Possibly a sensitive topic but AIBU to say no to this?

[JudgeJerry]

Have lurked here for a little while but my first post.

My husband and I are separating. There is a whole host of reasons for this but one of the big ones is I just felt like I got no help from him with anything, he was always working and everything else was left to me (I also work). Resentment was starting to build massively and he has never done anything to change things despite us going over this so many times, suggesting counselling etc...

We have one DC together and my husband has two older DC from a previous relationship who live with him full time and see their mother on a very ad-hoc basis, contact with their DM has been this way for about 4 years now (issues I won't go into here).

We are trying to arrange contact arrangements with our DC, and we have been arguing basically about my DSC. He thinks it would be right for them to continue having some form of schedule to see myself and their half sibling. I do not agree. They will obviously still see their half sibling, our DC, when they go to their Dad's but I don't see why this needs to involve me.

Whilst I do care for my step children, this is one of the things that caused so many issues in our relationship, that I felt he pushed everything onto me in regards to the children, I basically took over everything and he didn't change a thing. Which is something that seems to be common place from my reading on here.

I highly suspect he is saying this is 'right and fair' so that he continues getting help from me with childcare.

Quite honestly I'm just ready for a clean break or as clean a break as we can possibly manage with DC in the mix and, whilst I don't mind the occasional tea with me and DC or whatever, I do not want to put myself in the position of committing to contact or a schedule with his older children.

I appreciate though it's going to be big changes for everyone and probably a lot of upset. I did take on the role a mother probably would in terms of practical care for DSC day to day but they certainly don't see me as their Mum and still very much love their DM despite the issues.

I just don't know what to do for the best.

Children cope with changes, which btw is fucking fact of life, because the love and care they receive from mom and dad primarily.

These children don't see their mum at all and have a disengaged dad.

The 'love' from those sources is thin on the ground.

I believe DC should be protected from adverse change as much as possible; OP cannot totally prevent this (nor should she) but she could mitigate it.

Of course you are not awful. Of course you have to leave. But you did assume some responsibility for these children when they were very young and, as I think you have acknowledged, you can’t drop them entirely them now without it causing them some, potentially significant, emotional harm. You need to find a way to safeguard your mental health whilst mitigating the damage to theirs.

You have specifically asked what you should do. I think you should arrange a day a week when you collect/have your DSC directly from school and they stay overnight and you take them to school the next day. That way you are not at risk of him being late to pick them up and it limits your contact with him. If this is too much. Then similar arrangement, but once a fortnight. In the school holidays it’s a bit more tricky and there is potential for him to mess you about, but you could still keep the same day as before.

Best of much to you and all the children involved.

@JudgeJerry

I am very hesitant to get into any situation where I am doing school pick ups, I think this leaves me open to "you do it on Wednesdays so why not today", "school know you though" etc... if I agreed to tea during the week he'd need to drop them off here after collecting them himself really.

Maybe an ad hoc basis would be better. Say you go to pick up your child, you say to the children something like, want to come for tea/play/ice cream at the parlour right now and I'll bring you back in two hours? You do this when you feel like, it gives ex no time to guilt you, no time to plan, it's not dependent on school hours, it's on your terms, in your car etc. In the future when they are old enough to sort it themselves they could do overnights.

[quote ButYouGottaHaveASkillJeff]@EarringsandLipstick He's not doing it because he hasn't had to! The OP has always done it.

Now it's his time to step up.

[/quote]
Because she had no choice. He didn't do it. He's not going to.

It's not the OP's problem. However, trying to ameliorate the situation for the DSC would be a decent thing to do.

The best thing for all 3 DC is the father stepping up. But he's not going to do if his x-wife keeps enabling him to be a workaholic taking no responsibility for the children he has created.

There's a middle ground, surely?

She's not going to do everything.

It's about trying to continue some meaningful contact that supports all DC

Much too easy to say ‘oh poor him’ once again and let him off the hook.

Nobody is saying 'oh poor him'.

It's about the children and trying to provide stability for them.

