To be upset this woman was bitchy towards me all night?

[Cherrysummer]

I went out with a few friends last night, one of my friends brought a few others, including one women who I’ve met loads over the years and have always been fine with.

I say always been fine with, I saw her at a party a few weeks ago and noticed she was a bit ‘off’ but there was no reason as to why so I tried to not take it personally and tbh haven’t really thought that much of it.

Last night, within 5 minutes of turning up, I heard this woman say to 2 others ‘I just don’t like her, I don’t know why.’ And heard the 2 others say ‘which one is it, which one don’t you like?’ My friend was talking to me but I was pretty in tune to this conversation and could see them all looking over at me out of the corner of my eye. I sat there thinking wtf?! I’ve known her for years, everything’s always been fine, I’ve never been anything but nice and kind to her.

All night she was throwing me dirty looks, I’d never met the 2 women she came with before but met both throughout the evening and they were distinctly cold and again, I could just see them giving me dirty looks all the time.

I didn’t say anything to anyone as I didn’t want any drama and to spoil anyone else’s evening but it really spoiled my evening. I was upset when I got home, told DH and he said I should’ve confronted her, I said I know but I didn’t have any hard proof she was talking about me and she’d have just denied it I’m sure.

The trouble is, this isn’t the first time someone has taken a dislike to me for no reason. It’s happened Id say about 5 times over the course of my life, I can hand on heart say I haven’t ever done anything to these women but they’ve all seemed to hate me and relish telling everyone and have tried to alienate me from others.

DH upset me last night and said ‘it’s because you’re too nice, they see it as a weakness and you are a bit meek with confrontation you have to admit so you’re an easy target. You do need to toughen up a bit and start standing up for yourself.’

I know he’s right to a degree, but you know what, I know, with confidence that I haven’t ever done anything to the woman in Q last night, or to any of the other women who’ve taken issue with me over the years, my only crime has been being polite and friendly to them and so I’m sorry, but I don’t feel like I want to give them the reaction they so desperately want. Why should I put myself through the emotional stress of confrontation when I haven’t done anything wrong and they’re just being bitchy twats? Last night, in the end, every time I came into contact with this women I was OVERLY nice because I thought fuck it, she’s being ridiculous, she knows she is, hopefully it’ll make her see what a knob she’s being. She was visibly irritated by me being nice to her, you could see it on her face.

I just felt really stupid and belittled and I’m not sure if anyone else noticed these 3 being funny with me, but if they did no one called them out or said anything.

This woman has bitched about so many women to me in the past though. Last year she started crying to me, saying that a lady we both know is always funny with her when she sees her, alienates her from the group etc. Funnily enough, I’d had the same experience with this women so consoled her and sympathised with her. How ironic considering last night she then did exactly the same to me.

I know this all sounds really pathetic and teenager, we’re in our 30’s for God’s sake. I just feel really upset by it as it ruined what was otherwise a good evening for me and I’m dreading seeing this woman again.

I really feel like I need to do an assertiveness course or something too because too often I’m seen as the easy target and quite frankly I’ve had enough

She’s just a piece of shit op. Unfortunate when we encounter people like this. She’ll have spent her life bullying and manipulating people.

It is unfortunately correct that this type of bully sniffs out victims who are nice, polite etc. Sorry to say your dh is right about getting a bit tougher. It’s no fault of yours but helps to stave off nasty people.

[quote Cherrysummer]@DrSbaitso, I have NOT said it’s because of how I look. Please stop trying to push your own narrative here. I’ve said it’s definitely something to do with my personality, because you know what, no-one’s perfect in terms of personality, including you![/quote]
How nice!

But once again, the insistence that it's not because of your looks came after a post in which you very heavily implied that it was:

"I have had so many people over the course of my lifetime tell me that people don’t like me because I’m pretty. I know people will think this is a stealth boast, no amount of me protesting that will make people believe it’s not but I promise you it’s not. I’m fucking sick of it, done, totally done. There is fuck all I can do about my looks, I see pretty people all the time and it would never in a million years occur to me to act like a complete cow to them because of how I look. Never. It’s not an acceptable excuse and I wish people would stop using it as one.

I just can’t be arsed with this shit anymore. I don’t know any men that have experienced this, the shit women have to put up with due to other people’s insecurities."

Emphasis mine. Certainly reads to me as though you think there's truth in it.

But if it makes you feel better, I don't think it's about your looks either. If you do think it's about your personality, then based solely on what you've said here - because that's all I've got to go on - I think it's likely that you are coming across across people as insincere and passive aggressive, dressed up as "nice". In your OP you explicitly said that you used being "OVERLY nice" to try to communicate that you thought someone was a knob. Surely you can see that that won't go down well with some people? "You're a knob, but you can't get annoyed with me for communicating it because I'm so OVERLY nice!"

Ultimately, I suppose that, in this thread and to me at least, you just aren't coming over as innocently and sincerely nice as you appear to want people to think. It's that simple.

