To ask Aquarium to put a radar lock on the disabled toilet

[Worrysaboutalot]

We went to a large aquarium centre today for DC2’s birthday. It was very busy with many families enjoying the centre. We had a great day out

As I am in a wheelchair, I have no choice in which bathroom I can use, I had to use the disabled toilet.

I had to wait until a mother and a couple of younger kids came out of the disabled toilet which surprised me. As it looked unlikely that any of the younger kids would need nappies.

Then I went in this was a dedicated disabled (not accessible) toilet with no baby change facilities! I do understand that the first mother might have an invisible disability, as might her children. So thought no more on it.

All the time I was in, the door handle was being rattled and I kept calling out that the toilet was occupied, which was frustrating.
When I left and an impatient mother with a pram was waiting to go in. I told her that there was no nappy changing facilities in that toilet, assuming she wanting to change the baby. But she snapped at me that she was a mother and had to use this toilet gesturing to the pram.

I felt that this second mother was just entitled and rude. Having a pram doesn’t entitle you to use a disabled toilet. Use the end toilet in the women’s bathroom, with the door open and the pram in the toilet doorway, like everyone else does.

Years ago, I had 4 kids under 6yo at one stage and I never used the disability toilets, except for the baby changing ones for baby changing purposes.

Therefore, AIBU to have asked the aquarium centre to add a radar lock to the bathroom. AS this was the ONLY disabled toilet, and the baby change facilities were separate. To increase the likelihood of ringfencing these limited facilities for those who actually need them, rather than those people who want to use them.

What you’re trying to do @Innocenta is put yourself higher up the scale of disabilities and guilt trip people like me into not using “your” disabled toilet because my need isn’t equivalent.

That’s just wrong.

I’ve every bit as much right to use it as you do.

@sofiegiraffe I am a mum with a pram. It’s perfectly possible to use a standard toilet cubicle if you leave the pram outside and carry the baby. It’s just not easy or convenient. Let’s be honest, that’s the main reason why most mums are using the disabled loo, convenience. Not because there’s genuinely no alternative. Which is the reason for the OP.

@Lumpwoody

What you’re trying to do *@Innocenta* is put yourself higher up the scale of disabilities and guilt trip people like me into not using “your” disabled toilet because my need isn’t equivalent.

That’s just wrong.

I’ve every bit as much right to use it as you do.

You're clearly very threatened by the fact that other people do, in fact, have different levels of disability to you. I truly don't understand this - why does it matter to you how disabled anyone else is? I've said again and again (well over ten times by now) that I have no problem with an invisibly disabled person choosing to use the disabled loo. I'm even at the more relaxed end about abled parents.

How many times do I need to say it? Or is it just that you want me to utter the shibboleth of all disabilities being the same, and I won't?

[quote IceandIndigo]@sofiegiraffe I am a mum with a pram. It’s perfectly possible to use a standard toilet cubicle if you leave the pram outside and carry the baby. It’s just not easy or convenient. Let’s be honest, that’s the main reason why most mums are using the disabled loo, convenience. Not because there’s genuinely no alternative. Which is the reason for the OP.[/quote]
I mean, just look at the responses I'm getting for talking about being a wheelchair user on this thread...! Even as someone who actually doesn't really mind the occasional parent nipping in (especially with lots of young kids, twins, etc).

But then what do you want from people @Innocenta? Do you just want acknowledgment that your needs are greater than others despite the fact that you agree everyone has equal right to use the toilet? I don’t know what else you could want?

So what did you mean by your statement that those who could walk into a normal toilet didn’t have an equivalent need?

Can you please explain. What relevance has whether or not I can walk into the normal loos to my need to use the disabled toilet?

@IceandIndigo

I disagree that it's possible to properly use a toilet and remove/ button back up trousers etc with a baby in one arm. It might be for you. Not for everyone. And the OP suggested that mothers with prams should leave the toilet door open - which was my original reason for posting on this thread because I object strongly and vehemently to that. I find it to be an utterly disrespectful and undignified suggestion and something I would never expect of anyone, able bodied or otherwise.

@Kanaloa

But then what do you want from people *@Innocenta*? Do you just want acknowledgment that your needs are greater than others despite the fact that you agree everyone has equal right to use the toilet? I don’t know what else you could want?

I would just like to be able to discuss the situation and talk about being a wheelchair user, what that involves, etc - stuff like why some of us might be more anxious, e.g. risk of ruining equipment - without getting such negative responses.

Time and again I've been out with my parents (before getting married), and my mum in particular has been SO annoyed by seemingly abled people who've been using a disabled loo. And I always had a quiet word about invisible disabilities! So it's upsetting to get this pile-on of accusations when my main point isn't that no one else should ever use the disabled, but just that our experiences can be different. I also know some ambulatory wheelchair users who happily use the regular loos!

