Taliban enter Kabul

[tttigress]

I was in my early 20's when 9/11 happened, the last 20 years has been overshadowed by endless wars without clearly defined objectives (original point of going into Afghanistan was to "get" Al Qaeda, there was then massive mission creep)

AIBU to think the last 20 years in Afghanistan was a total waste of time?

Off with their Medieval dicks

@Seeingadistance

I can’t stop thinking about the women and girls of Afghanistan. The horrors that they will be forced to endure and the desperate measures they’ll take to escape that fate.

That’s what I keep thinking about. My sisters in Afghanistan and I want to weep and scream and rage about what is happening to them.

😭 absolutely this. The world is just watching. It feels hopeless.

What are the options for women and children? Is there any way they can protect themselves? Is there only guaranteed route to safety by fleeing and seeking asylum elsewhere? If so, how realistic is it for them to be able to do that?

@Panickingpavlova

I don't understand pics.

If your left behind that's probably what will happen.

You will starve and or be married off or punished for the the men folks leaving.

The women have just a good a chance as anyone else to get away.

Right, but if they're at home they can try to hide it out, argue their case, play the good Taliban citizen.

If they are discovered at the airport, fleeing, they are fucked.

@Window1

What are the options for women and children? Is there any way they can protect themselves? Is there only guaranteed route to safety by fleeing and seeking asylum elsewhere? If so, how realistic is it for them to be able to do that?

It's not. The Taliban secured the last land borders yesterday, and the Taliban have already said that Afghans will not be permitted to leave (though obviously western govts are extracting some ex-staffers on military flights).

Their only realistic hope now is visas from western countries today and a military flight out, or to have family apply for exit (and entry) visas for them if/when the situation stabilises and diplomatic channels reopen.

Theoretically it's possible to be smuggled over land, but any outsider would be immediately noticed and the chance of capture - and the consequence - is high.

In reality, the prospects of those who didn't get out on commercial aircraft last week are really bleak.

I could never understand why America thinks its OK to have nuclear weapons and they have been the only government to USE their nuclear weapons but no other country is allowed. The only reason Iran hasn't been invaded and bombarded is because they have nuclear weapons, it's their safety net. Tbh, it makes the US the most dangerous country in the world. They have destabilised more countries and governments than any other and have been pushing the Islamophobic narrative for a while now...

Same here.

The only reason Iran hasn't been invaded and bombarded is because they have nuclear weapons

Not sure that is at all true….There’s a vanishingly small chance they might have them, though the general opinion internationally, rightly or wrongly, is that they are still trying to develop one.

And moving on, it is highly highly highly unlikely they have anything, or are close to building anything that can be “delivered”..

I can't believe that we have scenes of people fleeing in terror, literally dropping from planes in desperation and on this thread we have people judging them. They are people who are likely to be slaughtered by the Taliban because they've either helped our troops or because somehow, they or their family perhaps many years ago upset the Taliban. The Taliban have long memories. How dare you! where is your compassion, your humanity?

I actually find it really distasteful how so many effectively dehumanise these people by suggesting they are lesser beings than us, who feel no love for their families Absolutely PicInRed.

Let’s not get all misty-eyed over the Afgan National Security Forces being overrun by the Taliban. At least the rampant sexual abuse of young boys (bacha bazi) practiced by them will reduce, as the Taliban oppose it.

The reality is, Afganistan is a hell-hole for women and children, whoever is in power. Removing them, then blowing it to Kingdom come, would probably be the best solution.

@Window1

What are the options for women and children? Is there any way they can protect themselves? Is there only guaranteed route to safety by fleeing and seeking asylum elsewhere? If so, how realistic is it for them to be able to do that?

It's very, very difficult to flee with young children and if the Taliban close the borders, who will be courageous enough to airlift them out?

Pics I disagree.
Have you read the taliban /sharia laws?
They aren't allowed to open the door to men, they can't talk to men, how are they gong to "argue it out" with no male in house?

They arnt going to allowance them to remain like that! And how do they get food if they arnt allowed out without a male?

At the air port they have evry chance of getting on a plane possibly more so than their males.

Another to consider is that although the fate of women/girls is bad men/boys who are considered as enemies are more likely to be killed, you only have to look at some of the stories coming from some of the villages were all the men and boys seem to have been killed

My cat that stoll doesn't explain why there is a disproportionate amount of men v women.
It's indicative of a two tier society, separated based on sex.

Financial time's, story of Amenha, not real name, she says she was engaged forcibly of course to a beared cousin and made to go and live in her uncles house age 12.

After taliban removed from power she fled, divorced her unwanted cousin husband.
Became educated and her and her sisters and mother all enjoyed a good level of freedom... She's said she's now terrifed of someone knocking on her doors ready to enslave her and family again and that person who she's dreading?

Her uncle.

Khaled hosseini, author of the kite runner.

Worries about the women most they will suffer the most.

@Panickingpavlova

Pics, I know what you mean but it's coming from an incredibly sexist view point and mysogenistic culture.

Would you be happy to be left behind? I dam well know I wouldn't and I said pp, it's me not dh who would be more likely to get us out!!

This is incredibly crass. You sound like you think it plays out like a Hollywood movie, where you'd be the 'star' managing to get your family out by sheer pluck and determination

You honestly have no idea of what you're up against. You are completely underestimating the brutality and the sheer volume of violence the Taliban dole out.

One hard clout from a Talib's rifle as you walk past (not even worth a bullet) and that's your jaw broken or skull fractured.

What exactly would your plan be? You seem to have it all worked out?

Hideous to suggest the Afghan people are just not trying hard enough

The women have just a good a chance as anyone else to get away.

No, they absolutely don't!

It's very, very difficult to flee with young children and if the Taliban close the borders, who will be courageous enough to airlift them out?

No-one

The Taliban could easily put Kabul international airport out of use any time they fancy now.

Stark choice is to fit in with what they allow and, whilst the going's good, hope to include in as low key way as possible as many dual nationals (and foreign governments' local staff who might otherwise be in danger, such as interpreters, British Council etc) as possible.

Or make a fuss, or be in any way conspicuous about removing asylum seekers, and risk an end to flights. That essentially leaves your reimagining visa-issuing staff (such as the Ambassador) and the troops as hostages - perhaps not deliberately taken, but pretty much the same thing as they cannot leave

Afghan representative addresses the UN: "We are extremely concerned about the Taliban not honouring their commitment at Doha...Kabul residents are reporting that the Taliban are starting house to house searches registering names and looking for people on their target list."

They aren't allowed to open the door to men, they can't talk to men, how are they gong to "argue it out" with no male in house?

A boy child will do the talking and do the shopping for food. A nephew or cousin if there are no sons, or if the sons are too young.

The best shot for families in this situation is to be seen as mild and unthreatening and cooperative as possible, and stay off the Taliban's radar.

Hideous to suggest the Afghan people are just not trying hard enough

AbsentmindedWoman she's not suggesting that they're not trying hard enough, no one would suggest that. She's questioning why all those men are trying to flee the country while the women are being left behind to be married off to those horrible men from the Taliban.

How exactly do you think these men will be able to get their wives and children out once they're safely in Europe and the Taliban has full control over the borders in Afghanistan? They can't.

Ive just seen the scenes at the airport. Absolutely heart breaking.
Gut wrenching.

Because many of the men will be slaughtered

The decisions being made are about survival not life choices

All those soldiers in the government army do you think the Taliban are going to say well done you tried hard but we won with a pat on their back. People died from falling from plans today

I can’t imagine the absolute sheer terror that parents must feel for their children