But then she will be in exactly the situation she has left him for @EarringsandLipstick

He is being ridiculous, as are some of the posters on here. They're not your kids and his attitude has led to you leaving him. Just tell him you will see them as and when it is convenient to you but that there will not be any sort of regular schedule, whether he likes it or not. If you do agree to his demands, he will just take the mickey with you again and again and you will be no better off. Stick to your guns, you're doing what is best for you.

@EarringsandLipstick

Children cope with changes, which btw is fucking fact of life, because the love and care they receive from mom and dad primarily.

These children don't see their mum at all and have a disengaged dad.

The 'love' from those sources is thin on the ground.

I believe DC should be protected from adverse change as much as possible; OP cannot totally prevent this (nor should she) but she could mitigate it.

It's up to the father then to engage a nanny for the long duration to care for the children if he can't do it. The nanny will then be legally protected by a contract instead of the step mother giving nanny services for free and without legal protection.

@AlmostSummer21

Tell him to GTF.

His children have two parents, all of them, but you are not the other parent to them all!

He's a lazy, unreasonable twat.

If you CHOOSE to invite his DC over for tea/the day because YOU want to, fine, but they are most definitely not your responsibility & perhaps if the stupid git had taken more responsibility fir his children he wouldn't be in this situation now. Idiot.

Don't let him guilt/push you into being responsible for THEIR children

All of this!

OP, my parents had multiple divorces while I was a child. There is no way it is reasonable for you to continue parenting. You can and should continue ro have a relationship with the dc, on an ad hoc basis arranged between you and them as playdates. They are old enough to understand and you should make sure you make it clear that while you love them and wish to continue seeing them, you need your distance from your ex.

Because she had no choice. He didn't do it. He's not going to.

To say it for a second time, he didn't do it because she did it. Now she has a choice.

He has a choice now too, either step up or employ childcare.

@Clymene

But then she will be in exactly the situation she has left him for *@EarringsandLipstick*

She won't tho.

She's currently doing all the care. As PPs said, he will have to pay for childcare, nanny or similar.

She won't do any of this when she leaves but may see them every second week for some meaningful time, including an overnight, meals together etc.

@AnonymousCheerleader

I'm honestly astounded that people think OP has more responsibility over the step children, and is somehow more accountable for their feelings, than their own father.

Or their own mother 🤷‍♀️ where's she in all this?

@ButYouGottaHaveASkillJeff

Because she had no choice. He didn't do it. He's not going to.

To say it for a second time, he didn't do it because she did it. Now she has a choice.

He has a choice now too, either step up or employ childcare.

And presumably he'll have to get child care.

But that still leaves the kids without the person who has cared for them, and reduced access to their sibling.

This is about considering some meaningful regular contact for all DC, for their benefit. Not for the benefit of the ex.

I think you should step back from them OP. I know it's sad, but I just think that the risk of him asking too much of you and you having to continually fight this battle for years to come is too high.

Keep saying "the DC will all see each other when you have contact time" and "I need a clean break from this situation" until he understands that you doing childcare for him is no longer part of the arrangement.

Then, who knows, you may be able to introduce the odd ad hoc meal or something - but when it suits you, not your ex.

Or their own mother 🤷‍♀️ where's she in all this?

OP has said the mum is not on the scene, for whatever reasons. The kids don't see her, really.

She's explained this a number of times

*But that still leaves the kids without the person who has cared for them, and reduced access to their sibling.

This is about considering some meaningful regular contact for all DC, for their benefit. Not for the benefit of the ex.*

They will still see her albeit on a reduced basis. They don't call her mum, I'm sure they will be sat down and their new normal explained to them. They will understand that they will go with their natural parent but all with still have meaningful contact at their dad's.

I really don't see how people are having a problem with this. That's what happens when blended families split.

It seems that you have been in a relationship from a v young age with a dominating and difficult (older) man.

For a long time you graciously picked up 100% of his childcare duties for his DC because he chose to dump on you and exploit you.

You have seen the light and decided to leave.

He is continuing to dump on you and exploit you by manipulating you into bound arrangements.

You can recognise and feel this manipulation and you know (because you know him) that anything you give it will be exploited further.

Stand your ground. It’s very important that you achieve what you set out to achieve.

A clean break.

This is important to you - so stick with it. It’s important for your emotional freedom that you do this.