Fwiw, if OP had suggested mums should just balance baby on their laps while they pee, I'd have probably not reacted so strongly! I'd have pointed out that I personally would find it extremely difficult to almost impossible to use a toilet with a baby on one arm; but I wouldn't have felt as strongly as I do about the suggestion of leaving the loo door open. I can't get my head around how anyone can genuinely think that's an appropriate expectation of a human being.

@Lumpwoody

So what did you mean by your statement that those who could walk into a normal toilet didn’t have an equivalent need?

Can you please explain. What relevance has whether or not I can walk into the normal loos to my need to use the disabled toilet?

I've already explained every aspect of this in previous posts. You can review them if you choose to - see especially those where I clarify the unique aspects of a chair user's experience, and those where I clarify that in talking about group experiences, it's not realistically possible to allude to every possible variation.

If you keep asking this question, I will not respond again, since the answers are in the thread.

But @Innocenta the thread is about able bodied people using disabled toilet facilities.

If you want to discuss your particular issues it would be worth starting your own thread (and I really mean that - I have things I struggle with due to my disability and it would be interesting to see if I could learn anything from your experience)

But this thread is about Able bodied people using disabled toilets.

@Kanaloa thanks for acknowledging I never said "made up bs". It might seem a bit silly and over-sensitive, I know, but that upset me as I have so many friends with invisible disabilities and a long experience of it myself, before getting my first (part-time) mobility aid. I actually think invisible disabilities are generally very under-recognised and should be far better accommodated in society; I'm the absolute last person to consider them made up!

No it was my bad. It was actually said by another poster but then the post was deleted. Because the rest of their post was similar to your opinions on wheelchair users the two became muddled up in my head. That’s the problem with deleting posts so quickly sometimes!

I'm absolutely astounded by this thread and greatly saddened as well. Accessible toilets are not for anyone who wants to use them they're for people with disabilities, including invisible impairments which mean they have the right to an accessible bathroom - this is a reasonable adjustment campaigned for by disability rights groups and underpinned by the equality act. Having a disability is a protected characteristic

Having a pram is not an impairment or a protected characteristic and I think to blithely say you have an equal right to that accessible bathroom is hugely ignorant and massively dismissive of our fellow human beings with disabilities who only have this option of the accessible facilities to use.

OP I do t know if you are still reading this and I hope you are ok. I hope you feel able to contact the aquarium and raise this issue with them and I do hope you receive a more thoughtful and considerate response than you have here.

[quote IceandIndigo]@sofiegiraffe I am a mum with a pram. It’s perfectly possible to use a standard toilet cubicle if you leave the pram outside and carry the baby. It’s just not easy or convenient. Let’s be honest, that’s the main reason why most mums are using the disabled loo, convenience. Not because there’s genuinely no alternative. Which is the reason for the OP.[/quote]
Exactly!
OP’s suggestion about leaving the toilet door open is and probably the reason for the vitriol but I can see why she’s frustrated.
It’s not the fact that people are using it but the sheer entitlement.

I'm a Mother with a baby in a pushchair, and during the holidays a 5 year old too as my husband works full time.

1. I'm not leaving children outside the toilet on their own.
2. I'm not pissing with the door open for all and sundry to see me. I'm allowed dignity and privacy just as you are! What if i'm on my period?
3. I'm not sitting my wobbly baby on a dirty toilet floor where she could fall and bang her head.
4. The baby is too heavy for me to hold whilst i'm pulling my pants up and down.
5. What about Mothers with twins or two very small/close in age.

I live in a rural county, we don't have 'family' toilets here. My bladder is not what it was since I had my children, if I need the loo when out on my own with the children, it's either disabled/accesible toilet or piss my pants.

There are unique aspects to every disabled persons experience though, that doesn’t make anyone’s more important in in need for the reasonable adjustments

Posted a bit too soon there.... yes of course disabled people have specific needs and but other people also have needs that can't be met by standard public toilets and that isn't their fault.

When DS was little I used to stand him outside the cubicle or park his pram outside and ask him to sing a song - was an easy way to know he was happy and safe without having to leave door open (was slightly ajar and not locked but all nicely private)

OP’s suggestion about leaving the toilet door open is

I'd argue it's disrespectful and dismissive of the human need for privacy and dignity, as opposed to merely being an eye-roll moment. For me it was more of a jaw on the floor, wtf did I just read moment.

@Heckythump1

Posted a bit too soon there.... yes of course disabled people have specific needs and but other people also have needs that can't be met by standard public toilets and that isn't their fault.

Thai

*This! Not Thai 😂

It was a shocking suggestion, especially as it was followed by ‘like everyone else does’ as if it’s normal and acceptable to expect mums to use the toilet with an open door in a public place.

I'm not pissing with the door open for all and sundry to see me. I'm allowed dignity and privacy just as you are! What if i'm on my period?

Doesn't matter if you're on your period or not. Privacy and dignity when using the toilet is a basic human right. One which mothers with prams should apparently happily forfeit.

@Sirzy

There are unique aspects to every disabled persons experience though, that doesn’t make anyone’s more important in in need for the reasonable adjustments

Agree 100%