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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

Aibu to count DDs savings in the emergency savings fund

256 replies

Gettingmoretoast · 12/08/2021 13:37

We have an account for DD where money from her grandparents has gone into. As she is only 1, although it's in her name, we have full access to it. It's a separate account though with entirely her money and we don't touch it. I'm celebrating 'loosely' as after years of being in debt, we're not only debt free (apart from mortgage), but actually have some savings. I returned to work after mat leave 'full time' in February but used annual leave to complete a phased return until a few weeks ago and I was able to save on the nursery days we didn't need but obviously now we will be paying full time childcare and the bill will increase so I can still save, but a much lesser amount each month.
I'm very open with my sister and we've been supporting each other through our debt - savings journeys so I excitedly told her that after my pay day this month I will have officially reached my emergency savings goal so I can then focus what little savings I can now make for gradual upgrades to the house that I've been desperate to do but have ignored to focus on savings. I told her what the emergency savings was and she said she didn't think that was quite enough and I explained that if we had to, as a very last resort, we would have access to DDs savings too. She then told me that it was wrong to count her money towards my emergency savings goal because it was essentially stealing from her which I really don't agree with.
To be clear, we have sinking funds for birthdays, Christmas, annual expenses such as insurance, MOT, expected car repairs etc. So our savings are for genuine emergencies only and we would need to exhaust our own savings (which are literally 3 times larger than DDs) before we'd touch hers so we are talking some really significant emergency having happened here before we dip into them. Also, we're now paying nearly £900 a month in DDs childcare bill; we'll be able to save a lot more once we no longer have that to pay for and it is our intention to top both our emergency savings up as well as DDs savings up when we no longer have that to pay anyway so if we absolutely had to borrow the money from her, I'm certain we could repay it long before she turns 18 and will be getting it anyway. Is it really so wrong to say that in a genuine emergency I might borrow some of my daughter's money?

OP posts:
JustLyra · 12/08/2021 15:17

In a dire emergency it makes no sense to not use it.

I had to dip into my girls’ savings accounts when they were babies. It was that or homelessness. On another occasion it was that or be cold in the height of winter when the place I worked when bust just before payday and I didn’t get my wages for months.

Blossomtoes · 12/08/2021 15:18

You are bearing the costs of bringing her up and paying for everything

That’s kind of the definition of parenthood.

lking679 · 12/08/2021 15:18

I think the survey results speak for themselves. I don't even know the balance of my kids savings accounts we and grandparents pay in to! My first thought would be an emergency loan or credit card if the roof or something fell in and only if you couldn't get it afford it I'd ask permission from Grandparents to use the money (they might set you up a separate loan!). The problem is your daughter can't give you consent, she's too young. It feels like stealing. And it seems you've quite casually assumed there are scenario's you'd dip into it and how hard is that line...not that it would but the casual way it's mentioned it's like you could talk yourself into using them say for a nice holiday for DD.
I'd say if you have 3 months of emergency savings you need to consider if that's enough for you to spend money on house... and if not carry on saving.

HoppingPavlova · 12/08/2021 15:21

This has also served as a lesson to me to just put money aside myself for grandkids when I have them, seems easier and can just give them the money when they are setting up for house, car, tools of trade or whatnot. If I’m not around I’d just leave it in trust I guess.

Original poster
Gettingmoretoast · 12/08/2021 15:22

@caughtinanet It has nothing to do with my sister at all but my sister is my best friend and I tell her pretty much everything and she has been very supportive of me over the years as I've been trying to clear our debts and save up. I think (some) people here are taking this an awful lot more seriously than my sister and I did; it's just a topic I find interesting and it's relatively rare that my sister and I disagree on something so I am genuinely interested to see what other people think of this scenario. I respect everyone's opinion here as much as I respect my sister's but I do think there are some posters that really need to calm down a little bit because the savings habits of strangers does seem to have infuriated some.... Which I think is a tad unnecessary to be honest. But I'm enjoying the engagement and discussion 😊

OP posts:
mam0918 · 12/08/2021 15:23

@Gettingmoretoast

Really? So if the roof of your house caved in and you needed to use all of your savings to fix it but were a a bit shy, you'd rather take out a loan to cover that rather than borrow from your child's account with a view to repay plus interest somewhere in the next 16+ years before they are ever going to see that money anyway? Does that really not seem unnecessary to people?
The reality is parents justify these thing to themselves but then never actually repay it, certainly not with interest (define interest, interest for the loan or interest to replace the lost bank interest or both?).

