Is she spoilt or am I shit mum?

[ojss21]

I've NC for this but I'm a regular poster.

My teen dd(15) has started to be quite challenging recently, and I we usually have quite a good relationship, but I've been a single mum to her for most of her life and up until 5 months ago she was an only child, so I tend to be lenient with her at times and struggle to determine whether her behaviour is spoilt or if I'm a shit mum (if that makes sense).

Here's some examples of her recent gripes / reasons for being annoyed with me :

1. I "only" gave her £100 cash for her 15th birthday plus a few cheaper things to open like chocolates. The main present was the cash and I've always done this for the past few years given her age as it's easier for her to choose her own stuff, I find. She complained for two reasons- firstly, it's not as much as I spent on her 5 month old sister's new car seat which cost £250 (clearly the baby needed that and it's not really comparable), and secondly because she wanted more things to open on the day (despite £100 cash being her main present and also a stretch for me anyway at the moment with being on maternity leave).

1. We are going away for a few nights this weekend (in the U.K.) and we were originally due to come back on Tuesday. We have extended to Wednesday as we plan to make a detour on the drive back to stay overnight with my sister who is going through a really shitty and scary time at the moment (don't want to go into details but it's health related and potentially very serious). My DD's response at this unexpected detour to her aunty's was "great, that ruins my plans to see my friends on that day as I thought we were coming back the night before. Wish I'd never agreed to come with you now". And off she stropped to her bedroom. This is an aunty who she is very close to, by the way, and is aware of her health complications currently. Dd has also had several days out and sleepovers with her friends this summer hols and I admit it slipped my mind she had planned this outing with them when I arranged to stay away from home an extra night with my sister.

So.... is my DD spoilt, or am I a bad mum for "only" giving her £100 for her birthday and for inadvertently ruining her day out with her mates? This is a genuine question, by the way. I struggle to gain perspective with her sometimes and she makes me feel guilty for my decisions. It's been harder since the baby was born as I feel I'm ploughing so much time and energy into the little one that I'm almost neglecting the eldest, so I do need some outside perspectives!

Thank you.

OP, why don't you add up 15 years of expenditure on your daughter on these essentials and make sure you get something appropriately expensive for the baby?

It would be one bloody expensive item! I'm talking tens of thousands most probably.

My goodness, was OP supposed to buy her teenager a new crib and pram etc too?
Sorry but a wee lesson in reality wouldn't go amiss if that's the case.

• children don't get to choose if they have siblings or not
• children need to learn that if they have a sibling then their parents resources will have to be shared, they aren't more or less important than any other child their mother may bear
• needs come before wants
• budgeting is a thing
• sometimes it's not about them, it's about someone else ie. New baby gets a gift but you don't because it's not your birthday yet

Sounds like she is pushing boundaries, like kids if any age do when a new sibling arrives. Your boundary needs to be you don't accept her being ungrateful and rude about the money/birthday presents. If she wants to talk about it fine but no need for rudeness as you'll happily take it back. If she brings up the car seat thing remind her that you've always provided her with everything she needs including her own car seat. The money is a GIFT.

Also discuss the detour to her aunties house and tell you you hope she understands. Friends are wveurrh4 at that age so be understanding of her disappointment and apologetic that you forgot about her plan. However, her anibtu is the priority at the moment and she needs to try to be understanding of that. That is your second boundary.

Keep communication open, offer reassurance and remember she is just a kid checking whether you are still going to be there when she's being a pain in the bum. Which of course you are because you are a good mum xx

So many typos sorry. Hope it vaguely makes sense

@ojss21

And let’s not pretend the £250 on the car seat is the only new baby purchase… you’ll have needed a crib, pram, clothes, all that other stuff, plus the new baby will have been showered with presents when she was born

Well I don't think I have "pretended" this. The car seat is the relevant item for this thread because it's the one DD happened to make a comparison with. Yes the baby has needed a lot of money spent on her. But so has my DD over the past 15 years. I'm spending no more or less on the baby than I would have done on her at the same stage had my financial circumstances back then been as they are now.

I will say that for baby clothes we have mostly used Facebook marketplace for second hand bundles as I know how quickly they grow out of them. Whereas when my eldest needs new clothes she obviously has brand new stuff.

The gift thing when baby was born can't be helped - of course new babies are showered with family gifts. As was my DD back then. In fact I'd argue she was more so, because she had (and still very much has) input from paternal grandparents, whereas my youngest DD has only my family.

I get that completely, and while she’s focussed her resentment on the car seat, this is just the “thing” that coincides with her birthday. She will have noticed all the other “things” being bought while you were pregnant and when baby was born as well and it all adds up. She probably isn’t pragmatic enough to consider how different your financial circumstances were when she was little, or to remember all stuff you’ve bought her throughout her childhood and she certainly won’t remember all the gifts she got as a baby, whereas she got to watch the new baby being celebrated by people who probably don’t bother much with her (colleagues etc, maybe your DP’s extended family) just five months ago. Teens focus on the here and now and all she sees is all the things being bought for the baby, all the attention being given to the baby, all the adjustments to day to day life being made for the baby, while she gets less time, less attention and less money/fewer presents.

