To be scunnered by the state of my lovely new house

[Anythingelseintheboxpandora]

Jesus fucking Christ. Is this normal?!

Two girls - 6 and 4. Moved into a brand new new build not six months ago. It was perfect. We decluttered, they have a huge playroom, ample space etc.

It’s a fucking pigsty now. Toys everywhere. Not a square inch on the floor. They do nothing. They just drag everything out. They put nothing away. Six year old flings herself to the floor in dramatic tears if I have the temerity to ask her to put her barbies away.

And it’s the mixing of toys too. Sylvanian family house full of Lego and barbie shoes. Jenga blocks in the Lego.

I have just flipped my lid. Still no one is tidying. I tidy one room while they trash another.

I’m just…gaaaah!

CrouchEndTiger12 no of course, not too young to be told to put something away and do it without a tantrum - neither is 4. Too young to tidy up a massive jumbled mess into its separate components without an adult providing very structured guidance though.

I had a very similar situation. Once the playroom is in a state like that (mine got so bad I temporarily had to keep the curtains shut), it's an adult job to get it back to useable again.
The only solution I found for keeping toys to the playroom, and not strewn around the entire house, was making "toy prison" - a cardboard box where any toys that were not in the playroom at the end of the day ended up staying for 24 hours. Somehow this worked. Although there was a lot of prison visiting where they made the barbies a toilet and took her meals, (it was during the first lockdown, we were all mildly unhinged) but the upshot was the fact they couldn't move them or take them back to the playroom did encourage all toys to be taken back to the playroom by the end of the day.
Re the actual playroom, I eventually landed on using the Montessori mat idea that I'd seen work well at their pre school. Each child has a mat and whatever they're playing with, if it's on their mat, no one else can touch (think it's meant to encourage turn taking rather than sharing). Anyway, I got two mats and that way, they seemed to take a bit more responsibility for what was their mess. When they played together they used both mats or none at all, but the habit of putting stuff back was starting to stick by then because of the mats, I think.
It took until they were about 9 and 6 for them to really grasp that the room was far nicer to play when they could actually play, as opposed to fall over and break toys because of the Dolly mulch strewn across the entire floor....
Also, I absolutely second massively reducing the amount of toys available at once. Load of research suggesting they are much better off with fewer options.

@UntilYourNextHairBrainedScheme

CrouchEndTiger12 no of course, not too young to be told to put something away and do it without a tantrum - neither is 4. Too young to tidy up a massive jumbled mess into its separate components without an adult providing very structured guidance though.

But that is what I meant....the OP says if she is asked to put her barbies away she throws a tantrum. She is too old for that at 6.

Where did I say that a 6 yo is old enough to clean it all up and take responsibility for it? I didn't!

My DD (slightly older) has ADHD/ASD (as does my husband, probably) and they both really struggle to tidy up. They either do chaos or overly complicated museum curator-esque sorting. I just want to be able to find things and see flat surfaces. DD is getting a bit better over time but I am rigorous about everything having a place.

Are your two making most of the mess at the weekends? Maybe you need to go out more. It's definitely harder to make a big mess if you're out at the park or the pool for half the day.

Plus if you have a cleaner, consider getting one that tidies. Or religiously do one room before bed each night. Or ban toys from one room and put a lock on it! Fill a box with seldom used stuff once every weekend day and put it in the garage/loft, then recycle after 3 months if no-one asks.

Regarding the Lego, we have a set of colour coded drawers and DH and I now find sorting it quite therapeutic. But tbh we like playing more with Lego than DD does...

@gardeninggirl68

what are the consequences of not tidying up?

This.

Behind every badly behaved/uncooperative child is (usually) an ineffectual parent.

I was you many, MANY years ago. It came to a screeching halt when I told my boys to clean their mess up. I, also, had the elder in the floor with a tantrum. I told them "You have one hour, and you will not like what happens." One hour later, the mess was still there. I grabbed a leaf rake, raked everything into large trash bags, and hauled it out to the bins. OH MY, the screaming and crying! Hardest thing I ever did was NOT to give in. That cut down about 80% of their toys, and let them know that when I said to put things away, I MEANT to put things away. They never forgot.

I just never kept many toys out when they were young. They don't need them all at once, and I hate seeing it all out. I never wanted a playroom for that reason - plus they never seem to stay in playrooms with toys unless you sit in that Toy Hell with them

The Lego in the sylvanian house is evidence of creativity. The are making the sylvanians new furniture and toys with Lego. I'd let them. Tidy up (with them) twice a week and let them play. L8mit it to the playroom if too awful.

It sounds like you are putting a lot of blame on them for the state of your house. Of course they’re at the age where they can start to help more and take responsibility for their own mess but it sounds like it’s got out of control which if I’m brutal is on you as the parent. You need to take back control, declutter, do a deep clean, put half the toys away and set up a system and then be firm in getting them to be involved in helping keep on top of it. Teach them how to tidy up, which does involve modelling it yourself and having realistic expectations. They’re not going to suddenly switch from doing no tidying to sorting a whole playroom. Do you have anyone who could take them for a day so you can do a big sort out and start again?

I sympathise, but voted YABU, as it's up to you to enforce a 1 toy out/ 1 toy in system, or a 15 mins tidy up together.

