my dad was probably far more financially generous than others were! Really, I was just missing my mum.

She’ll come round

The point being my "uncaring" DP held the whole family up at this time. He was everyone's rock. He's just exasperated with DD's attitude right now, as am I

OP it's interesting what you've focused on in your responses -
Defending the car seat
Defending DP
The money and who spends what on whom
Your DD's social life and the detour

But nowhere are you responding to the many posters pointing out that her life has just been turned upside by the arrival of a small baby half-sibling, and how that must make her feel, and how those feelings are no doubt impacting on her behaviour.

Have you addressed this with her? Have you talked about the baby and how she's feeling?

It seems like this is the huge elephant in the room you don't want to look at here?

It's not about the money, it's what that represents to her. You are not a bad mum, but she's not spoilt either, and in many ways her behaviour is entirely understandable for a 15 year old in her situation tbh.

I'm also guessing your partner is still working so he should have paid for the full car seat so you had more for dds birthday, or put some money towards her birthday.

@PawPawPaw

Is it not £125 from you for the car seat OP and your DP pays the remaining £125?

Exactly

@Velcropaws
Lovely and very helpful post, thank you!

This is no one's "fault'. She is a typical selfish and self obsessed teen and it's exacerbated by the fact that she suddenly has to share you with a sister. A sister she undoubtedly loves but is also (probably) massively jealous of. Not just because she is taking up your time and attention but because she gets to live with both her parents fulltime. That's a lot for her to juggle and it won't be helped if you make it all about you and start dramatising 'oh, I must be an awful mum to have raised such a terrible child'.

Tell your DP to watch what he says because it won't be long until his precious little daughter is also a stroppy teen.

Seriously, you sound like a great mum. Carry on as you are, loving your daughter and trying to establish the tricky balance between unconditional love and setting appropriate boundaries.

One thing that might help is to sit down and have a proper conversation with her about money. Instead of doling out (very generous) amounts of cash in bits and pieces throughout the month discuss a regular monthly allowance to be paid into a bank or BS. Establish exactly what it will cover (for my DDs it was clothes except school uniform, toiletries, birthday presents for friends and family, snacks, hairdos and beauty treatments, going out with their mates and also saving for big items so pretty much everything). Establish that it is theirs to budget and run as they choose, no questions asked but when it's gone, it's gone and there will be no top ups until the following month. That will have the double benefit of helping her learn to budget young and also managing her financial expectations. It also relieved me of the burden of clothes shopping with them!!

It sounds like your DD is feeling pushed out at the arrival of a new baby after so long of it being just her. That's a lot of adjustment at 15.
The comments comparing to the car seat, she is directly comparing amounts and, equating that to love - particularly with saying about not having much to open on the day. I think she's got it into her head that few presents to open means not much effort has been made.....because of the baby
I'm in no way suggesting that is the case but i csn see that is how her teenage brain is thinking

So i don't think your DD is spoilt. On the contrary i think she prob needs spoiling a bit - not with stuff but with some one on one time doing something nice together if at all possible

@Houseplantophile

There are some really good articles about what’s going on in a teenager’s brain during their teenage years. It’s one of the biggest developmental milestones for them as the brain is changing and maturing. I can’t find the article I found a few years ago but it really helped me to look back on my very difficult and awkward teenage years and understand why I struggled so much feelings being all over the place.. happy/depressed/angry/defensive…

Knowing there’s a reason why they can’t control their behaviours all the time helps!!

This doesn’t mean they aren’t disciplined when they behaviour is unacceptable but it does mean you can look forward to a time when they will naturally revert to a more balanced and easier person to be around.

It sounds like she has a busy life and you involve her in everything.. I often think that it’s a particularly hard age for young women when they’re trying to manage that journey from ‘kid’ to ‘adult’- they feel like they’re not kids anymore but still get treated like kids (ie her plans being messed up by the detour). They’re also not adults yet but occasionally get included in more adult conversations/activities…
It’s a very hard thing to manage to not crush their character but to help them navigate that change.