Theres no accounting to the money you take so its easy to lapse and write it off. Happens all the time and its the kids getting screwed and it is stealing just children are two small to understand and fight back until its far too late.

ifonly4 · 12/08/2021 15:23

To my mind money put aside for your DD is totally for her benefit, so unless say needed a change to the house was because she had a disability, a more expensive holiday would be because it was specifically geared to her enjoyment, or you were struggling to feed/cloth her, needed it to support her education, then it shouldn't be touched.

mam0918 · 12/08/2021 15:26

@Loki01

YANBU. You are bearing the costs of bringing her up and paying for everything. If you need the money in an emergency, it is an emergency that includes your DD. My DS doesn't have any savings. I never got a penny for him from anyone, my parents never helped me with any money towards the wedding, house etc. I would love to save for him but can't as we bought a house and are making improvements. He is a capable person and will make his own money.
You are bearing the costs of bringing her up and paying for everything.

That is litrally your legal responsability as a parent, if you're too selfish to do that without thinking it entitles you to steal or finacially abuse others then you shouldnt have had kids.

Original poster
Gettingmoretoast · 12/08/2021 15:27

@HoppingPavlova Happy to accept the nomination 🍆
Who knew that using 'DDs childcare bill' instead of 'my childcare bill' would lead to such an honour. I'm touched, truly.

OP posts:
Katela18 · 12/08/2021 15:28

My parents did do this with savings that were put aside for me and my brothers from an inheritance. The full amount was never paid back and we also lost out on a lot of interest which would have accrued, as they gave us the amount left in the account when we turned 18 and then topped up a bit from their current account. If the money had been sat in the savings account the whole time it would have accrued a reasonable amount of interest.

Though I (sort of) get your rationale, the money is not yours. You shouldn't even be thinking about it. It's a lot easier said than done to say you would just pay it back, more important things will always crop up.

conxray · 12/08/2021 15:31

I think it shouldn't count as the emergency savings funds.
So say you have 2K savings for emergencies and DD has 1K, your emergency fund is 2K not 3K.
It shouldn't be entering your head when totting up your savings.
Even considering it increases the likelihood of you using it.

RainingChampions · 12/08/2021 15:31

If it was an absolute emergency, then yes I would use it. Sometimes things happen in life that you can't control/plan for.

Loki01 · 12/08/2021 15:36

@Blossomtoes

You are bearing the costs of bringing her up and paying for everything

That’s kind of the definition of parenthood.

Yes, it is. I still don't see why she shouldn't be able to use the money if needed. Dont really get your point.
Original poster
Gettingmoretoast · 12/08/2021 15:36

I get the point a lot of people are making regarding I shouldn't even be thinking about it. (though I disagree strongly with the rational being because otherwise I might randomly decide that that new lamp is worth dipping into DDs savings for. That's down to the individual and I know myself and DH well enough to know that that would not happen. When we say it would only be for an emergency, we mean it would only be for an emergency.)
But can you help what you think about? Doesn't it just happen....
My sister said she doesn't think I have enough and I should keep saving which I immediately know I'm not going to do. She says 'what if...' and my brain goes to, well if we had to, if we absolutely had to, we do have access to DDs money. I can't help that, that's where my brain went, it just happened. How do you force yourself to not even think something? And now that I have thought about it, it's up to me and DH to decide how we feel about this and whether we would actually do it or not in the very worst case scenario and I believe yes, we could and I feel okay about that. Many of you disagree and would not in your scenario. That's fine. It's interesting to see where everyone sits.

OP posts:
Loki01 · 12/08/2021 15:38

@mam0918
F... off. When money is needed for an emergency is for the whole family. It is not stealing.
Some people.....

