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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

AIBU to be asked to reframe my trauma by the trans CEO of Scottish Rape Crisis?

999 replies

herewegogc · 10/08/2021 21:27

The CEO of Edinburgh Rape Crisis has said "Sexual violence happens to bigoted people too. But if you bring beliefs that are discriminatory, expect to be challenged on your prejudice. Reframe your trauma"

Apparently, survivors are to be "educated" in this service.

forwomen.scot/10/08/2021/the-real-crisis-at-rape-crisis-scotland/

Tonight is a really tough one. Women who have been raped or sexually assaulted need females to listen to them. Rape Crisis was that service and used to offer trauma based therapy.

I don't need educating - I know that detailing my experience to a man, or a transwomen is NEVER something I will do.

This is too much.

OP posts:
Thread gallery
18
ErrolTheDragon · 11/08/2021 22:40

@Tuscancat

Where do mumsnet tell you why they have deleted your post? I have done nothing wrong, I don't understand the deletion?
I don't think they usually tell you exactly beyond the 'broke talk guidelines message', but I believe they will sometimes provide clarification or even reconsider if you ask. Doing @MNHQ does not contact anyone; you need to report a post (I think you can do that on the deleted post itself) or there's a 'contact us' type of email - I'm not sure what it is but someone else may know.
Waitwhat23 · 11/08/2021 22:46

[quote ErrolTheDragon]There's nothing on the extra guidelines which say they're specific to one board, afaik.

But I'll note that the first sentence in bold after the title is
Mumsnet will always stand in solidarity with vulnerable or oppressed minorities.

I think the fact this thread has been put back on AIBU may well be because MNHQ do recognise that rape victims are exactly that and do need proper support.

It's a good idea for anyone who engages in these discussions to read the guidelines, general and specific.

www.mumsnet.com/i/netiquette

And

www.mumsnet.com/i/trans-rights-moderation-policy[/quote]
Fair enough. I see the second link still incorrectly says 'trans rights moderation policy' when it should say 'sex and gender moderation policy'!

Tuscancat · 11/08/2021 22:47

Thank you @Waitwhat23 and @ErrolTheDragon it is quite upsetting to have shared ones experience of SA and subsequent experience of a male counsellor and have it deleted. I won't bother messaging mumsnet having looked at it a bit more I suspect it was probably because I had the audacity to say a man in a dress is still a man, and also point out that sex offenders will go to extraordinary lengths to get their kicks, including pretending to be trans. Although I frankly confused about what trans even means!

Helleofabore · 11/08/2021 22:49

Just reposting this link to a thread with plenty of links to read particularly over the past year or two.

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3145470-Break-it-down-for-me

For those who wonder what else has been happening, wondering how this has come about etc.

Waitwhat23 · 11/08/2021 22:51

@helleabore was just coming on to post that link - it really is invaluable.

Tuscancat · 11/08/2021 22:51

Oh thank you will take a look

Rhannion · 11/08/2021 22:55

I would like to see MW out of that job by the end of this week but I think MW is very pally with “ our dear leader” in Scotland that he ( MW has no GRC so is a he ) isn’t going to go without a fight and will probably play any “ card” available to hang on there.

Rainbowshit · 11/08/2021 22:58

@Rhannion

I would like to see MW out of that job by the end of this week but I think MW is very pally with “ our dear leader” in Scotland that he ( MW has no GRC so is a he ) isn’t going to go without a fight and will probably play any “ card” available to hang on there.
Nah. Trans Teflon will do its work. The very real concerns and distress of women will just be framed as transphobia.
Selkiesarereal · 11/08/2021 22:58

Our glorious leader is a feminist to her fingertips so I expect she’ll be out to defend us on a personal video very soon…

Rhannion · 11/08/2021 23:00

It’s like the injustice that women are expected to lie and commit perjury if they dare to “ mis gender” their attacker in court! How the hell did that happen?

Tuscancat · 11/08/2021 23:02

@Helleofabore the first post by datun on the thread you linked explains a lot thank you.

Rhannion · 11/08/2021 23:05

@Selkiesarereal

Our glorious leader is a feminist to her fingertips so I expect she’ll be out to defend us on a personal video very soon…
The Teflon is wearing very thin on her and her crew now what with the £600,000 lost down the back of the sofa in that household. Maybe Mr Sturgeon didn’t check behind the cushions? Maybe “ the dear leader “ is too busy baking French fancies to look for the money.
Waitwhat23 · 11/08/2021 23:07

@Selkiesarereal

Our glorious leader is a feminist to her fingertips so I expect she’ll be out to defend us on a personal video very soon…
Yes, like her video condemning the corrective rape threats made towards Joanna Cherry by a member of the SNP...oh, wait....
Enough4me · 11/08/2021 23:19

Good news is that the government have to respond to the request to register sex as well as gender of sexual abusers as over 10k have petitioned...but still need more signatures to really make the point that recording the sex of sexual abusers matters.
petition.parliament.uk/petitions/590123

Does anyone else have similar places to register against the trans movement to degrade women's spaces?

If I can vote for against the changes in Scotland I would too. It's all a load of twisted shite to oppress women.

