AIBU - employee always booking appointments during the work day

[Glitttter]

I am a small business owner with 3 members of staff. We've been working remotely like so many other people. 2 of them are brilliant, dedicated etc. the third woman just seems not to pull her weight, which might be the basis of why Im annoyed. However, recently, she keeps needing to start work late, disappear in the day, or leave early, for dentist/eye test/routine check up appointments.

My gripe is that she works part time, but always seems to arrange these routine appointments for days when she's working. AIBU to expect her to arrange appointments in her own time - at least mostly - instead of missing work to do so?

Is she attending job interviews instead maybe?

I have a chronic condition that I’ve always needed regular GP & hospital appointment for. I worked full time until I had DD then went part time for a couple of years, then full time again. I always took appointments on my normal days off, took a couple of hours annual leave, or made them at the beginning/end of the day & made the time up by working extra hours. I think the only occasions I ever just “took time off” was for antenatal appointments, I was in my last job 13 years.

@BrilloPaddy

They start and finish early, so each day allows them at least an hour during working hours at the end of the day for appointments including emergencies. Of course, some are unavoidable and we'll work round those.

Like the OP, there are certain people who will take advantage. We've got 1 staff member whose DW doesn't speak English well and since they've had a baby, the requests for GP/HV/hospital etc had got beyond a joke. It was impacting workflow and morale.

You do understand that urgent appointments are limited and your staff won't usually have the choice of when their urgent appointment is? It's not some urgent appointments that are unavoidable, it's most or all - that's the nature of an urgent appointment.

I found it interesting that your first post didn't indicate that you would work around them or that there was any degree of flexibility - it was to say that you make them make up the time or you say no to them. Have you had many dealings with ACAS?

Hi OP.

Firstly 10:30am until 1:00pm break is completely unacceptable. That needs to be addressed ASAP. I can't help but feel sorry for the other two employees who (as much as you might not like to hear it) will feel as though she's getting away with murder. I have worked somewhere where the boss had favourites and they got away with things that I would have never and I resented them for it, and in the end I left the job because it wasn't worth it. If you value the two employees you have and as you say, they're more hard working than she is then it would be very silly on your part to let this continue and have the other two feel less valued.

I would have a very informal chat with her. I don't know the relationship but if it were possible to go for a coffee or something that's not in a too formal setting without her being suspicious that it's going to be a 'telling off' then that's a good start. I will literally script what I feel you need to say.

You can even adjust and put in an email if you feel more comfortable.

'I just wanted to bring up, whilst it's just us two. I've noticed that you're taking a lot of appointments and trips during working office hours and as much as I completely understand certain ones can't be avoided, things like the dentist and the chiropractor were an unnecessary outing. The day you left at 10:30 and came back at 1:00 was 2.5 hours of paid, work time where you weren't even in the building let alone able to do the work. I'm a flexible person but that's something I don't have any leeway with. I'm happy for you to continue taking appointments in work hours, but you will have to either use the hour dedicated to your lunch break or I will have to deduct however long you're gone from your wage. It's completely unfair on name of other two employees that you're coming and going as you please and I own a small business, I can't afford for the amount of work your missing to be paid for, when you aren't doing it, and when you are doing it I don't believe it's to your full potential. I like to think this job is flexible, I like to think I'm a good manager and I like to think that the hours/pay are fair, meaning lots of people would be grateful for the position so if you feel that you're unable to do it to your best efforts or that it's not the career path for you, then I'd prefer you to tell me straight out so that we can both help eachother out. If you feel you need to drop a day and go to 2 days a week instead of 3 so you can fit more time in for your appointments then that's something we can discuss.

I really enjoy you working for me, but unfortunately having a business means I have to put feelings aside and think of the needs of my company'

This will either prompt her to tell you she's fed up of the job and give easier access to fire her/let her quit, or she's going to swallow her pride and accept that she needs to pull her finger out because you're not afraid to fire her. Even if you are - don't let her see that.

Personally, she's got away with a lot more than an average person in another job would and you're being too nice, she's going to keep going if you don't stop.

I work FT
I've always scheduled doctor, dentist, chiropractor outside of my working hours

She should schedule her appointments on her non working days

I have a staff handbook with all the relevant policies in. We have only had it in place for about 18 months despite running the business for 12.
I hired an HR company to do it after one of my ex employees started really pushing the boundaries. We were very flexible too but they really started pushing the boat out and taking the piss.
The HR company are great, we pay a yearly retainer in case anything gets complicated, the handbook is now in place in case this ever happens again and we can nip it in the bud and work through any policies we now have.
She is now ex as she found another job elsewhere but we were on the verge of using the policies and HR company to address issues.

I would advise you consider the same just so you know you have things in place and help resolving issues fairly and promptly, we have found it reassuring despite having not actually needing to use them.

Just to add, they did the handbook and formal contracts for us and one of the policies actually covers appointments etc.

YANBU. I have a medical condition which is covered under a protected characteristic so any appointments to do with that I can take in work time and not make up the hours. Anything else (optician, dentist etc) means making up the hours or taking annual leave just like anyone else.