@AngeloMysterioso

I do understand the sentiment of what you're saying, and yes it must be hard for her to see that when she has no concept of everything that's been spent on her (time, money, and energy wise) over the years of her life. Just to highlight, though, that DP's extended family definitely haven't been involved in "celebrating" the baby. They aren't actively interested at all. It's very sad and it's a topic for a different thread. But my DD definitely hasn't seen any of that. She will only be aware of the fuss made my own family - who equally make a fuss over her, too. As do her Dad's family as I've said. So she's not short of people fussing over her and making time for her, iyswim. In fact my sister (the unwell aunty) is one of her closest relationships in the extended family, hence my upset at her not seeming to respond to the need for the overnight stay (anyway that particular issue is resolved now). I think my point is that, in many ways, she has so much love around her from so many people. It just seems not enough for her right now somehow. Maybe it's my time and focus she's missing. I get that. It's just hard when a little one demands so much of me. I will endeavour to carve out time for just me and her when baby is with DP though. I think that's a good idea and it's something I've been missing recently, too.

God, poor kid. All this focus on money. You’re so defensive. Just accept that she’s feeling shit right now.

It’s shit being a teen; she’ll have epic drama and insecurity and strong feelz going on all over the place which she couldn’t even articulate to you if she wanted to (which obvs she doesn’t because one of the things about teens is their suddenly discovered and intense need for privacy). Then there’s a new sibling in the mix. Her father sounds pretty emotionally unavailable. And her mum is run ragged with caring for other people - it sounds like you have a good foundation to your relationship but she won’t be unaware of all these other things pulling at you (indeed, you’ve already said on this thread that you feel you get no time to yourself - teens do pick up on these vibes and she sounds like a nice caring girl in general).

So - from her point of view - she’s probably feeling rather on her own. More lonely than she’s used to. And as an only child growing up, it’s very tough at this relatively late stage to adjust to the idea of sharing mum. Late onset sibling rivalry is particularly tough.

You sound like a caring parent OP and so I’m sorry if what I’m about to say feels to you like yet another person putting the boot in. But here goes anyway: knock it off with the defensive stance. Your daughter has lost something meaningful recently, her life has changed without her consent and she’s struggling. And that is on top of all the Covid related difficulties which kids have had to deal with - who knows, maybe she might have handled it all much better if she’d been in school and so on for the last 18 months. But she hasn’t. And coincidentally it has been a time of big change at home. It’s all quite scary. But she is probably feeling like she’s too big to be scared. And judging by your attitude on this thread, you have massively underestimated the impact on her of your personal choices and so the message she has got from you is probably not to make a fuss; she’ll feel her emotions being downplayed, she’s learning that trying to express her feelings will be dismissed as ‘over reaction’ and so on. This is all really damaging for her longterm mental health and emotional resilience. Whether you agree with her or not (and really, it’s not up to anyone else to ‘agree’ with someone’s feelings - if that’s how they feel, then that’s how they feel - it has to be acknowledged), just try and help her to learn to accept those feelings, sit with those feelings, cope with those feelings. Don’t dismiss and downplay and embarrass her about her feelings. It is the recipe for a lifetime of emotional dysfunction.

Your job as a parent is to help her through her teenage years, learning how to recognise and process and express her emotions. That’s your job.

@SimonedeBeauvoirscat

Wow I don't even know where to start with the number of assumptions you've made there! Father emotionally unavailable, me downplaying her emotions. Crikey.

Don’t dismiss and downplay and embarrass her about her feelings.

I haven't

Your job as a parent is to help her through her teenage years, learning how to recognise and process and express her emotions. That’s your job.

And what makes you so sure I don't do this? Incidentally this is one of my jobs. Caring for a baby is another. I'm spinning a few plates so apologies for not being the perfect parent every time!

Your post was so condescending.

Finally @SimonedeBeauvoirscat
"All this focus on money" is precisely because that's what she raised with me! Hence the focus of the thread. I couldn't give a shiny shit about money and who has what spent on them so long as both my girls are happy and healthy and we aren't in financial ruin. But my dd has approached me with an issue about money - her words were "wow she gets £250 on a car seat and I only her £100 birthday money". If they were her words, that's all I have to go on right now, isn't it, until I am able to get to the bottom of what the real issues are.

If you can’t see that what she’s trying to say to you is not about the money, then I don’t think anyone can help you.

I think most kids would be put out if they fully understood that the resources allocated to them were being reduced by their parents’ choice to have another child - it just so happens that most people have their subsequent children when the older is too young to fully understand the implications and by the time they’re old enough they’re used to it.

