AIBU to insist we stay in London?

[londonlass33]

DH wants to leave London and I desperately don’t. We’ve visited numerous places in the south-east where we could viably live (due to commuting distance mainly) to house hunt and I’ve just not felt at home anywhere.

For me London has it all - culture, diversity, fabulous parks, restaurants, excellent public transport, nightlife, sports and myriad educational and job opportunities for the DC when they get older. Nowhere we’ve visited has come even close to my mind.

We also live in a lovely quiet street with a wonderful sense of community and are good friends with our fabulous neighbours. We have many friends in the area through the DC’s nursery too.

DH is adamant he wants to leave as whilst he acknowledges all of the above, he’s got his heart set on a change of scenery after the last 18 months. I’m very reluctant to give it a go for the aforementioned reasons and because it will be nigh on impossible to come back if we leave and regret it.

WWYD?

If you’re both going to commute into London 3/4 days a week when are your children roaming the countryside? Surely they’ll be in breakfast and after school club for long days while you commute??

We live 20-30 min from work in a different city. I much prefer our small city compared to London but honestly don’t get this “moving out of London” thing if you’re still going to travel in every day. It’s madness.

How old are your kids? We moved out of London a year ago and I'm glad we waited to move until DS was aged 8 because I wouldn't want to have young kids out here, there just isn't the range of facilities on the doorstep as there was in London. A change of scene isn't a strong reason to move. I loved London but am also happy in the country, genuine benefits include clean air, much lower crime rates, small schools, amazing access to countryside/outdoor activities. Kids don't roam free though. However country isn't better than London it is just different. You need to both be in favour of the change or it won't work. How's about a promise to assess it in X year's time with your DH. Don't write it off but don't be rushed into it, esp w young kids.

Ha!

My London Dc have grown up roaming far freer than their country cousins.

My siblings’ and extended family’s children live rurally. Their Country lanes are narrow and windy and not safe to walk or cycle on. The public transport is shit / non existent, everyone is dependent on a car, Kids need parents to ferry them around til they fork out for driving lessons and sky high insurance for them at 17 / 18.

Meanwhile my kids take part in no end of brilliant cultural projects, get themselves all over London on public transport independently, and we have spent our weekends and holidays camping, walking, getting a big outdoor-adventure fix.

It’s not surprising that your DH feels hemmed in after the last 18m, and I suspect that it might not be best to make life changing decisions in the slipstream of the pandemic. Lots of early-escapees are already in their way back.

Also, if you need to be in town 3 or 4 days a week, that is a lot of commuting. How will he feel spending hours on the train? Knowing that far from running wild and free the kids are in longer childcare to cover the commute?

I think I would say to him give it another year. See how London pans out when things get more normal and you are back on the office.

And that you will give it another serious think in a year.

I wouldn't leave London if I were there.
We moved from a big city and now have beach and countryside on our doorstep.
Our advantage is a bigger house, nothing else.
Transport not as good and more expensive, people a bit close-minded, there's a lack of choice of places to go unless you like being out in nature but I'd much prefer the hustle and bustle of London. There's not that buzz here of trying a new restaurant or seeing a show at short notice.
Many people grew up here and aren't interested in making friends with outsiders, not in a nasty way but in a way that they've been friends for years, went to school together, don't see the need.
In big cities like London where a lot of people have arrived as adults I find people are more open. We have ended upsking friends with other people who moved here and some others through work but all of them have lived away from here for a time.
We are in the process of moving away from here.

Many people grew up here and aren't interested in making friends with outsiders, not in a nasty way but in a way that they've been friends for years, went to school together, don't see the need.

This is one of the main things that worries me! It’s so easy to make friends in London. Good luck with your move

I don't think either of you are right or wrong, you just want different things.

I honestly don't understand why anyone chooses to live in London past their early twenties/young adulthood tbh. It wouldn't be my choice at all, but we're all different. I don't think insisting is the answer on either side. You need to discuss it until you can reach some sort of agreement.

I honestly don't understand why anyone chooses to live in London past their early twenties/young adulthood tbh.

In my case it’s for all the reasons mentioned in my OP. And there’s so much to do with kids!

We took a slightly drastic approach to itchy feet (20 years in London) and moved overseas for a few years. We rent our London house out, which has very much not been plain sailing. While there are good things here- we are by the sea, have a pool and bigger house, lots of family time, cheap activities for kids etc we now know that we really miss cultural stuff and having loads to do.

We will move back when DC1 is in year 5. I think the compromise will be doing more regular weekends by the sea. But we're both on board with that and having a smaller house. I think now we know we would be bored somewhere else (dh and I both grew up in the countryside as well so we can compare!).

But 'just rent your house out for a year' isn't as easy as it sounds.