Having said that... we were completely crap at that . Kids were at creche all day so home at 6.30 and cooking dinner while they demolished the house, then not fair to ask youngies to tidy up at bedtime and all tired out.

Good luck with using all the good suggestions above OP!

We had this when DCs were younger. I started filling up a black bin bag. Lessons were learned

ive put tabu as if you're tidying up after them, it sends a big message that mum will be the slave to tidiness

explain if they don't help tidy up a bit each day then the toys will slowly be taken away - an empty room is not untidy

actions have consequences

My 2 are the same age and I’ve also got a bin bag out and started to fill it once when they both wouldn’t tidy up their stuff, the tantrums and screaming etc over it were awful.

After they created such chaos one day I emptied all the IKEA boxes onto the floor and made them help me organise it.
They have gotten slightly better at it, they’re still young.
I wouldn’t be putting up with my 6 year old throwing herself on the floor though, there’d be a separate consequence for that.

As pp’s have said, you need to be firm, and if you ask them to do something, then don’t back down. Ignore the tantrums. I never had a dedicated play room - they played in the sitting room, or their bedrooms when a bit older. I insisted that everything was put away by bedtime, or if visitors were expected. We used to have a ‘wiz round’ - I would put a kitchen timer on for, say 10 minutes, and we all raced to get it tidy. It was a game they enjoyed, and we always managed to complete the task.

I think you need to do several things.

1. Declutter - less stuff =less tidying. If you are worried about accidentally getting rid of something precious put it out of sight for a few weeks (eg in the loft), if it doesn't get missed they don't need it.

1. Make it clear and easy to put things where they belong. Labelled storage baskets/boxes etc with grouped items (eg dolls box, Lego box etc)

1. Incentives to keep tidy, 'if you tidy up all your toys everyday for a week I'll take you for an ice cream'

1. Consequences for not tidying, 'no iPad until your toys are tidy' or 'we can't go to the park until you've tidied' and walk away from tantrums or being ignored.

1. Toy time out - 'if you don't tidy up all the Lego is going away until you earn it back' if you get attitude/tantrums then more goes 'now the LOLs are going to toy time out too', keep going until you get the point across. They can earn them back as you see fit.

Consequences for actions, they would not be allowed to refuse to tidy up in school.

Large clear plastic box, anything that doesn't get tidied after asking gets put into the clear box and cannot be played with for x number of days. They can see it but cannot have it. Have a tidy up song, race the clock, all things to make tidying fun. Have a consistent time to do it every week day and on a weekend.

This is how I ended up with two teen boys with very tidy bedrooms.

Two things that might help: herd tidy. Gather family and go room to room together quickly putting stuff away. No more than 5 mins, makes a huge difference. That way they're under constant supervision . I've also programmed my kids that if I play the Benny Hill theme music we all dash about putting stuff away until it ends. Been doing it for more than a decade and it's pretty pavlovian now! We tend to do it just before tea so it's nice(r) once they're all in bed. It really helps to have fewer toys and a good storage system first. Ikea Trofast works for all the bitty stick in your foot stuff.

Advice needed- sorry to derail your thread op. If you have multiple dc but no playroom and they share some toys ie Sylvanian sets etc where do they live? (The toys, not the dc ) it’s like a never ending battle in our house over shared toys- and I just can’t justify buying three lots of everything

My DD (7) knows if she doesn’t tidy her toys up when I ask her to, I will tidy them. My version of tidying means it goes into a black bin bag and then into the wheelie bin.

Might sound harsh but DD knows I am fair. We all live in the house and we all have jobs to do. Opting out isn’t really going to happen without a definite consequence.

DD moaned about doing some dusting and polishing today. I told her I didn’t want to make dinner, or sort out the dishwasher or do the washing so should I just not bother? She got the message and then did a good job.

Firm and consistent rules and consequences are needed.

What do you do when they ignore you?

Tidying has to happen at a specific time. E.g. bedrooms get tidied after breakfast, sitting room In the last half an hour before bed, or just before dinner or whenever. And it is a whole house activity, with no opting out. They are 6 and 4, so they will need teaching and help, but they are definitely old enough to learn

Toy rotation is the way to go. As soon as a toy appears to be pushed to the side for a good few days, put it away of reach (attic, basement, whatever, just not toy box).

Gradually reduce the amount of toys you have around at a time , once you are down to a manageable amount, start rotating them. Bring one back in when they ask for it but put away the least popular one when you do.

@EdithGrantham

I'm not a parent yet so no idea if this will work at home but in the nursery and reception classes I have taught less is definitely more. We have smaller baskets out on shelves, all labelled up with photos of what goes in each one with another label on the shelf for where the basket goes, 6 max for each type of toy. So for instance Duplo I sort into 4 studs/8 studs/odd shapes/flat pieces/animals/people. We do have to teach how to tidy up and it takes all year but worth it in the end. Consequences for not tidying is that they don't get to play in that area for the rest of the day. At home you could do that set of toys gets put away, put in one big box then if they want it out they have to sort it first? As I said no idea if this will work as I am aware what children will do for their teacher and what they will do at home are two very different things

This is a fab post because,

1: it's great advice

And

2: you've very clearly said "this works in school, might not at home but worth a try".

Spot on with the tone - and great suggestions!!

What does 'scunnered' mean?

Time to turn to minimalism. It’s an eye-opener to the excesses in society and will do wonders for your children’s development.