What YOU decide after - any ad-hoc will be fluid and what suits all 4 of you.

See yourself as an auntie - it’s up to you to pick and chose what works for you.

I agree with others he will have a nanny, new partner etc …. and they could be off on dates / weekends away whilst you do the drudge of his childcare. All so wrong. Also if you want to move on with another partner it would be bizarre to have legal committed responsibility to someone else’s DC.

I have never seen this situation before where an ex takes on responsibility for DSC - it’s way OTT - that’s why your gut is screaming at you.

I would not give him any idea of your ad-hoc frequency because he will just build this in to his schedule.

Well done for getting out. Stick with your gut for a clean break. Don’t let anyone tell you that you are selfish - they most certainly haven’t ever done anything like this. People come on these threads to goad. Know that.

Stick with you gut and do what you need to do for yourself.

@Clymene

I wonder how many men continue to do overnight care and school pick ups for their ex partner's kids? None I expect. And I wonder how many men would tell them they should? Bet that'd be none too.

Why do women fall over themselves to pick up other people's messes?

Totally agree. No wonder women end up being the doormats who run around doing everything, the level of shame being put upon the op for wanting to look out for her own well being and not remaining a full time parent to her manipulative and selfish ex’s DC, when neither her ex nor the mother of the children have taken on any responsibility, is appalling.

OP you must do what’s right for you and not let other people make you feel guilty for something not of your making. Of course you will want to maintain some contact but it needs to be on your terms.

@NewlyGranny

The starting point, I think, needs to be considering what parental rights OP actually has after the divorce over the children of her stbxh and his previous ex. And the answer is clear: none.

If she took him to a family court seeking residence or even contact, I think it's highly unlikely she would be granted anything. It would be left to their DF's goodwill and the older child's wishes.

No rights means no obligations. It's really that simple.

Of course the stbxh has grown used to acres of free childcare and wife-work from OP, but once she isn't his DW, that simply turns off like a tap. I think he is beginning to contemplate the consequences of his actions and not enjoying the prospect, but that's his problem.

Anything OP does or offers will be from the sheer goodness of her heart, which seems pretty deep. But I keep harping that it must never be seen as a duty or a given or be taken for granted or become an expectation or worse, an obligation.

When she invites the children over, they need to know they are valued and welcomed; invited by their former DSM, not dumped by their DF.

All of this! ^ 🌹

OP, what a situation - for what it's worth I think you're being more than fair and reasonable, I hope some of the harsher comments aren't getting to you.

I appreciate they have lived as siblings, but presumably they will have at least an evening a week and every other weekend together at their dads in the future? That seems the standard minimum, and these kids are 9and 12 and presumably have school and after school activities so it isn't like they're always in each others pockets.

I would talk to the children, they are old enough to understand. You and the dad can't live together, you want to see them, they will always be siblings. And then invite them around on a play date basis when convenient to you. With them being dropped off and picked up at agreed times. If you did that once a fortnight on the weekend they would see each other every weekend and a night and possibly more a week.

You're not unreasonable to consider what works for you OP. And I definitely understand the fear of a slipper slope, he sounds like he will push and push.

I think it’s tricky. Everyone on here will also be the first to say to anyone thinking of starting a relationship with someone with children to consider them and they should be first in that consideration and if you can’t do that then walk away. You didn’t walk away at that point but took responsibility for them at a young age.

Yes children are resilient and accepting of change. This is not change though in their eyes. It will be another mother figure walking away-plus the loss of their sibling. I don’t think that can be under-estimated on it’s impact on them. This includes your own DC who will lose full time siblings and Father at the same time.

What you need to do is think what would be acceptable to you and even if that grates because you’re doing their father a favour-do it anyway for the children. I would offer one pick up from school with an overnight each week and then be firm that that was it. Then they can all see each other at their fathers another night a week and Eow weekend. They are growing up and it won’t be forever but will help them over this time.

Why does everyone assume that the kids want op to keep caring for them as the best option.

I'd imagine kids would most like their mum and dad to care for them, followed by their mum or dad.

Definitely an ad hoc arrangement OP, anything set/fixed/formal is just unnecessary when they’re not your own children. I agree that you stay well away from school runs too.