We were the other way round - my DH loved London, I was really 'done'. We were stuck in a conversation that went round in circles for years. We also looked at lots of commutable places. Eventually we decided that if we were going to go, we would leave the whole craziness of the SE and move to another major city, with its own vibrant buzz, but with all the amazing countryside I needed on my doorstep. Honestly? It's worked really well. My friends who chose the commutable option are much less happy with their choice in the long run. So if you are going to leave -I would say pick another major city.

If your house is big enough and you are settled then you would be mad to leave.

I wouldn’t do it OP. Your husband sounds like he’s reacting to covid restrictions and not actually thinking clearly.
As your kids get older they probably won’t thank you for moving them away from the city. It’s tough for teenagers being in a small place. It’s extra tough if you don’t fit in with the crowd. There’s less diversity and opportunity to explore alternative things. The lack of independence until you can drive is hard.

Don’t do, it don’t do it, don’t do it.

We left London 8 (!) years ago now, and I still haven’t settled properly and I still miss it.

Both of you potentially commuting into London 3-4 days a week is a lot. I'd get him to consider if the commute is really worth it. A lot of the time you can't get a seat, trains are unreliable and it's expensive too.

Before doing anything drastic, make sure you have fully explored the outer boroughs of London. I think you may be surprised how much more countrysidey it feels on the edge.

I agree also with the suggestion of properly checking out other cities. I have spent very happy years living in Leeds and Manchester and neither lacked for culture and countryside (although jobs amd public transport, not so great).

Finally, the only people I know who moved out of the SE and whose DC are getting a genuinely outdoorsy, free range childhood moved to Aberdeenshire. Which is probably a little drastic as a commute!

I think I would compromise on perhaps moving out further in the Zones but nothing more, some people are just designed for city life. I also second what PP said about another major city if you do go, town living was horrendous, and having to commute, I never factored in that I'd have to leave at 7:20am, but no childcare, at all, in the new area started before 8am! Even in the big city I now live, most won't start before 7:30 and you pay a premium for that. Little things were so weird too, very few baby groups / kids clubs etc. Local little stores / post offices shutting at noon on a Wednesday. It felt really cliquey too. And I'd done my research and thought I'd picked the perfect town!

For me London has it all

Drive by shootings included. Last night one of the victims (now in hospital) was an elderly woman (believed caught in the cross fire).

Also, without wanting to be cynical, what's the childcare plan? Because it's all very well fo your DH to want to move and be willing to commute but which of you will be rushing back to fetch the children, leaving meetings early because if you don't catch the 5:15 you won't make it back in time etc.

'I've got itchy feet' is not a good reason to move. He's not single any more and it's not just about him. I say this as someone who moved out of London last year - but I had specific reasons to.

Drive by shootings included. Last night one of the victims (now in hospital) was an elderly woman (believed caught in the cross fire).

Sadly these tragedies can happen anywhere - just look at the terrible news in Plymouth. I never feel unsafe in London.

while its a difficult one, I am not sure that you can insist.

honestly don't understand why anyone chooses to live in London past their early twenties/young adulthood tbh.

Some people are actual real Londoners. For them London isn't just a place to be used to make money out of before fucking off. The media handwringing (and insular MN threads) about 'locals' elsewhere in the UK always conveniently ignores the fact that London too has locals with local family and local community. It's not just a thing in Cornwall or the Lakes. Yes, many have been displaced but a fair few still (for now) remain. For the same reasons why locals anywhere else stay where they are. To be near their families, communities, and support networks.

@godmum56

while its a difficult one, I am not sure that you can insist.

But why can the dh insist?

It feels to me op’s reasons are very solid v change of scene and last 18 months

@Tealightsandd

honestly don't understand why anyone chooses to live in London past their early twenties/young adulthood tbh.

Some people are actual real Londoners. For them London isn't just a place to be used to make money out of before fucking off. The media handwringing (and insular MN threads) about 'locals' elsewhere in the UK always conveniently ignores the fact that London too has locals with local family and local community. It's not just a thing in Cornwall or the Lakes. Yes, many have been displaced but a fair few still (for now) remain. For the same reasons why locals anywhere else stay where they are. To be near their families, communities, and support networks.

Absolutely, well said

I grew up in a quaint little market town surrounded by countryside. My parents moved out of London before I was born and as soon as I was able to I left said quaint town because it was so mind numbingly boring. A lot of people are pretty narrow minded and uninterested in outsiders (which my parents were) so they didn’t really make many friends there which in turn meant I struggled at school because most people’s parents/aunties/nans etc were all round the corner from each other and had gone to the same school as their kids, whereas we had no local connections.

I wish they’d stayed in London and that I could’ve grown up there. I’m now an adult and living in London and can’t see myself leaving. If I do, it’ll have to be to another city/town with a diverse art and culture scene but I’d rather just stay here. I too have a nice local community and love what a mishmash of everything London is. I wouldn’t leave if I were you, you’d be giving up so much