Loki01 · 12/08/2021 15:41

@Gettingmoretoast

I get the point a lot of people are making regarding I shouldn't even be thinking about it. (though I disagree strongly with the rational being because otherwise I might randomly decide that that new lamp is worth dipping into DDs savings for. That's down to the individual and I know myself and DH well enough to know that that would not happen. When we say it would only be for an emergency, we mean it would only be for an emergency.) But can you help what you think about? Doesn't it just happen.... My sister said she doesn't think I have enough and I should keep saving which I immediately know I'm not going to do. She says 'what if...' and my brain goes to, well if we had to, if we absolutely had to, we do have access to DDs money. I can't help that, that's where my brain went, it just happened. How do you force yourself to not even think something? And now that I have thought about it, it's up to me and DH to decide how we feel about this and whether we would actually do it or not in the very worst case scenario and I believe yes, we could and I feel okay about that. Many of you disagree and would not in your scenario. That's fine. It's interesting to see where everyone sits.
It's all just talk. Of course, they would dip into their savings rather than losing the house, etc. As long you are only using it when there is no other way, I don't see a problem.
user16395699 · 12/08/2021 15:43

You are holding that money in a bare trust for your daughter. If you take the money you are depriving her of assets and breaking the law.

So actually it does matter what other people think, because what you feel entitled to do is unlawful.

Blackberrybunnet · 12/08/2021 15:44

"Emergency" is the key word here. You wouldn't be using the money unless it was really needed. What would the alternative be, and wouldn't that be putting your daughter at a disadvantage? You are the parents, and you get to decide what the money is used for until she is older. I'm with Sarahlou63 here.

Terhou · 12/08/2021 15:45

You can't claim to have reached your emergency savings goal if it includes your daughter's money. Keep saving so that the issue of using it doesn't arise.

Bellringer · 12/08/2021 15:48

What basis was it given on, what do gp expect, what will dc think when older. Is it spending money or for uni, a car at 18, whatever?

Bellringer · 12/08/2021 15:49

You can borrow against your house

godmum56 · 12/08/2021 15:49
  1. You didn't put the money there
  2. Its not intended for you
therefore 3. Its not yours to use.

I am unconvinced, from experience, nothing personal, that it would get paid back....after all you are specifying a dire emergency and that you have zero funds yourself...its fatally easy to think "oh well shes 3/4/5 I have got 13/12/11 years to pay it back I don't need to start yet"

I think it would be more honest to say. "If we got really totally stuck I would take the money and use it and consider it part of the family resource and tell her GP's that" which would still be wrong but more honest to them and to yourself....and yes I think you should take out a formal loan in preference to taking her money BECASUSE IT IS NOT YOURS

Original poster
Gettingmoretoast · 12/08/2021 15:51

@user16395699
If that were true, why would it even be possible for me to take money out of the account in the first place? This is my DDs account in her name but I have the legal right to access it as I see fit as her legal guardian.
Not to mention all of the posters who have also pointed out that during a universal credit claim, DDs money would be counted and we would be expected to use it (which I didn't know and is a very interesting point so thank you to those that explained that). I'm not buying for one second that this is stealing and this is where Mumsnet turns particularly toxic at times. You can have a different opinion to someone and you can choose to make different decisions but it's not okay to accuse someone of committing a crime against their child with no proof to back that up. So get off that high horse there. I am in an extremely privileged position here and I know that! If you honestly cannot imagine a scenario where you would be so desperate for money that you needed to take money out of your child's account because you have explored every other option and there isn't one, then you really do need to check your privilege.

OP posts:
FrangipaniDeLaSqueegeeMop · 12/08/2021 15:52

I used £2k of my kids savings to flee a deeply unhappy marriage with their dad. I'm not sorry and I am paying it back.

HeyDemonsItsYaGirl · 12/08/2021 15:53

@AnonymousCheerleader

If borrowing money from your daughter was going to save you from homelessness, then use it. Otherwise, it shouldn't be counted as your savings, emergency or otherwise.

I never consider my son's money as ours.

My thoughts exactly. But I think if you touch it for lesser things it will become far too tempting, and you'll end up not replenishing it properly.