Already given savings, DSS wants more.

[ScottyandWestie]

Posting here for traffic as feeling terribly conflicted and a bit taken for granted.
DSS mid twenties has been round with his girlfriend asking for cash from us toward a house deposit.
Due to covid husband had to take a pay cut and we don't really have anything to give right now.
DSS knows we have a couple of thousand set aside as DSD will be 21 in February and we have approx 5k to give her as we did DSS on his 21st. It's a saving plan we did for each of them since they were young children.
He and his girlfriend were complaining about house prices and I know it's awful, the 5k he had from us seemed to go on holidays and bits for his cycling hobby.
We dont have anything to give and while DSD knows the money is coming to her she has said she will keep it in savings, she has no plans to spend it.
DSS girlfriend was making me feel guilty as her Dad is helping them out, but we don't have the spare cash and we have already given him 5K. It's not our fault he spent it.
I do not want to ask DSD and I feel the money should be protected he shouldn't have any access to it at all but he is pushing my husband, his father to speak to DSD about it.
My husband and myself never had any family financial help, I appreciate getting on the housing ladder was easier years ago but this isn't his money. Also what will happen when DSD needs it?
As I'm not his parent it's awkward but I feel husband should not even entertain the idea of asking DSD to give it to her brother.
Any suggestions?

What effort have they put in ?

And over what time period.

It's so difficult, isn't it, OP, money is such an emotional issue in most families.

You have been very generous in giving them £5K, that's not something I ever received from my family--they weren't in a position to give even that much and that's fine. But you've given your SS a lovely and generous gift already.

And it's very important that you're being fair by giving SD the same amount. There is no logical reason why she should miss out in order for her brother to buy a bigger house.

Keep repeating calmly that, sadly, you guys aren't in a position to spare further cash for them beyond the £5K you've already given them. Think of yourself as a broken record that keeps saying it, no matter what he and his girlfriend come back with. They will (maybe) learn something really valuable from the experience of managing their finances well.

😮😮😮😮

I read stories like this and my stress levels immediately raise. I have three boys and I hope they never have this entitled attitude. My husband and I never had any financial help to buy our home or anything else we own. Hard work got us where we are. Children need to learn the value of money.

They need to cut their cloth according to their means. If they can get on the ladder at all, that's good enough. You absolutely don't need to help them buy a bigger house. Also, who buys their dream house in their twenties??? There's no guarantee it will still be their dream house 10 years down the line.

Really, the biggest issue is that you need to be fair to all of your children. If you give him your DSD's money, how would that make her feel?! Don't do it. He got his share, which was very generous and helpful of you already, and that is that.

Furniture but can but second hand

If they're looking at a nice new build and like spending money I can't see them going for second hand furniture

Well done for sticking up for your DSD, and sorry your DH took it out on you. Similar happens with our NC inlaws, they get in contact and then DH takes out his anger towards me and then we go back to being happy and happy in our decision we no longer see them and haven’t for many years.

Hopefully your DSS will be suitable embarrassed at some point that he tried to take his sisters money and will want to come to the family meal. And if it takes longer than that for things to get back to normal then that’s ok too, you have done nothing wrong.

@BarbaraofSeville You are right, absolutely nothing will be second hand. Our loft and spare room are full of things they have bought for the house that we said they could store here. Think practical things like towels, kitchen pans and pillows and then also non essentials like a Christmas tree and outdoor Christmas light up snowmen that were in the sale in January and the girlfriend had to have. I laugh about it usually as it's funny to me that they are so excited to get the stuff and it's organised, however pointing out their tastes may change etc has fallen on deaf ears entirely.

Oh my why all their stuff stored at your place tell them to take them away into proper storage unit or if they renting their place.
This is the time to ask them to move their as they be sulking at ye for days/weeks who knows
It ridiculous taking over your spare room and attic.

@lastcall

You're doing the right thing, OP. Absolutely the right thing.

Your DSS and his girlfriend have shown their true colours, and they're ugly ugly ugly.

I'm particularly flabbergasted that a 'girlfriend' feels perfectly free to moan and wail and cry to her boyfriend's parent and step parent whilst demanding their hard-earned money! The entitlement is stunning!

Indeed. Truly entitled and rude.

As they have been buying goodies for this house, for so long, I guess the subject of where to get the deposit from must have come up before. Have they never broached alternative ways; have they never said the are not sure that they'll be able to afford to buy? Has nobody ever said: " Why are you buying goods for the house, when you might not be able to afford to move for six years?"

They've got the idea that they are buying something. Any house requires is a sizable deposit.

Their attitude doesn't make sense.

I totally agree with the other poster that it isn't just a deposit, it is solicitor fees, and removal, etc. If they can't between them raise 3.5 grand, and say can you, DH, granny, auntie, godfather add something to make it up to £5k ( to go with the gift from Girlfriend's parents) are they honestly well off enough to get the house?

[quote ScottyandWestie]@BarbaraofSeville You are right, absolutely nothing will be second hand. Our loft and spare room are full of things they have bought for the house that we said they could store here. Think practical things like towels, kitchen pans and pillows and then also non essentials like a Christmas tree and outdoor Christmas light up snowmen that were in the sale in January and the girlfriend had to have. I laugh about it usually as it's funny to me that they are so excited to get the stuff and it's organised, however pointing out their tastes may change etc has fallen on deaf ears entirely. [/quote]
Where are they living now?

Do you know approx what % of a deposit they have saved?

Did you say if the CF girlfriend knows the SS already had his £5k? What did she say about that?