Also- and finally cos I didn’t mean this to get so long- I absolutely disagree that apologising to your kids is a sign of weakness or suggests to that child that they’re being rewarded for their behaviour..
As adults and parents we still make mistakes and they impact our kids… their way of telling us that may not be ideal but they’re kids.. we’re the adults. We need to lead by example and show how healthy relationships work… apologising doesn’t necessarily mean you change your plans but it does show that you’ve acknowledged their feelings.
One of my strongest memories as a child was my mum apologising to me and it genuinely helped me to be able to apologise to others in the future.

Good luck. It’s not you and it’s not her.. it’s hormones (both of you probably!!) it’s stress, it’s uncertainty, maybe a bit of jealousy… it’s a difficult time and will need grace from all sides.

(Also.. sorry.. who cares how much you spent on a car seat.. it wasn’t a gift, it was a necessity.. does she count you buying her pants, socks, sanitary items as gifts?!)

Another very helpful post, thank you.

@ineedsun

She’s also 15.

(Before everyone piles on saying NAFYOALT, and their daughter is amazing, they’re not always, but they can be really selfish. As others have said, her nose is also out of joint because of the new baby)

What's NAFYOALT

Mix of sibling rivalry and teenage self absorption.

You can calmly point out that its the most cost effective car seat and that she has had far more money spent on her in recent months than the baby and ask if she would want her baby sibling to go without so that she can have a bigger party but you might as well talk to a blank wall.

You are doing the right thing keeping the disagreement between you and DD. If DP doesn't have a teen himself then he won't have seen this behaviour first hand and know they grow out of it.

She will grow out of it, best you can do is try to stay calm, roll your eyes and let the more ridiculous comments wash over you and make sure she knows that you love her anyway, you just don't have as much money to spare for now.

Where is her DF in all this? Why doesn't he contribute to her birthdays etc?

@Iminaglasscaseofemotion

Does it have isofix attached and is it suitable for pre teen age too?

🤣 please come back in 12 years time and let us know how you get on with putting your pre teen in this car seat!

😂 yes, well, having a 15 yo I do know this is highly unlikely to happen. But I was making the point that this is why the seat is so expensive

£100 and presents to open is fine.

Her attitude toward its is not.

But that doesn't make you a shit mum or her spoilt.

Just tell her if cash isn't acceptable anymore you'll choose a few gifts for her and not give cash anymore.

It isn't even about the car seat but if you need to point out that she had these things as a baby too!

NAFYOALT not all fifteen years olds are like that

This is basically what I said last night. And she stropped off
That's what they do. That doesn't mean that deep inside she doesn't agree that you are right and know that she is being a brat. Teenagers just have no mute mode to their feelings. What they feel at that moment is what you see, but they can feel totally differently 1h later. My DS also told me once that he took his frustrations on me because it was safe. He knew that I would still love him so it was easier to let it out with me. However, in quieter and more peaceful times, he told me that I was a fantastic mums and totally deserved when I told him off.

You have to let go of the way they make you feel when they talk to you like you are the worse parent ever and act trusting your judgement. You don't stop disciplining kids when they are teenagers, you do it differently, but you still rules the roost, not them. It gets easier as they get older, and then suddenly, they totally turn around and can't stop telling you what a fab mum you are.

As for the whole jealousy of the baby, it's possible. Do consider how much time you might have for her and whether she is indirectly reacting to this. You might need to make more effort to give her more time. However, it shouldn't stop you telling her that she is ungrateful when she is, or that she needs to show more respect and care when she fails to do so.

Ask if her friends can rearrange for the next day? Or later on that day? She can't be the only 15 yo with families that have other plans! Her friends will understand that her auntie is unexpectedly ill. She can also take a train or a bus as PP have said.

