To think she had this baby out of spite?

[Nineteeneightynine]

Name changed because on the off chance the woman in question uses MN i don't want her knowing who i am by my posting history.

I'll call her Sarah.

Sarah was in a relationship with 'John' and the pair had a child. After 6 years together the relationship came to an end - but during the final 2 years of the relationship Sarah had multiple terminations of unplanned pregnancies because she didn't want more children and the pair were growing apart. The split, however, was instigated by her.

They broke up and 18 months later John met and began a relationship with somebody else. They got engaged and conceived a baby.

Sarah then decided she wanted him back after all.

At this point Sarah became even more difficult (think using her existing child as a weapon)

When Johns partner was heavily pregnant Sarah orchestrated a situation whereby she and John would be alone together, think special occasion under the guise of being for their child's benefit. Alcohol was involved.

Sarah made a pass at John, and because John is a selfish idiot and wasn't getting much 'action' at home with his heavily pregnant fiance, he reciprocated and they had a one night stand. John claims Sarah told him she was on the contraceptive implant so they didn't need to use a condom. John didn't question it and was happy to proceed without.

Soon after, very soon indeed, almost as if she was waiting to test, Sarah tells John she's pregnant and wants him to get back together with her "for their family" and try again.

John doesn't want to re-enter the relationship and wants to stay with his then current partner, who was expected to give birth any day.

Sarah decides that actually 'now' (then) is the perfect time to bring another child into the world and she would be having the baby regardless. Issues ultimatums. Briefly stops contact between John and his existing child when John says he doesn't want another.

Bare in mind that before the relationship ended, Sarah was adamant she didn't want any more children and exercised her right to terminate multiple pregnancies because the time wasn't right and the relationship was failing. It was only after seeing John settling down with somebody else she changed her mind.

Johns partner found out and was understandably crushed, now years later has to co-parent and see that (yes totally innocent) child on a regular basis.

WIBU to believe that Sarah, with all of the above taken into consideration, had this child out of spite?

Oh bollocks. Now he’s got a learning disability? Right.

If he’s got adult mental capacity and can hold down a job and get married and bring up kids, he can understand that sex results I. pregnancy. Stop letting John off the hook for being selfish and reckless. If you’re a relative, I’d suggest you, his wife and anyone else involved stops making excuses for this idiotic man.

[quote Howshouldibehave]I hope it’s not this John, he won’t have time to do any plumbing with all these children

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/am_i_being_unreasonable/4312439-who-is-right-here[/quote]
Hmmm yes, well spotted. Are you Katie op?

Has John not heard of STD's as a reason to wear a condom whilst being unfaithful to his oblivious pregnant partner? Selfish git.

Johns a bit of a catch. Not!

@Imnothereforthedrama

Yeah I agree the multiple terminations is most probably exaggerated. I doubt you can have multiple on the nhs ( though I’m no expert) so these would of been paid for privately. I suspect she’s had 2 max , I really think you need to stop believing John’s version of events . Do you know Sarah personally to ask her ? If so ask her why the multiple terminations then another unplanned pregnancy after unprotected sex . I suspect you will have a different version of events .

I do know Sarah personally yes. Quite well infact.

I know of three terminations.

There is no limit to the amount of terminations somebody is able to have on the NHS.

@Nineteeneightynine

I'm related to John, so I also know Sarah very well. I may ask for this specific reply of mine to be deleted shortly as I don't want to out myself but want to make clear that I'm neither of the people that posters think I am.

The reason I have put emphasis on Sarah duping John about contraception is because John is gullible and easy to manipulate - as a result of conditions he has. He has aspergers and mild LD's.

Don't get me wrong he's not disabled to the extent he's not able to have relationships, work etc and be a father but he is more malleable to manipulation and I do fully believe he was manipulated to an extent.

Don't get me wrong he's not disabled to the extent he's not able to have relationships, work etc and be a father

Yes, evidently!