There’s is no money to give him. End of
No buts and what ifs and whys

Good for you for standing up for your DSD. My parents didn't, and my brother got everything. Lots of promises that it would be 'my turn' at some point but by then the money was all gone. By the end of my parents lives I viewed them very differently and I stay away from my brother and sil now. A lot of the 'poor us we need help' was my SIL, but I didn't fight for myself against the combined forces of parents and brother/SIL. I 'kept the peace', but of course all that meant is they got everything they wanted and I've ended up not being bothered if I see them or not, as I can't respect them after all the manipulation and selfishness.

Tell them to sell the stuff they have stored at yours to pay towards their deposit and anything else not needed.

Ooh I would love to be a fly on the wall for the mortgage application. If she's crying now over not having this cash, how will she cope when the bank says no?

@ScottyandWestie

Yes the girlfriends father is giving them money and lending them money too. They have their eyes on an expensive new build.

I 'have my eye' on a mansion with a swimming pool. Doesn't mean I'm going to get it! And I certainly wouldn't want to get it by manipulating family members!

I'm genuinely quite shocked at the awful, entitled behaviour from your DSS and his girlfriend. They should be ashamed of themselves for abusing you and giving you the waterworks over the phone.
If DSS was that bothered about a house he shouldn't have pissed the 5k you gave him up the wall. He needs to live within his means.

@ScottyandWestie

DSD is coming round tomorrow so money can be transferred to a LISA. Husband has spoken to her this morning as neither of us want her badgered by DSS and when the money is gone it's gone. There is nothing that can be done. DSS Will have to get on with things himself. DSD wants to use it toward a house in the future but as that's a long way off and she is planning on traveling next year it's safer to be inaccessible for her. Husband and I both very shocked at girlfriends behavior and it's left us quite upset. She was crying yesterday and really laying it on thick. With the benefit of a poor nights sleep both husband and I are left quite cold about her behaviour and the kind of person she is. We knew DSS was selfish he always has been, but the pair of them together and so manipulative, I feel like we've seen the mask slip and it's not nice. I think we will have to be wary going forth concerning anything financial.

I am so glad that DSD has agreed to this , it will mean that her brother and cf gf can not get their stick mitts on DSD money ,

I agree with pp , the remaining 1k can be put into a shorter term savings account to be used for travel / insurance or just blowing on what ever DSD wants . if she is feeling very generous she can buy her brother and his GF a new key fob each when the do get the keys to their new cheaper home

So sorry to read this.

I was always giving my son money when he asked, until one day when my daughter said that she was frightened that when I died, my son would start asking her for money.

From that day on I told him that I would no longer 'give' him money, but was always happy to lend it on the understanding he would pay me back.

Just say no. Give the step daughter the sum you have saved for her. the step son has had his £5k and that's that. However his girl friend might want a contract with him that if they split up she gets the money her parents put in back and he has no claims on it - they should discuss this with their solicitor or she might want a higher share than her non contributing boy friend or his parents may be making it as a loan in which case they need a written loan agreement.

This is awful and I would not involve DSD, that money is hers, not your DSS’, it’s nothing to do with him and he’s already had his on his 21st. How bloody entitled. Even if you had piles of cash he’s not entitled to be helped towards a house, my parents are pretty wealthy and have never helped any of us with deposits and we none of us feel entitled to their help. They helped with, you know, paying for our upbringing and helping us with university, they’re not just blank cheque books for god’s sake. But if you literally don’t have the money (his sister's money shouldn’t enter the equation) then it’s even worse he’s pressuring you. What a nasty piece of work.

^Terhou

If £5K is really going to make a difference in terms of their ability to buy, they could raise it by way of a loan relatively easily.^

That wouldn’t be acceptable as deposit to a mortgage lender.

The most important thing to remember about your DSS and GF is that it seems very clear that if they are so desperately in need of your DSD's 5k, then they not only cannot afford to buy the house, they likely can't afford the mortage. I guarantee it would be within a year that they would be asking for help to make a monthly payment. Homeownership can bring unexpected costs at anytime and they want to buy in the hottest market for years!

These two need some serious financial education and to learn the term "house poor" (meaning when you sink too much of your income into buying a home that you have to cut drastically back on too many other areas of your life, so you barely make ends meet).

I'm probably a bit too cautious about this but my first attorney job out of law school in California was for a firm that represented banks in foreclosure proceedings, this was just after the 2008 financial collapse. That was grim work and I felt so sorry for the people losing their homes but when I'd review the financials, case after case it became clear that so many people had bought more expensive homes than they could afford on unrealistic expectations of monthly costs.

@Xenia, AFAIK the kind of contracts/written agreements you mention, are not enforceable under U.K. law.

I certainly know of a case where a divorcing couple had had substantial help with a house purchase from one spouse’s parent. The other spouse refused absolutely to take this into account during the split - claimed - and was awarded - half of it.

I understand your shock at their behaviour. They are probably of the view that dont ask, dont get. I had a colleague who told me that her parents in law had said that they would match what they saved. They saved 1000 quid. Her parents have her 8000 as a gift, so they set up a savings account and dripped it in each month and presented this as evidence of their savings. How anyone could treat their parents like that was beyond me.

He can fuck off, he pissed his money up the wall, boo hoo.

This. What an absurd idea, to give him DSD's gift! This DSD is a class-A greedy twat, who clearly doesn't care about his DF or DSis. The DSD needs protecting from this jerk!

@doodleygirl

This has been created into such a drama when it didn't need to be.

DSS asked for money, your husband should have said, nope, nothing in the pot. Move onto next topic. Instead DSD gets told and it unfolds like a nasty soap opera. This could so easily have been avoided.

Well it's lucky the OP's SD did find out, because her SS approached her and was obviously dropping hints.