[quote Glitttter]@minipie. So far, 2 dentist appointments, several GP appointments (fine, and for a minor issue she's been open about), eye test, seperate contact lens check, and once she finished early because she went to the chiropractor. They're never at the beginning or end of a day and mysteriously often on the 3 days she works for us.

I wondered if she was applying for jobs, but surely you'd do that on a day you didn't work?[/quote]
Say no to the optician appts and chiropractor being in work time.

I would say what are you going to do about the time you've missed? Do you want to make the time up or would you prefer to take annual leave? If no annual leave left/she says no then unless there is a policy allowing time off with pay it would be time off unpaid. Tell het that.

Re dr appts I would ask her to rearrange for a non working day & let her explain & bring evidence if she can't change it.

Don't just dismiss. I can't quote the earlier post re:dismissal claims costing £7k on average. It's total bobbins op please ignore that suggestion.

If you want some free advice you could ring ACAS.

You don't need to wait until Christmas for a review to do something. However if you are considering dismissing it's always good to get advice from a specialist. 2yrs service is the qualifying period for unfair dismissal but there are other ways to make a claim without.

@Heyha I can only book half day or full day annual leave. My employer is luckily not a monster and doesn't expect me to use up a half day of my very limited annual leave for a 30 min dentist appointment! Overkill much!
Anyone who does expect this of their employees needs to do some reading on improved productivity in the workplace of happier employees!
It's give and take. If an employee is taking the piss then it's about having that conversation. Because my employer and boss are decent, when they ask me to go above and beyond (work late, pick up an urgent call on holiday, cover a meeting for my boss) I say, no problem, happy to help!

Do you make her make up the time?
Usually you would need to make up the time for any absences due to appointments in the working day or be docked pay. The exception is sometimes hospital appointments.

Can you start taking away pay for these appointments? Only pay for hospital appointments and those you need proof in the form of letters. Make a rule that she can get max 3 doc appointments a year and she's had them so need to dock her wages for future appointments

I’d have a chat with her first before you start docking pay - that seems a bit excessive.

You need to strike the right balance - you obviously don’t want staff who take the p by scheduling non urgent appointments in the middle of the day when they could/should make them for a day they’re not working, but equally if you’re too rigid and inflexible you’ll end up with staff who feel no particular loyalty to the company and dig their heels in when you need them to work late or a bit beyond their JD.

Lots of employers require annual leave for routine appointment. I've always done dentist opticians on the same day and taken leave so the children are in childcare.

And there is no legal obligation for paid time off for hospital or other medical appointments. Eg for antenatal care there is a legal right for time off but not for it to be paid

If she's arranging them for a work day can you ask her to swap her day off so she comes in on a different day to her appointment?
Can you ask her to arrange cover for herself so her role is covered? (Depends on her job I know).
Ask her to make up the hours - stay an hour at the end of the day?

If you make it inconvenient she may click and arrange appointments on days off. Obviously some appointments are less able to move than others but I think most bosses can use their discretion on this anyway.

She's totally taking the piss.

I think you need to tackle this before Christmas.

Just ask her for a quick word. Mention that neither you or the two other members of staff arrange for appointments during working hours. And could she be more of a 'team player' as you all end up covering for her got appointments which are not essential.

NHS ones? Fine, you can't shift those and they can take months to arrange. But contact lenses etc? Come on... I know I can book those for when I'm not working.

One more thought. Do you offer flexi time. That way everyone records their hours and if she is not doing hers then isn't paid for them

@RedMarauder ”I can't get a contact lense check at the weekend and I've tried for years with different opticians.”

Boots do weekend contact lens appointments

I have had to have a lot of medical appointments in work time unfortunately -
GP is all phone at the moment except for an emergency lump that turned out to be a cyst and was slotted in at 5.55.
But I've had to take several physio appointments in work time (10 mins walk from home thankfully) because the physio also works part time!
The only dental appointment we've had in the last 18 months has been for DS who knocked a tooth out but though it was after school it was in my working hours.
I had an emergency optician appointment when I had a blow to the eye - 8.50 Monday morning.
I then had to have two check ups and their availability and my days off didn't coincide for weeks and they wanted me back earlier.
So it's not always black and white.

(Anything over an hour or so I book as sick leave though e.g. travel to a hospital in the next town and endless wait for an appointment there = half day sick leave)

I work part time and actively book appointments for when I’m not supposed to be at work. If I have to have an appointment on a working day, I’d use holiday, or make up the time or swap my working days that week. With manager approval. This usually works out.

Don’t leave it until to December to bring it up. I’d have an informal chat with that employee ASAP and set clear boundaries/expectations.

Surely you should be asking her to work the time back.
I would tell her given the amount of work time lost, she either starts arranging appointments in her own time or working the time back. You’re also well within your rights to ask for proof of appointment.

I work for a massive company and I have to work the time back or take it out of annual leave. I work part time so try and arrange things around my non working days. She’s taking the piss.

[quote PeachCottonTree]**@RedMarauder* ”I can't get a contact lense check at the weekend and I've tried for years with different opticians.”*

Boots do weekend contact lens appointments [/quote]
The branch I use the guy only works certain days of the week.

Luckily I always insist on flexible working so I make up the time.