I do think you sound quite defensive of/impressed by your boyfriend in a way I would find grating if I was your daughter - e.g. describing him as her ‘rock’ while you had pregnancy sickness, repeated mentions of how he’s going to drive her back from your sister’s - I’d have wanted you to think of that solution before coming up with the idea that my plans just get cancelled; I agree with her that that was unfair and it wasn’t spoiled of her to say so. I’m interested in why you say you’re the one person who consistently doesn’t get your needs met; why is that? And could you be projecting that expectation onto your daughter a bit? (I’m not suggesting you don’t meet her needs, you clearly do - although currently not, it sounds like, her need for plenty of her mum’s time and attention, and that’s probably the most crucial one at her age.) But no one thanks a mother who consistently puts herself bottom of the list, and they don’t volunteer to put themselves there instead to save her from that choice. If you’re struggling for time to spend on yourself or with your older daughter because you’re focused on the baby, hand the baby to her father, have a long shower and take your older daughter out for a Starbucks.

@SimonedeBeauvoirscat

If you can’t see that what she’s trying to say to you is not about the money, then I don’t think anyone can help you.

I've had multiple people give me their views on this thread about what might be underpinning it, and I've been trying to mull it all over all day whilst also caring for a baby. But your post stood out as particularly condescending and adds nothing above and beyond what's already been said IMO.

A 15 year old cant get much -other than fast fashion - with £100.
She's 15, they can be self-centred, try to let it go.

I’m not interested in fighting with you OP. If you didn’t find it added anything then pass on by; tbh given the huge amount of advice you’ve been given I had expected my remarks would be just another drop in the ocean. Clearly they’ve hit a nerve for some reason though. Perhaps reflect on why that is?

I wish your daughter good luck for her future, hopefully it is bright.

@ojss21

Finally *@SimonedeBeauvoirscat* "All this focus on money" is precisely because that's what she raised with me! Hence the focus of the thread. I couldn't give a shiny shit about money and who has what spent on them so long as both my girls are happy and healthy and we aren't in financial ruin. But my dd has approached me with an issue about money - her words were "wow she gets £250 on a car seat and I only her £100 birthday money". If they were her words, that's all I have to go on right now, isn't it, until I am able to get to the bottom of what the real issues are.

Can't you see that's not about the money!!!!!!! That's just a peg to hang her feelings of insecurity and upset on .

If they were her words, that's all I have to go on right now, isn't it, until I am able to get to the bottom of what the real issues are.

OP a poster asked you further up thread about how much 1-1 time you've had with your eldest since the baby was born. It sounds like it's been a really difficult year with you being ill, Covid, a new baby and now your sisters illness, so i'm guessing it's been difficult to find time for just the 2 of you. Whilst things can't go back to how they were, I think it's really clear she's crying out for some mum and daughter time.

I think it's too much Tik Tok and Insta. They seem to be under illusion that everyone is 'unboxing Chanel and Fendi'.
It's just a stage. I can remember being horrible to my mum about a present she gave me and 35 years later I still feel embarrassed about it.

@MiddleParking

My needs are consistently last because I have a small baby, no local family help, and no input from DP's family to help. I'm literally run ragged every day trying to balance caring for a baby and meeting the needs of a teen (clearly I'm failing at the latter).

I described DP as my rock because that's how it is from my POV. It's not terminology I would use to describe him to my daughter. It's just how it was my perspective. The household would have sunk without him back then because I was bedridden and hospitalised at points.

I've mentioned him driving her back from my sisters because that's relevant to point number 2 in my OP and it's a resolution to that issue. I don't see why I'm being criticised for mentioning that.

@SimonedeBeauvoirscat

I’m not interested in fighting with you OP. If you didn’t find it added anything then pass on by; tbh given the huge amount of advice you’ve been given I had expected my remarks would be just another drop in the ocean. Clearly they’ve hit a nerve for some reason though. Perhaps reflect on why that is?

I wish your daughter good luck for her future, hopefully it is bright.

I have reflected on why that is. It's because you came across as condescending.

@Whinge

If they were her words, that's all I have to go on right now, isn't it, until I am able to get to the bottom of what the real issues are.

OP a poster asked you further up thread about how much 1-1 time you've had with your eldest since the baby was born. It sounds like it's been a really difficult year with you being ill, Covid, a new baby and now your sisters illness, so i'm guessing it's been difficult to find time for just the 2 of you. Whilst things can't go back to how they were, I think it's really clear she's crying out for some mum and daughter time.

I answered this many posts ago earlier this afternoon. I'll repeat my answer. Not much 1:1 time recently and we both miss it. There is a plan for this to happen in the coming weeks when baby will be in DP's care

Can't you see that's not about the money!!!!!!! That's just a peg to hang her feelings of insecurity and upset on .

If you'd bothered to read my 100 plus posts on this thread, you'd see that I have clearly considered that she may be missing my time and attention, yes.

I love how posters are so critical of me appearing defensive on a thread where I have literally been called selfish for daring to have another baby and accused of viewing my teen dd as a "convenient babysitter". Yeah. Because no one would be defensive after dealing with that shit for most of the day. 😂

I have reflected on why that is. It's because you came across as condescending.

I agree 💯 OP.

@SimonedeBeauvoirscat your posts were incredibly rude & condescending, along with a number of others on the thread.

Opinions & viewpoints, fine; but sweeping generalisations about the OP's relationship with her DD, no.

In terms of saying OP isn't responding or taking on board poster's comments, nothing could be less true. She has acknowledged multiple points & continued to post - one of the most prolific OP's I've seen.