This woman is a cow anyway. Why do you care what she thinks?

Look up secondary psychopaths, who dont enjoy kindness in other people and think that shows weakness. Usually develops as a result of own insecurities and personal traumas. Nothing you can do to make them see your way. Choices are, if it makes you feel better, do what pp have suggested and confront your friend. But that might come back to you as more drama. Or ignore and don't see these people anymore...

OP you are pretty assertive on this thread!

Totally get you being overly nice if it’s to humour her and kill her with kindness. I would just act (and be!) disinterested if she tried to talk to me, unless it was to give any valid reason why she had been acting that way she had towards me, but from what you’ve said the problem is entirely her own.
I’d be distracted by someone or something else. Give one syllable or ‘ummm…’ answers while checking your phone or looking to join in a different conversation. Must be very horrible to be in the situation she put you in though. From what you’ve said about her she’s done this lots and will continue to do so with many many different people possibly those she’s threatened by. Must be very insecure and sounds like a nasty person who doesn’t deserve any of your time or energy. Once she realises your not going to rise to it she’ll find a new person to dislike. She’s going to be the one ending up disliked by all in the end.

People I think JUST don't like people probably because they're jealous of you. Maybe you looked really good and she didn't like it. If you believe you've done nothing wrong to her I'd just ignore her. Very immature.

You sound lovely and she sounds awful - clearly the kind of person who can only bond with others by uniting with them against an ‘adversary’.

Please don’t feel the need to change you are not the cunt whisperer. It’s not your job to make dickheads like you. The fact that they don’t is their problem, not yours.

I don't think anything can be gained by confronting her and practised 'put downs' are just embarrassing for everyone. It's human nature to not like everyone but it's extremely rude to say it within earshot. If she tries to bitch about other women to you in future just say no and walk away, you're not obliged to engage with her on any level.

Also, for the love of god, can we get away from assuming that if someone dislikes us they must be jealous? I dislike my neighbour because he's an abusive arse hole to everyone he meets, I'm not jealous of him in the slightest.

|If you go on about how adorably nice and pretty you are in this thread it does make you seem a bit narcissistic.

It is possible to not like someone without overtly letting them know.

She didn't deliberately let you know though I think (unless it was that thing some people do of deliberately saying a thing in a way that you can overhear.) You just happened to overhear her.

I agree with PP people like that are just jealous. She is very jealous of you. Your popularity, your kindness and friendliness.

The only way she can make herself feel better is slag you off. Do you think it was coincidence you heard her? She knew what she was doing. She saw you all happy and talking to other friend and she wanted to hurt you.

Feel sorry for the pathetic cow. Sad sad lonely woman who will never have happiness. And is she continues bitching she will get invited to less and less nights out.

hear hear @chikapu.

There are plenty of good reasons to dislike someone. Jealousy is not a good reason.

I must be terribly socially unaware as I've never seen this happen as an adult in any mums/womens' groups. Definitely at school yes.

I'm sorry you had to experience this. Personally I only ever chat to friends I know. I don't know many people nor make/have many friends for this reason.

You shouldn't have to change of course not but as somebody who has been on the receiving end of a covert scapegoating narcissist trying to eject me from a group, I think that what they pick up on is a similar level of insecurity. They deal with it by projecting on to you. They ''secure'' their place in the group by setting out to exclude.

Having been in this situation twice and finding myself excluded now TWICE by two women who were both awful bitches (but nice to people whose friendships validated them) I would suggest calling her out very very carefully.

Regina, I feel like you're so lovely to everybody else but very cool to me. Is that your intention.

If she says oh no no no then just take her at her word ''I'm so glad''

And if she says ''yeh, I just don't like you'' say

That's ok but can I count on you to disguise your dislike of me for the sake of the others.

Don't get drawn in to any court case about what you did.

If I had a group of friends willing to 'eject' me from their group as a result of what someone else said to them, I'd not want to be part of that group.

This is playground bullshit, not adulthood. Those sorts of 'groups' aren't friends - they are social circles formed for other reasons.

@toocold54

I have had so many people over the course of my lifetime tell me that people don’t like me because I’m pretty.

That will be it. It’s pathetic how some people (females) act when they see an attractive female.
I know it’s hard for you but just remember this is their problem not yours and you don’t want to be friends with someone who are such massive twats!

Being average looking hasn't exempted me from being on the receiving end of covert scapegoaters though.

Often they're kind of similar to me, and yet it seems v important to them that they are clearly ranked ABOVE me, and if i were to do or say something which alerted them to the fact that I'm not aware of hierarchy in their head in which I'm beneath them, then they would be like ICE to me.

So being pretty is not the cause of this behaviour. I am very averagely attractive and have been on the receiving end of this behaviour. Often from women who would also be averagely attractive but they kiss up and kick down. I'm not taking my place as a ''down'' and I am not ''up'' either so they are triggered.