Waitwhat23 · 11/08/2021 23:42

@enoughforme a very similarly worded petition to the Scottish Parliament managed to get 12,834 signatures and is currently being discussed.

Do I think it will do any good? Probably not. The Scottish Government's policy is TWAW (although they haven't made this public) and they keep saying it's a matter for Police Scotland, who are of course of the opinion that TWAW.

I do hope the petition you've linked will make a difference. Hopefully the UK Government is less down the rabbit hole than the Scottish Government.

Enough4me · 11/08/2021 23:49

@Waitwhat23 is the petition still live to add a link?
It's still better than nothing and the more publicity the better.

Waitwhat23 · 11/08/2021 23:53

No it's closed. It was impressive that it got to almost 13,000 signatories though - I think it was one of the most signed petitions at that point. Just shows the strength of feeling, even if we can't state it openly.

Enough4me · 12/08/2021 00:04

Good to hear that it had a relatively high number of signatures to stand out. I'm going to keep looking out for petitions. I work for a large 'we love Stonewall' organisation so cannot start or be named on them.

FOJN · 12/08/2021 00:08

Good news is that the government have to respond to the request to register sex as well as gender of sexual abusers as over 10k have petitioned...but still need more signatures to really make the point that recording the sex of sexual abusers matters.

More than a 100k signatures and they have to discuss it in Parliament, share the petition link with anyone you think will sign.

PurgatoryOfPotholes · 12/08/2021 00:35

[quote nocturnalcatfreetogoodhome]@Wroxie

You do not have the right to invalidate other’s trauma and experiences just because it is not in line with your own ideation.

Trauma is subjection and manifests in extremely individualistic ways. I hope you experience more compassion at your worst than you are exuding now.

No one is excusing any racism/transphobia whatever. We are saying that when a woman (or man - CIS or otherwise) come forward as a victim of abuse that their needs should be prioritised over those of the counsellors.

If a woman in a hijab or a niqab has been violated in inexplicable ways and finds comfort in sharing her ordeal with someone of the same faith is she racist? No, sit her down with the counsellor in the hijab and prioritise the victim’s feelings.

If a woman has been assaulted and all that is sticking in her mind her attacker’s Adam’s apple and she is now having to divulge the worst moments of her life to someone and all she can see is the Adam’s apple and it’s taking her right back is her trauma suddenly invalidated? No, sit her down with the counsellor who does not have an Adam’s apple.

If the person who attacked you had shoulder length curly hair and you find it triggering to be in the presence of someone with shoulder length curly hair then let’s bring in someone who’s ginger.

A woman has been abused by her same sex partner she may seek comfort in the presence of a man, does that make her misogynistic. No, her brain is fucking BEGGING for her to be in the presence of someone who is entirely different to her attacker.

If a black woman had been attacked by a white man and she found the presence of white skin claustrophobic does that make her racist? FUCKING NO because even if you don’t find these things triggering doesn’t give you a right to say that others are out of order or dramatic or whatever else.

These may appear irrational and sexist/racist/transphobic/whatever but you know what else is irrational? Rape. These people have every excuse in the book not to be fucking rational because they have been abused in the worst ways possible and their trust in others and their belief in humanity has been irreparably tainted and they deserve to feel safe regardless of how ‘irrational’ it may seem.

You do not become a rape crisis counsellor to have your feelings validated. You are there FOR THE VICTIM and if the counsellors are not prepared to experience these people at their lowest and most vulnerable and all the fucked up shitness that entails then they are in the wrong profession.

Sometime a rape crisis counsellor of certain backgrounds and persuasions is simply not wanted and that is ok. Why? Because to the next person who comes along their presence may be nirvana and they could be entirely what that victim needs.

A transgender woman will be invaluable to a rape crisis centre because trans women deserve a safe place too and their presence may be just what they need. However if a victim comes in and says I feel really uncomfortable talking to a trans woman I want xyz then that does not give that trans counsellor (or any other counsellor) to make that victim feel any shitter than they already do.

HOW IS THIS DIFFICULT?![/quote]
Perfect Post

Tisha0 · 12/08/2021 01:00

Just wanted to ask - I couldn’t find this thread again in “Active” or listed on “AIBU”, I could only reach it by going into Threads “I’m on” - is this being hidden from general view somehow?

Comingoutfighting · 12/08/2021 01:28

This reply has been deleted

Message deleted by MNHQ. Here's a link to our Talk guidelines.

ThumbWitchesAbroad · 12/08/2021 02:20

I agree that @nocturnalcatfreetogoodhome's post is absolutely perfect.

It really comes to something when the wants of the supposed counsellors are prioritised over the needs of the traumatised users of the service. That is completely inappropriate and renders the service unfit for purpose.

I went to sign the petition and got a very polite email back telling me I'd actually already signed it, which isn't surprising but I'd forgotten!

And I'm VERY glad this is back in AIBU where it should be.

ThumbWitchesAbroad · 12/08/2021 02:22

Separate post just in case - I'm fast coming to believe that the controversial group being discussed in this thread do NOT constitute "vulnerable" or "oppressed" minorities any longer, as they seem to have their "rights" trumpeted and catered for above anyone else's. Doesn't sound very "oppressed" to me! Angry

CharlieParley · 12/08/2021 03:03

YANBU