You are in a difficult position OP. My DD was 7 when her baby brother was born and she reacted in a similar way - she also felt left out, as caring for a baby obvs I was less available for her.

Ask her what her ideal resolution for this would be.

Your DP could drive her home and leave you at your sister's and you get the train the next day.

@BabylonDreams

The point being my "uncaring" DP held the whole family up at this time. He was everyone's rock. He's just exasperated with DD's attitude right now, as am I

OP it's interesting what you've focused on in your responses -
Defending the car seat
Defending DP
The money and who spends what on whom
Your DD's social life and the detour

But nowhere are you responding to the many posters pointing out that her life has just been turned upside by the arrival of a small baby half-sibling, and how that must make her feel, and how those feelings are no doubt impacting on her behaviour.

Have you addressed this with her? Have you talked about the baby and how she's feeling?

It seems like this is the huge elephant in the room you don't want to look at here?

It's not about the money, it's what that represents to her. You are not a bad mum, but she's not spoilt either, and in many ways her behaviour is entirely understandable for a 15 year old in her situation tbh.

I haven't yet responded to those points because they are quite possibly the most important and pertinent points that I need to think about and reflect on, in terms of how I am going to approach this with her to be a better more thoughtful mum to her.

I have responded to the points you have highlighted because they are the quickest and easiest points to respond to.

How I respond to those suggesting my dd feels pushed out, requires more careful thought and some emotional processing as I find that quite upsetting that she might feel that way.

Just because I haven't yet responded to that, doesn't mean I haven't clocked it as important.

*it won't be helped if you make it all about you and start dramatising 'oh, I must be an awful mum to have raised such a terrible child'.
*

Literally nowhere are these my words

@madroid

Did you discuss the change of plans with her before you chnged them? If not, that's quite rude and dismissive of any plans she'd made of her own.

That's because a teens socialising is not equal in importance to visiting a potentially seriously ill sister, is it? @SixesAndEights

But just announcing a change of plan is still rude whether the reason for doing so is more important or not isn't it?

Acknowledging that it might impact on someone else's plans is surely just being polite.

There's a big difference between "Your aunts ill, so we're staying till Wednesday" and "I'm really sorry if you've made plans for Tuesday night, I understand they're important, but your aunt's ill so we're going to have to stay over another night."

One thing that might help is to sit down and have a proper conversation with her about money. Instead of doling out (very generous) amounts of cash in bits and pieces throughout the month discuss a regular monthly allowance to be paid into a bank or BS. Establish exactly what it will cover (for my DDs it was clothes except school uniform, toiletries, birthday presents for friends and family, snacks, hairdos and beauty treatments, going out with their mates and also saving for big items so pretty much everything). Establish that it is theirs to budget and run as they choose, no questions asked but when it's gone, it's gone and there will be no top ups until the following month. That will have the double benefit of helping her learn to budget young and also managing her financial expectations. It also relieved me of the burden of clothes shopping with them!!

Great idea and I have considered something similar recently when I was losing track of how much cash I was doling out!

Where is her DF in all this? Why doesn't he contribute to her birthdays etc?

He does. I said earlier on he has given her cash too towards a new iPhone that she wants

I'd say she's a teenager, and they are meant to be horrible

Just ignore bad behavior (obviously to a level) and reward good behavior
(Like a toddler)

She might also feel left out. The babies got two parents in one home it’s a family unit that she may feel left out of especially if she’s not close with your partner and her dad isn’t there much. She probably feels it’s a new family she’s not 100% part of and the moneys more of a symbol for that to her. I don’t think your a bad mum though no way

Sit down and talk to her like an adult. Explain the money side of things and how babies are expensive just as she was expensive when she was a baby. I'd tell how hurt you were when she was she was obviously upset about the birthday money and ask her to explain how she's feeling if she can. Don't be negative or accuse her of anything- just try and open an adult dialogue. It might not work at once but hopefully you'll get there.