I had this with a work colleague many years ago. I was young and she was older. I was never anything but polite and pleasant to her and she was nasty back. Some people who are basically not very nice don’t like nice, open, what you see is what you get types.

yes. I had the same in reverse. A younger woman at work was secretly very insecure and threatened by the fact that other people liked me. it wasn't even so much that she didn't like me, it was that other people liked me. That's what she hated. She wanted to feel safe in a really clearly defined group of All The Young People together, a gang. And that would have secured her place. But because work obviously it isn't campus, and people click with who they click with, it seemed to infuriate her that I thought I was entitled to join in the chat and talk to younger colleagues. I wasn't following them around at the weekends, but in the tea room, everybody was friendly regardless of age. She was really triggered by my feeling I had the right to talk to people her age. When she left it was so nice. Everything became more inclusive over night. She was a vacuum that woman. It was an eye opening experience. I wonder who she's being vile to now.

This is playground bullshit, not adulthood. Those sorts of 'groups' aren't friends - they are social circles formed for other reasons.

^I agree with this. A lot of people never actually leave the playground in their mentality.

They’re honestly not worth giving any headspace, I think.

I think in anything like this it goes two ways. There’s her stuff and there’s your stuff. Condemning, blaming, dismissing can be comforting but ultimately unhelpful.

Can you approach it with curiosity? “I wonder what’s going on for her? I wonder what I might learn from this?” Etc.

@DavidTheDog

I think in anything like this it goes two ways. There’s her stuff and there’s your stuff. Condemning, blaming, dismissing can be comforting but ultimately unhelpful.

Can you approach it with curiosity? “I wonder what’s going on for her? I wonder what I might learn from this?” Etc.

That's victim blaming.

This reminded me of a manager who joined our team. We got on well at first and then she decided that everything I said or did was wrong. She was an absolute nightmare. Then she sent out an email inviting everyone in the office to her house for a bbq except me - forgetting that, as I was admin I received copies of all the replies!
Then came the Friday afternoon where her DP rang to say he couldn’t pick her up from work until after 7pm. She lived in the sticks and there was no public transport. There was only the two of us left in the office. She told me all about the situation she was in and she was stuck and didn’t know what to do. She may have to ring one of our colleagues who had already left for the day to come back to give her a lift home. I was very sympathetic.
At 5 on the dot I switched off my computer, said goodbye, got in my car and left her there.
It was very satisfactory 😂😂

The trouble is, this isn’t the first time someone has taken a dislike to me for no reason. It’s happened Id say about 5 times over the course of my life, I can hand on heart say I haven’t ever done anything to these women but they’ve all seemed to hate me and relish telling everyone and have tried to alienate me from others.

OK. I would suspect this has happened to a great many of us; if not pretty much everyone. I know it has to me. Talk to anyone and most people will tell you of at least one experience of bullying or exclusion in their lives, or when someone's disliked them and taken no pains to hide the fact. Humans are sadly an aggressive, confrontational species.

I'd suspect the alternative is less common. There are certain naturally inoffensive people to whom others have a tendency to gravitate: about whom no one seems to have a bad word to say, and who seem to make the day better just by being around. IMO, those types are exceptionally rare. Also, just because I respond to them in this way doesn't mean others will. People have likely taken umbrage to them and been unpleasant toward them, too.

What I'm trying to say in this convoluted post is: it's not you. We can't like everyone in this life, and they can't like us. Someone decides they don't? Meh. Let them go whistle. They don't matter; focus on the people you do love, and who love you.

I both agree and disagree with your DH. You don't need to 'stand up for yourself' in this sort of situation. You've done nothing wrong: why defend yourself? The worst thing you can do in this situation is ask 'what is your problem?, or 'have I done something to upset you?' Don't give other people that power, or even consider carrying the baggage of their crap. Dump it back at their feet. It's theirs; it has nothing to do with you.

because I know this kind of thing is hurtful. But I'd simply bin them off and don't associate with them again. Life's too short.

OP I know it’s upsetting but don’t feel you need to defend yourself. I think some ppl are way over analysing the situation as they always do over the internet.

The woman was a nasty cow, that behaviour is bang out of order. On a night out and with a group of people that is terrible and rude. Out of curiosity had she been drinking? I find that alcohol can sometimes bring out the worst in ppl too.

Killing them with kindness also doesn’t work, but I think you will approach differently in future now, by just ignoring!

@me4real

|If you go on about how adorably nice and pretty you are in this thread it does make you seem a bit narcissistic.

It is possible to not like someone without overtly letting them know.

She didn't deliberately let you know though I think (unless it was that thing some people do of deliberately saying a thing in a way that you can overhear.) You just happened to overhear her.

You have extraordinarily poor reading comprehension skills.

Thing about being an adult (and not a school bully) is that its irrelevant if you like people or not. Show some class and treat everyone the same.

@MarieIVanArkleStinks Lovely insightful post