It doesn't wash, sorry. You don't know even half of what you claim or imply to know, and if John is responsible enough to be a father then he's responsible enough to keep it in his pants. Funny how the LDs and AS made an appearance only after after endless "Sarah orchestrated", "Sarah decided" and "Sarah wanted" failed to convince anyone that Sarah was responsible for John shitting on his family.

John is entirely responsible for this shitshow and all the resulting pain. If he doesn't want to keep repeating the cycle, he would do well to remember that rather than cast around for reasons why the truly bad one is the woman who didn't abort. And you'd do well for him not to indulge that bullshit fantasy. Tell John to zip up.

Hmmm yes, well spotted. Are you Katie op?

No, that isn't my thread.

This is the only one I've posted about this situation.

I think the reason is going to be much more complicated than "spite"!

“John” should have kept it in his pants, as they say.

They both sound like prize bell ends. Poor kids….

John knows how babies are made.

John knows how to prevent babies being made.

End of.

Sarah might be a grade A arsehole, but your excuses for him are misogyny.

Doubt if Sarah would take on life long responsibility for a child just to “ get back” at John. Where is your concern for the child caught up in all of this?
I’m just going to say it- if John didn’t care enough about Sarah’s previous pregnancies, which were totally her right to chose to terminate , to use condoms then why do you think Sarah would assume he would care enough about this latest pregnancy to go back to her?
If you know John I would suggest you download information about vasectomies and give it to him as soon as possible and then move on with your life.

The baby is here now. So the motivation of Sarah doesnt really matter anymore.

John was an idiot, and it's his current partner and kids who are paying the price.

And really, “John” and “Sarah” deserve each other …

The final part is: she had this baby, because they had sex.

Jeremy Kyle was designed for people like you 🙄

I don’t understand.
If you’re not Sarah or John then it’s not really any of your business. Leave them two to sort it between them.

Agatha Christie is turning in her grave

It's a very one sided telling of the story.

And unless you are John or Sarah I don't think you'll ever know what happened or what was said.

Does Sarah seem to be lovingly and happily preparing for her new child? Because then it seems she isn't having a baby 'out of spite' any more than John's current partner, whoever she may be.

Funny how the LDs and AS made an appearance only after after endless "Sarah orchestrated", "Sarah decided" and "Sarah wanted" failed to convince anyone that Sarah was responsible for John shitting on his family.

Is it?

I can assure you those things have always applied however don't absolve him of responsibility, are relevant to mention when people scoff at the implication there was any manipulation.

It is very offensive, unless you are Sarah herself, to say that there was "categorically" no abuse.

You absolutely cannot say that on behalf of someone else. In this day and age we should all know better than to assume abuse only happens in stereotypical wife beater situations.

If you are Sarah herself you should probably come clean after saying something like that. As if you are literally anyone else I have nothing but contempt for you. I hope you know how damaging you are to women who actually suffer. Are you a man? The amount of misogyny coming off of all of your posts is unbearable.

This is one of those threads where the drip feeds keep coming so the OP can justify what they have said previously.
Maybe sarah was spiteful, maybe not, maybe John is easily manipulated, maybe not,
What is definite is theres at least 3 kids dragged into this sorry mess.
So yes OP you are being unreasonable to start this thread three years after the event just so you can get a bunch of people online to agree that a child presumably whom you know very well Was brought into the world by its mum out of spite.

Does his disability prevent him from understanding that the past several times he’d gotten Sarah pregnant were direct consequences of him having sex with her? I doubt it.

He sounds selfish and unkind. She may have been spiteful. You don’t know because you haven’t heard every side of it and are determined to make John a manipulated side character in his own choices.

All I get out of this is that John's a dick and should have sorted his own contraception

The final part is: she had this baby, because they had sex.

Exactly this!

John and Sarah had sex. John and Sarah conceived a baby from that sex. Neither of them are more or less to blame than the other.

You’ve heard John’s story about how he was manipulated into bed by Sarah. Sarah would have told her friends the other side about how John manipulated her into bed.
They were both consenting adults who willing had sex with each other.